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Old 11-08-2014, 04:05 PM   #41
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Hi,

I'm moving from 50+ years of sailing to a Trawler, currently looking at a Ranger 29. My question is about total power usage:

She is equipped with a 16kBtu/hr and a 10 kBtu/hr reverse cycle, electric stove, microwave, hot water, and small electric space heater. This is far more power consumption than the two 30 Amp power cords or the 5kW genset will supply.

It seems that to cook on a hot day, I have to cool the boat, turn off the a/c and hot water, cook the food, and turn the a/c back on.

Is this typical of the drill?

Seems strange coming from an all-solar sailboat with propane heat, hot water, and cooking.

Should I covert to propane, pass on this boat, or eat cold food?

Thanks
This was the setup on my boat when we got her. Basically the boat was set up to be plugged in. Period.

Great, if your going to cruise like that, but pricey if not.
Probably the only area I really underestimated how much I would convert and still am.

I just hated the idea of running the generator on any day I ran the main engine.

See psneeld's comments
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Old 11-08-2014, 06:55 PM   #42
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Again some live aboard advice will be different than non-liveaboard...adjust accordingly.
Exactly. Admittedly, my perspective is influenced by being not just a full time liveaboard, but doing so out on a mooring. Even after we stopped full time cruising, we would anchor out for a week to 10 days non-stop. So some of these power management drills would become extremely tiresome to say the least. Ann is much, much less interested in such gymnastics than I. As in: zero. I liked that I could go on a business trip and leave her on the boat out on the mooring very happily and hassle free.
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Old 11-08-2014, 07:35 PM   #43
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Exactly. Admittedly, my perspective is influenced by being not just a full time liveaboard, but doing so out on a mooring. Even after we stopped full time cruising, we would anchor out for a week to 10 days non-stop. So some of these power management drills would become extremely tiresome to say the least. Ann is much, much less interested in such gymnastics than I. As in: zero. I liked that I could go on a business trip and leave her on the boat out on the mooring very happily and hassle free.
George - In your and Ann's position it is only correct to have electric management in as brainless/simple state as possible. I enjoy managing things aboard. But, Linda never stays alone on boat, such as Ann does... soooo...I get to play, with all I want to.
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Old 11-08-2014, 07:42 PM   #44
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When living aboard with guests and family running around, using appliances and trying to cook and shower and everything else under the sun....the last thing I want to do is play 20 questions on what can be used when and what cb needs to be flipped and is it the red one under the battery charger...etc...etc..

No thanks....if it can be plugged in...I want it to just work without my intervention.

Maybe for some it is like hand steering....but do anything long enough or have it pull you away from what you want to do and we will see just how much fun the hobby of load shedding is.

Obviously there are times at anchor on the inverter or even just managing one circuit it is going to be a juggle...but I just don't want to do it at the dock. The boat is my house and being a spoiled American I want the boat to act exactly the same.
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Old 11-08-2014, 08:00 PM   #45
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Most inverters do not have "load assist" this is a Victron perp. Most have "load shedding" but that is way different.
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Old 11-09-2014, 06:46 AM   #46
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>No thanks....if it can be plugged in...I want it to just work without my intervention.<


The larger boats (measured in meters not feet) solve the problem with a 100 or 200a dock power hose.

Only a few marinas have this size service , so expect $5.00 to $10.00 per ft per night PLUS metered electric.

>Most inverters do not have "load assist" this is a Victron perp.<

The Trace 2440 has this feature for the past 3-4 decades.
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Old 11-09-2014, 07:27 AM   #47
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The discussion of power management and the women on board has struck a chord with me. I am aware that my wife is "concerned" that she will overload the system and hasn't after many years become comfortable with what will and will not overload a single circuit - or frankly the concept of circuits.

Bay Pelican has been set up to live at anchor and doesn't have power limitations except when the generator is first turned on and the water heater, both chargers and the refrigeration are at maximum draw. The other time is when the water maker is in its last 30 minutes on 12 volt power.(Right before I turn the generator on.) During these times it is not a good idea to turn on the electric tea pot (1,000 watts). Yet Deb will ask every time she wants tea if it is OK to turn the tea pot on. The other constant issue is the use of two appliances at the same time, usually tea pot and toaster. Works fine but not on the same circuit. Never will get that concept across.

Amusing issue is the reaction when both tea pot and toaster are on at the same time and our large voltage meter in the galley drops (temporally) to 11.8 or so. Of course this isn't OK if the water maker is on as it will shut down, but that one condition seems to get lost in a general reaction.

