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Old 03-12-2011, 07:15 PM   #21
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Prepare to tow or be towed.

I'm not really one to make any calls on what was right or wrong with the way that they towed us. I might mention that we were dealing with a great deal of current that was trying to suck us north into the narrows. I had nearly zero steerage as you might notice with me being so far off to starboard. Our boat is a soft chined, full keel. The Coasties even commented at how poorly she towed. That suprised me as the boat is actually very slippery while underway under her own power. Are full displacement vessels normally hard to tow, or was this all due to the strong current. The pictures that follow show when we were boarded by CG Canada*and the other shows when the Fast Rescue boat tied along our port side to manouver us into harbour. The Side tow worked very well in calmer water.

-- Edited by Rob on Saturday 12th of March 2011 08:17:33 PM
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Old 03-12-2011, 09:08 PM   #22
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Prepare to tow or be towed.

First of all, I have to say that those of you who would not tow due to your fear of litigation are certainly not the ones I would expect to respond to my distress call. I am sure you would cower in the v-berth and pretend you never heard the call. The reality is that I believe as a "Good Samaritan" you would have no more liability than a responder to a medical emergency. Regardless, I really wouldn't want you responding to my need anyway. If all you can think about is your liability, I doubt that your focus would be sufficiently on the task at hand. The final thought on the liability issue is that we are all responsible for responding to a vessel in distress. If for no other reason, because it's the right thing to do.

Secondly, I have to disagree with criticism of the towing method used by the Canadian Coast Guard. They are as well trained and well disciplined *a group as you would want responding to a maritime distress situation. The method as described is exactly the same as used by the US Coast Guard, and given the intelligent use of the method is as safe as it gets. I have practiced this exercise with the US Coast Guard at least a hundred times with varying sized vessels, and never was I uncomfortable with their decisions, and the safety of the tow. *Is it ever the ideal towing scenario. Probably not, but you find a happy medium between safety and getting the job done. Yes, if the situation gets to the point of not being practical, you deploy the anchor on the disabled vessel and transfer their crew to your boat.






-- Edited by Carey on Saturday 12th of March 2011 10:21:21 PM
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Old 03-12-2011, 09:16 PM   #23
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RE: Prepare to tow or be towed.

It may seem a little odd to some folks that we have bothered to take photos when we were not having our best day. But it has been our decission and choice over the years to document the Good Times, The Bad Times and the Ugly. Seems to make for interesting conversation years down the road!
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Old 03-12-2011, 09:48 PM   #24
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RE: Prepare to tow or be towed.

Quote:
Carey wrote:

First of all, I have to say that those of you who would not tow due to your fear of litigation are certainly not the ones I would expect to respond to my distress call. I am sure you would cower in the v-berth and pretend you never heard the call. The reality is that I believe as a "Good Samaritan" you would have no more liability than a responder to a medical emergency. Regardless, I really wouldn't want you responding to my need anyway. If all you can think about is your liability, I doubt that your focus would be sufficiently on the task at hand. The final thought on the liability issue is that we are all responsible for responding to a vessel in distress. If for no other reason, because it's the right thing to do.

-- Edited by Carey on Saturday 12th of March 2011 10:21:21 PM
I stongly agree with what Carey has to say.* Over the years, we have towed a number of distressed vessels to safe harbor.* I don't tow vessels from safe harbor to safe harbor.

*
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Old 03-12-2011, 10:16 PM   #25
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RE: Prepare to tow or be towed.

In BC, Canada, the Canadian Coast Guard is spread thin, and they frequently request help from private boats for other mariners in distress or needing a tow.

But, the Canadians are not as likely to sue.

In SE Alaska, a distress call will most likely be answered by locals, as they don't much like the US CG and mostly consider them to be 'kids from Kansas without a clue'.

However, a medical emergency will get a chopper to medivac the injured, and the locals really appreciate that.
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Old 03-12-2011, 10:45 PM   #26
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RE: Prepare to tow or be towed.

Quote:
Larry H wrote:

In BC, Canada, the Canadian Coast Guard is spread thin, and they frequently request help from private boats for other mariners in distress or needing a tow.

But, the Canadians are not as likely to sue.

In SE Alaska, a distress call will most likely be answered by locals, as they don't much like the US CG and mostly consider them to be 'kids from Kansas without a clue'.

However, a medical emergency will get a chopper to medivac the injured, and the locals really appreciate that.
I'll trust those "kids from kansas" with my a__ any time. Speaking from experience, the Coast Guard does a wonderful job of selecting the best kids and giving them them the best training one could hope for. *We were all born without experience. I would choose to be rescued by the young professionals over the old blowhards anytime.

