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Old 01-16-2013, 12:26 AM   #41
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In the PNW I wouls not go of 60 ft and/or or 50 tons as moorage and lifts are very limited. there are boat/trawler in the 50 to 60 ft that have 3+ staterooms, 2 baths, 400+ gallon water tanks, 1000+ gallon fuel, which have the range and stability for coastal ocean cruising. However, not many boats, even Nordhavn, Krogan, Selen, seahorse really are designed for crossing an ocean. Sure a few have done, but there are other more boats designed and more capable, but they also cost more, or they a commercial grade. The only Nordhavn that really has a good proven record is their original 62 ft explorer trawler.
Really? not designed for ocean crossing?,

It doesn't take but a minute to find blogs on numerous Nordhavn, Selene Krogen, "trawlers" that have and are crossing oceans even as I write this. Nordhavn made it's mark as a "passagemaker" with the N46, the big boats came along in their wake. . Ship a yacht to exotic places?? sure but look at the cost of shipping via Dockwise and you will find it will buy a LOT of fuel. Any yacht worth shipping will still need to be well found and ocean worthy with 95% of the same equipment so there isn't a huge savings. Are the Nordhavn, Selene, Diesel Ducks etc. reasonable boats for most of us... nope they are rather costly.. but any passagemaker that is 45' plus is costly. If you want to go for less cost stay near the beach and stick with a typical semi displacement " trawler " like most everybody here.
Below is a great blog of a N%& that did a 13000+ mile pacific cruise in just short of a year.. including the Aleutians. Of course that is after doing Chile, The Pacific, The Galapagos, in previous years.


Welcome to Nordhavn.com - Power Thats Oceans Apart

HOLLYWOOD
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:36 AM   #42
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I will simply answer the young lady's question.

Kadey Krogen 54PH. It will spend every penny of that $400k but I think it is more offshore worthy than most of the new ones!!!...and quite likely to house your family.
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Old 01-16-2013, 11:11 AM   #43
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Tom, you provided an impressive list of truly capable boats but I hardly see where they would make the stated budget for this thread.



I think the "passage maker" design requirement is what is keeping this dream from becoming a reality sooner rather than later. Yachtworld shows several boats meeting GG's basic requirements, including price point, when you set aside the true passage maker desire that is.
CP

You missed my "assuming he has the $$" lead in. I asked the other TF members what other boats are out there that GG could use for blue water passage making and has the capacity (65') to carry the family.

Boating requires a business outlook too, so lets be honest and say:

GG, you must spend about $1 to 1.5 million to join the blue water cruising club of around 65'. Otherwise stick to much more affordable 65' coastal cruisers."
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Old 01-16-2013, 12:23 PM   #44
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G, you must spend about $1 to 1.5 million to join the blue water cruising club of around 65'.

Unless you are willing to go under sail, , that should cut the cost of an excellent used blue water to well under 1/2 million.

Remember most sail are built with the required scantlings for blue water from the start.

With power its 1 boat in 1000 that might be ocean crossing.

Really depends on weather 3 stories with an oxygen tent on top is the dream, or the voyage.


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Old 01-16-2013, 12:30 PM   #45
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FF, you're killin' me ova heya!!!
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Old 01-16-2013, 03:26 PM   #46
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Well, you can cross an ocean in anything. What's-his-name did it in his little Gypsy Moth sailboat, Mark does it in his monster horizontal high rises, and all sorts of crap from the Japanese tsunami is washing up on our coast including containers, barrels, and a dock.

So I think the what-kind-of-boat question is pretty irrelevant in comparison to the question, what kind of boater is best for long, open ocean passagemaking?

And from my very limited experience and observation in open ocean (but not long distance) boating in Hawaii for a lot of years, it takes a very special kind of person to a) want to do it, b) be able to afford to do it, and c) have the skills, fortitude, and perseverance to be able to do it.

And if a, b, and c are not present in spades, the undertaking will most likely be a failure. At best the attempt will never occur, at worst it will occur with undesirable or downright fatal consequences.

Based solely on what I've been reading here, GG has plenty of "a" and pretty much none of "b" or "c."

"B" is a consequence of one's circumstances so the only person who can affect that is her.

"C" however, is not something that one doesn't have and then the next day does have. You don't get it from taking classes or reading books or talking to people, even if they're people with lots of "c." You get it by doing it and doing it a lot.