After this posting I am thinking of doing a little more to have written guidelines as to what is OK, e.g. galley is one circuit, saloon cabinet is another, etc. Perhaps this will help.
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Old 11-09-2014, 07:36 AM   #48
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Let's see now...

I'm contemplating getting a marine electrician to completely re configure my 34' tri cabin Tollycraft boat's entire electric system/workings. I'd have every piece of electric service magic currently available installed. At conclusion my boat would be as well electrified as our home... maybe even better! Co$t - $10,000 to $18,000!

Or maybe I'll just relax and enjoy it as it currently is, all original and working fine... especially by employing a bit of thoughtful/careful power management.

I'll sleep on this a couple nights before making my decision... Let's see now... what do I currently believe my decision may be?? Hummm....

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Old 11-09-2014, 07:42 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by Bay Pelican View Post
The discussion of power management and the women on board has struck a chord with me. I am aware that my wife is "concerned" that she will overload the system and hasn't after many years become comfortable with what will and will not overload a single circuit - or frankly the concept of circuits.

Bay Pelican has been set up to live at anchor and doesn't have power limitations except when the generator is first turned on and the water heater, both chargers and the refrigeration are at maximum draw. The other time is when the water maker is in its last 30 minutes on 12 volt power.(Right before I turn the generator on.) During these times it is not a good idea to turn on the electric tea pot (1,000 watts). Yet Deb will ask every time she wants tea if it is OK to turn the tea pot on. The other constant issue is the use of two appliances at the same time, usually tea pot and toaster. Works fine but not on the same circuit. Never will get that concept across.

Amusing issue is the reaction when both tea pot and toaster are on at the same time and our large voltage meter in the galley drops (temporally) to 11.8 or so. Of course this isn't OK if the water maker is on as it will shut down, but that one condition seems to get lost in a general reaction.

After this posting I am thinking of doing a little more to have written guidelines as to what is OK, e.g. galley is one circuit, saloon cabinet is another, etc. Perhaps this will help.
OMG, Marty - Another one of the foibles in married life! But, ain't life grand!
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Old 11-09-2014, 07:44 AM   #50
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When I get the new 50A breaker panels, instead of having just the galley outlets and all others just on 2 circuits I am splitting up the boat into 5 or 6 with one dedicated outlet in the galley for electrical high powered, long term appliances like the micro or toaster oven.

One main reason for the upgrade is the 110 system is typical Taiwan. See Dave's thread on his ugly plug and mine isn't too far behind. So when you add safety to convenience and subtract out the cost of repair from upgrade, and for me there is no labor costs, so my costs are between $2-3,000. That includes all the power cords, and inlets plus fresh outlets and circuit breakers.

Sure any one circuit can still trip and the whole boat still only gets a bit over 12,000 watts...but it will act more like a house than a rustic cabin.

The less instructions I have to write down or discuss, the quality of boating rises...for me...I don't mind being captain, engineer and cabin boy all rolled into one, but my goal is to become equal time tourist instead of constantly on watch crew.

Then again, spoken like a long term liveaboard....
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Old 11-09-2014, 09:15 AM   #51
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Originally Posted by psneeld View Post
When I get the new 50A breaker panels, instead of having just the galley outlets and all others just on 2 circuits I am splitting up the boat into 5 or 6 with one dedicated outlet in the galley for electrical high powered, long term appliances like the micro or toaster oven.

One main reason for the upgrade is the 110 system is typical Taiwan. See Dave's thread on his ugly plug and mine isn't too far behind. So when you add safety to convenience and subtract out the cost of repair from upgrade, and for me there is no labor costs, so my costs are between $2-3,000. That includes all the power cords, and inlets plus fresh outlets and circuit breakers.

Sure any one circuit can still trip and the whole boat still only gets a bit over 12,000 watts...but it will act more like a house than a rustic cabin.

The less instructions I have to write down or discuss, the quality of boating rises...for me...I don't mind being captain, engineer and cabin boy all rolled into one, but my goal is to become equal time tourist instead of constantly on watch crew.

Then again, spoken like a long term liveaboard....
And, a much appreciated one to boot! errrrr boat!!!
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Old 11-09-2014, 09:17 AM   #52
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SORT-OF LIKE PUTTING YOUR ELECTRICAL SYSTEM ON AP
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