*
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Old 03-13-2011, 01:16 AM   #27
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RE: Prepare to tow or be towed.

Carey,

There are many places in SE Alaska where the nearest CG water unit is 100 miles away and the local watermen are nearby. They listen and respond to channel 16.

Point was, those locals are not afraid or reluctant to help out in a emergency, and many times they would prefer to help each other.
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Old 03-13-2011, 07:07 AM   #28
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RE: Prepare to tow or be towed.

No disrespect to the Canadian Coast Guard. Your vessel was not the vessel in danger. The fast response vessel in the middle was in danger of being tripped.
You have a much heavier/powerful boat doing the towing (larger CG vsl), and a larger heavier boat on the stern (Robs boat) with a boat in the middle. THIS IS HOW boats trip! if Robs boat veers at all, this has the potential to pull this small boat over. Rob says he is in very strong currents. The fact that this smaller tow vsl has a tow post fwd of the engines,and above the gunwhale magnifies the situation. Robs deeper draft will overcome the small cg boat pulling it sideways until it trips. This is towing 101.
If Robs boat was in danger then I absolutely would do the same thing. I am not trying to second guess the Canadian Coast Guard. I am Ex Coast Guard myself (where do you think I learned not to do this?).
Part of the Coast Guards mission is to save life and property at sea- which they do very well.
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Old 03-13-2011, 10:05 AM   #29
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RE: Prepare to tow or be towed.

Jack,

I understand what you are saying, and in that case, those CG guys were risking that to pull Rob away from the dangerous Seymour Narrows. Brave dudes!
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Old 03-13-2011, 10:13 AM   #30
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RE: Prepare to tow or be towed.

Jack- I appreciate that you share you experience and knowledge with us. One of the main reasons that most of us get involved with this forum is to learn from others.
By the way we are from Alaska, and that what some of the folks have said about northerners being willing to assist is very true. Since we have relocated to the Puget Sound area we have noticed a little different attitude with boaters. I guess the main difference is that in Alaska we had no Boat Tow/Assist and for the most part the Coast Guard was hundreds of miles away. Locals were always ready willing and for the most part ready to assist. But I did often notice the boaters from the Lower48 were not so willing to assist. I know this from first hand experience. I would love to tell of a personal experience that I had with a well known group of Nordhavn cruisers that I personally witnessed "Turned and offered no assistance " in a very serious incident. Someday I will meet with someone from this group and have a talk with them!!

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Old 03-13-2011, 01:31 PM   #31
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RE: Prepare to tow or be towed.

I'm not sure why, but each year we are presented with an opportunity to lend a hand, and I always look at these as chances both to assist and to become a better seaman. We've pulled the bow of a 65' Scottish trawler to windward so they could exit a difficult moorage without sinking their neighbors in Poulsbo, retrieved a 28' sailboat that had drug its mooring in Tofino, rescued a 38' Hans Christian whose engine had failed and was within minutes of fetching up aground, towed an engineless sailboat into Victoria, and pulled an elderly gentleman out of the drink who had fallen off his boat north of Lopez Island. *

As long as it doesn't endanger my vessel, failure to help another mariner isn't a moral option, IMHO, and I don't have much regard for someone who puts convenience or fear of complications ahead of the safety of others. *Hope that doesn't sound too preachy, but there you are.
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Old 03-13-2011, 03:11 PM   #32
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Prepare to tow or be towed.

Carey and Larry H seem to be missing a point here. The Canadian Coast Guard removed the vessel from Peril. That is in the finest tradition of the sea. But, even the Canadian Coats guard is subject to physics - to think otherwise is foolish.It still put the small tow boat in a precarious position. Was it worth it? Probably yes! I'm am not going to debate Carey or Larry on the pros and cons of towing. I was a young Coast Guardsman at one time-if iI am now an old blowhard so be it. We all learn from this forum, if somebody sees the Coast guard do something and they assume it is ok, I would like to point out that it isn't safe. Prove me wrong. Rob said there were very strong currents. This sets the stage for disaster in this situation. Thank god nothing did happen!
I'm happy Alaskans are so eager to help. That is the way it should be. Anybody that has spent time on the water probably has helped, and been helped.

-- Edited by Sailor of Fortune on Sunday 13th of March 2011 03:16:01 PM
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Old 03-13-2011, 04:05 PM   #33
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RE: Prepare to tow or be towed.

