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Old 08-10-2016, 08:52 PM   #61
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My website articles and survey formats have been plagiarized often, but I actually have a life and don't care.

Never ever, ever believe anything you read. My younger son is somewhat of a sports celebrity and has often been interviewed for various sports magazines and TV shows. In his earlier years I was present at all his interiews. What a load of crap they printed. He never said half of the things they quoted him as saying. Get a life and move on.
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Old 08-10-2016, 09:05 PM   #62
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Jeffrey,

Yes I do live here (Alaska) and the only goats on islands in SE Alaska are on Baranof and Revillagigedo. Those goats were introduced by ADF&G as were the ones on Kodiak Island. Next Kayley's posts are dated in July of 2014 the same year I was in the same places. If her posts are from logs 20 years ago, then they shouldn't be dated as if they were current. I don't have a dog in the plagiarism argument. I do care about accuracy.

Tom
That date is the date of entry, not the date there. Jeffrey admits that's a site issue. One reason we're hesitant to post as we have thoughts on places we've been to but posting with today's date implies we're there now. We have made sure the few times we or others with us have posted older data to indicate when we were actually there.

So, you can't judge anything by the date of the post except that's when the post was made.

Now, I have a problem with people posting 10 year old data in general. I've seen it here where someone tossed out information on inlets or the hazards but then said in a later post that the last time they were there was 20 years ago.

The old posts are also out of sequence and you can't see a pattern as a result. I'd like to read chronologically by date observed. Sometimes you see rundown marina, rundown marina, new ownership, improved, very nice.

Have you posted on AC to correct the inaccuracy, posted the correct information?
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Old 08-10-2016, 09:19 PM   #63
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Old 08-10-2016, 09:21 PM   #64
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Wifey B: Never turn your back on a goat.
thought that was a Greek !
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Old 08-10-2016, 09:31 PM   #65
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Wifey B: Never turn your back on a goat.

http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-...national-park/
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Old 08-10-2016, 09:33 PM   #66
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Wifey B: I'm not messin' with any of these old goats.
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Old 08-10-2016, 09:57 PM   #67
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There is an expression about something "getting on my goat",meaning annoyance.
Years ago Monty Python published( no plagiarism involved) a list of 20 famous people with their comments about goats. All but Sir Walter Raleigh had said "nothing". He was attributed with saying "Getting cold, I must put on a goat" which the publication noted was "(Possibly Misheard)".
Which is no sillier than the publisher responses above.
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Old 08-10-2016, 10:19 PM   #68
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Yes I do live here (Alaska) and the only goats on islands in SE Alaska are on Baranof and Revillagigedo.
Perfect. I hereby crown you king of goat knowledge for all of the Alaskan coast. If you'd like, I can change your captain name to KnowsGoats.

So now do your part and update the information if accuracy is so important about the location of goats. That's how it works. The data is the collection from the knowledge of the entire community. It's not one individual's view. The details get combined among all who are interested in making the information better for all.

It's easy to take pot shots about any published information. ActiveCaptain is one of the few boating databases where instead of complaining, you can fix it for everyone.
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Old 08-10-2016, 10:44 PM   #69
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[QUOTE=Jeffrey S;468499]Perfect. I hereby crown you king of goat knowledge for all of the Alaskan coast. If you'd like, I can change your captain name to KnowsGoats.

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Old 08-11-2016, 02:26 AM   #70
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There's a great joke about a Greek guy in a bar.......the punch line is"one goat! just one goat."
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Old 08-11-2016, 06:07 AM   #71
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Thanks Andy, we needed a bit of light relief there.

I've been following this thread mainly because it was reported, and out of a sort of fascinated horror in a way. I must say I am puzzled as to how observations of mere fact, regarding descriptions of places and conditions on waterways, which do change over time anyway, and are hardly products therefore of what one might call, 'creative intellectual inspiration, can actually be plagiarised..? I suppose as a technical interpretation of the term it is possible, but really...
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Old 08-11-2016, 07:09 AM   #72
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Songwriters are getting constantly accused of copying simply because they have eight bars that are very similar to another older song or their basic theme is the same. To think that with all the music published over the years, what I write today won't remind one of a previous song isn't realistic. As an example, how many ways can you express being a jilted lover? One of the most popular topics and they all have similarities.

If it's in a Country genre, there's probably a hound, maybe a jail cell, a pick-up truck, and a train ride involved somehow.

If it's Western genre, probably a horse (or a mule), a campfire, the moon (and/or the stars), maybe a mountain range...

Blues: sawdust (on the barroom floor), broken pool cues, three part names (physical affliction/weapon of choice/diminutive name: Blind Shotgun Pervis, etc.), and a jail cell.

Pop... well, you get the picture.



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Old 08-11-2016, 09:06 AM   #73
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.......... Being serious, if you're cruising over thousands of miles, you're likely above average in intelligence and skills. Darwin's laws would have eliminated you from cruising otherwise..........
I wouldn't bet on that. I have met some long time cruisers who were as dumb as a wagon track. Remember, there is usually more than one person on the boat and only one needs to be smart enough to get from point A to point B.