Jack,

I respect your advice and experience. You have a whole lot more that I do when it comes to towing and CG work. Those small fast rescue boats are normally manned by one experienced full time Coast Guardsman and two part time summer guys. You can see that the helmsman is older that the other two crew. Perhaps the Guardsman in charge did not realize the danger, however, you would think the officer in charge of the cutter would know.

Ron,

When you said the CG small boat was being towed by the cutter, can you tell us how the small boat was being towed? Was it from the bow towing bit? Your photos don't show the actual tow hookup.


Seymour Narrows is one bad ass place, and has eaten many ships and boats over the years. Even near slack, the currents and swirls are awesome. I usually avoid Seymour and use the Dent-Yaculta rapids in the inner channels, when traveling up or down the coast.
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Old 03-13-2011, 04:23 PM   #34
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RE: Prepare to tow or be towed.

Looks to me like the CG did the tow in the quickest way possible. Looks like grave danger was so imminent the time to rig up the desired towing arrangement was not a good option.
They took the quick and shaky option to get the job done. The towing bit on the small CG boat was probably the weak link and the 110 could probably easily have pulled the bow bit right out. But they didn't AND they managed to tow the distressed vessel to safety. Perhaps this was a tremendous display of excellent seamanship accomplished w an undesirable rig in the nick of time. Rob, you never told me about this one.
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Old 03-13-2011, 05:40 PM   #35
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RE: Prepare to tow or be towed.

Eric- I don't want to bore people with bad adventures. These are simply some of the Low Lights from several years ago, as you kno we've had a ton of great cruising adventures over many years and several thousand miles of traveling Alaska and B.C. You kno nothing bad ever happens if you never leave the dock. I look foreward to another cruising season this summer.

Here's a picture of my wife and a couple of her friends "Gettin' Ready to Get a Toe Job"
They were very well prepared, lots of sun and cold drinks.

Rob and Anne
"Lady Anne" Willard 40 PH
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Old 03-14-2011, 12:32 PM   #36
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RE: Prepare to tow or be towed.

Quote:
Rob wrote:


Here's a picture of my wife and a couple of her friends "Gettin' Ready to Get a Toe Job"
Har har har!!
Very funny

You are out of control dude.

Go to your room.

SD*
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Old 04-05-2011, 02:04 PM   #37
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Prepare to tow or be towed.

I hope to install as towing package for the dink/run about, so they can be towed up tight to the swim*deck held in place by two side arm when in the marina and manuvering, and be able*to let out when out in open water.* the winch will be DC controller from the stern deck.* The commercial boat have a towing package in the tender, but the dink and run about are fiberglass, so a tow hitch receiver will be installed under the swim plat form that the package will be slide into.** I will be using regular*boat trailer parts/rollers/pads but make with alluminum.

The drawing is rough, which the machine and*fab shop just love as they deal in 1/1000 of an inch and I come in with a drawing*and say make it sort like this?* Actaully*I will tow the boats to the shop and have them fitted*up, so*the shop sort of understand what I am trying to do.* Another crazy Phil/Fill project.***

If ti does not work it will go in th pile with the other crazy Phil's ideas.*

What do you think?**Any ideas comments?*

*

*

**



-- Edited by Phil Fill on Tuesday 5th of April 2011 02:08:28 PM


-- Edited by Phil Fill on Tuesday 5th of April 2011 03:06:54 PM
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Old 04-05-2011, 03:57 PM   #38
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RE: Prepare to tow or be towed.

Healhustler/Tex on another site posted a picture of a Krogan like his, that had a tow package, except the tow package was attached to the dink and a hitch on the stern.* *I do not want to mess up the dink and dont need/want it on the transom all the time. So make it so it can be taken off/on and maybe taken apart to be stored.* ****
*
Might be best to just keep the dink up tight against the swim step?* The one I have seen are tailor make to keep the dink/tender right up close/solid so there is not give/play, since we are only going about 8 knots.* Probable a lot more complicated than it seems?* I sure would like to be able to tow the 19 ft run about with out to much trouble.* **
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Old 04-05-2011, 04:46 PM   #39
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Prepare to tow or be towed.

Why not just tie the tender alongside? Can you imagine trying to get this rig hooked up under your swim platform? You are asking for injuries and dings in both boats IMHO. With a bowline, spring and stern line properly adjusted on the dink/runabout you can do everything you need to do with the mother ship. Am I missing something here? What is this tow rig supposed to do other than get to a berth?

*No need to re-invent the wheel.


-- Edited by Sailor of Fortune on Tuesday 5th of April 2011 04:48:21 PM
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Old 04-05-2011, 10:33 PM   #40
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RE: Prepare to tow or be towed.

I sort of/pretty much*get it, Willy, but it would be nice to see it on video.
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