As for this thread, it seems no more than an attack on Active Captain to me. Why would the OP be concerned if some of the AC posts seem to be copied from another publication? They are not his posts. And why, if he has a reason to be concerned, did he decide to make this a public issue instead of notifying Jeffery privately?


One of the problems with the Internet is that it has made it far to easy for someone to bash another person or company for no good reason.
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Old 08-11-2016, 11:41 AM   #74
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I wouldn't bet on that. I have met some long time cruisers who were as dumb as a wagon track. Remember, there is usually more than one person on the boat and only one needs to be smart enough to get from point A to point B.


As for this thread, it seems no more than an attack on Active Captain to me. Why would the OP be concerned if some of the AC posts seem to be copied from another publication? They are not his posts. And why, if he has a reason to be concerned, did he decide to make this a public issue instead of notifying Jeffery privately?


One of the problems with the Internet is that it has made it far to easy for someone to bash another person or company for no good reason.
It would have been much easier for the OP and others to have just contacted through AC and to have made posts of their own to either point out attributions or to correct information. But then that wouldn't have gotten all this attention.
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Old 08-11-2016, 11:45 AM   #75
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It would have been much easier for the OP and others to have just contacted through AC and to have made posts of their own to either point out attributions or to correct information. But then that wouldn't have gotten all this attention.

In fairness the OP stated and Jeff affirmed he was contacted privately before all this.
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Old 08-11-2016, 11:49 AM   #76
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I've taken a couple of seminars given by the folks at Waggoners and AC has been brought up by the students both times, with the presenters downplaying it as a legit info source compared to Waggoners. Yet the students would disagree as many voiced positive experiences and were AC contributors. Nothing wrong with dissing the competition. That's what I think this thread is about too, as Sam recently led a Waggoners flotilla to Alaska. I use both sources, and others too, and will continue to do so.
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Old 08-11-2016, 12:05 PM   #77
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In fairness the OP stated and Jeff affirmed he was contacted privately before all this.
Contacted privately through TF, not AC, though. And now the follow up publicly on TF.
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Old 08-11-2016, 12:17 PM   #78
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I've taken a couple of seminars given by the folks at Waggoners and AC has been brought up by the students both times, with the presenters downplaying it as a legit info source compared to Waggoners. Yet the students would disagree as many voiced positive experiences and were AC contributors. Nothing wrong with dissing the competition. That's what I think this thread is about too, as Sam recently led a Waggoners flotilla to Alaska. I use both sources, and others too, and will continue to do so.
That's what I see here as well. I like Waggoners. I used it when in it's area. However, it covers a very limited area and is by no means complete for that area. I find dissing the competition very unprofessional, whoever it is. Waggoners and AC are very different. Neither precludes the value of the other.

One thing too is that whether it's Waggoners or Great Lakes Cruising Guides which are more currently on my mind and in my hands, they are the opinion of one person. I don't care who that person is, I like more opinions. Someone tells me a restaurant is great or it gets a great review, I still will check Yelp and Google and Trip Advisor to see what the average person thinks. So if using a guide, I'm also going to check AC. And if reading about a restaurant in the guide, I'll check other places as well. Even if reading about an attraction, I'll do so.

Your success or failure as a business will not be determined by your competition but will be by what you do. Now, that doesn't mean not to look at and follow your competitors and look at things you might do better, but simply to spend more time on your own product and service than worrying about them or trying to criticize them.

A simple statement by a Waggoners presenter along the lines of "most of our users find our guide to be all they need or want, but we do have some who also look on AC, primarily to read the comments of other boaters regarding places we talk of in our guides."
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Old 08-11-2016, 12:19 PM   #79
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Contacted privately through TF, not AC, though. And now the follow up publicly on TF.

Considering the rancor on this open thread and the insults unfairly tossed one can only imagine how productive it would be to contact via AC.

Complete transparency: I've dealt with all these parties from the other side of the screen in the past, you haven't. So let's stop pretending any of these parties are some innocent victims of unfair attacks. If that's the case I'm the Easter bunny. Make no mistake, this is exactly how all 3 of them conduct business.
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Old 08-11-2016, 12:31 PM   #80
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Let me set the record straight. I am not speaking on behalf of Waggoner. I am not employed by Waggoner and I haven't been for many months. I led a flotilla using the Waggoner name at the beginning of the summer. I have not and will not do any further work for Waggoner, and it's not fair to portray my personal comments as an ex-employee as speaking for the publication.

I use ActiveCaptain every day. I like it. When I lead flotilla trips, I show people ActiveCaptain in Coastal Explorer. I think AC is better than relying on copied information.

I contacted Jeff privately both via email and TF. We had a dialogue and I wasn't satisfied with his response, so I was curious what other people thought. Clearly, this discussion has hit a nerve for many.

Several days ago I messaged Kayley on ActiveCaptain asking a simple question about a location she wrote about in a review but didn't place on the map. I haven't heard back. If she really has been there, she'll be able to point it out on a map. The problem is there are enough instances where Kayley's reviews don't make sense to people who have been to the location that I question whether Kayley is an actual person. Jeff or Kayley, please prove me wrong! If I am wrong, I apologize, and will request this thread be removed.

Crossing Dixon Entrance now...losing cell service.
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