In preparation for an upcoming video project featuring an absolutely amazing 16 year old violinist (she came in third in the world in a recent event), my musical director mentioned yesterday a statement by somebody famous that to become truly expert at something it takes 10,000 hours of doing it. Now I have no idea if this is even remotely valid but the point certainly is.

But you have to start with hour number one, and that is where GG currently is. So if she wants to realize her current dream of long-range passagemaking, she's got a hell of a lot to learn and to practice before she has any hope of making the dream a reality.

Our violinist started at age four when she picked up a violin and and started messing around with it. GG has to pick up a boat and start messing around with it. Any boat at this point. So all of the advice that has been given earlier in this thread of the smartest way to get into boating at this stage of her non-experience is well worth heeding.

Because if you don't have that "10,000 hours" of experience, your chances of success at long range passagemaking are, in my opinion, pretty much zero no matter what boat you buy.
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Old 01-16-2013, 03:33 PM   #47
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Greetings,
Mr. Marin. I would suggest closer to 20K hours to become "expert". Proficient, depending on the person, considerably less time.
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Old 01-16-2013, 03:38 PM   #48
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In preparation for an upcoming video project featuring an absolutely amazing 16 year old violinist (she came in third in the world in a recent event), my musical director mentioned yesterday a statement by somebody famous that to become truly expert at something it takes 10,000 hours of doing it. Now I have no idea if this is even remotely valid but the point certainly is.
I remember hearing about a guy that is going to try the 10,000 hours theory. If I recall correctly he quit his job and is hoping to become a pro golfer. I've already mastered professional goofing-off. Practice, practice, practice.
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Old 01-16-2013, 06:12 PM   #49
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Some very capable, but non boating experienced, people we know took possession of their N57 in Dana Point and proceeded immediatley to go on extended journeys and eventually on to Europe. They had some periodic Captain help from time to time. Now a few brief years later they are considered by many consumate people, experts. How I remember stories of how quickly Kansas farm boys became fighter pilots in WWII.

I, possibly misguidedly, for one appreciate how common sense, mechanical experience, dedication and smarts can quickly move a newbie along.
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Old 01-16-2013, 07:10 PM   #50
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A lot of B can substitute for a lack of C.
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Old 01-16-2013, 07:23 PM   #51
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... my musical director mentioned yesterday a statement by somebody famous that to become truly expert at something it takes 10,000 hours of doing it.
Malcolm Gladwell, Outliers: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outliers_(book)
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Old 01-17-2013, 08:47 AM   #52
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I always wondered how many hours we needed?
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Old 01-27-2013, 04:21 PM   #53
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I first met GalaxyGirl on the Cruiser's Forum where the members are a bit "earthy" as compared to this forum. From my short time here I find folks who have applied the same zeal in their working professional life to boating. GG knows what she wants, and is trying to sift through other's experiences to narrow down what might work for her. Some people, myself included, are dreamers seeking to realize those dreams. No doubt she needs some boating experience, but with her tenacity, I think she will do it. Too bad she didn't have sailing experience on the parent's boat as I did when young. Later in life I cruised solo and discovered I really liked being on a passage by myself, so much in fact that I sold my Cal 40 and entered California Maritime Academy in my mid 40's. A bit of an adjustment having to lock up my home and live on campus as required, having some upperclassman young enough to be my son, giving me demerits for a belt buckle that wasn't shiny enough. I got through it, graduated 3rd in my class, and have enjoyed sailing on container, break bulk, and drill ships. I am on the fence now as to another sailboat or power boat. I share with GG the desire for whatever vessel to be ocean capable, so that I can re-visit the ports I wanted to spend more time in, and of course visit areas that are new to me. I like GG's fortitude, she is going to do this, and is not another dreamer that doesn't. I look forward to meeting GG in that pristine anchorage we both dream of someday.
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Old 01-27-2013, 08:03 PM   #54
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Thanks for all the informative responses.

Anyone here have a Hat LRC that has crossed? I am reading conflicting opinions as to weather the 65' Hat was built for transatlantic or not.

How long do you figure a trawler would take to cross?
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Old 01-27-2013, 08:18 PM   #55
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GG,

My friends on the Nordhavn 43 plan on 150 nm daily runs. So if you ran at the same average speed of 6.25 kt, then Baltimore to Gibraltar in a tad over 23 days. Sound like fun?
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Old 01-27-2013, 08:46 PM   #56
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How long does it take a trawler to cross?

Time = Distance/Speed

My opinion is you would be a danger to yourself, and to everyone aboard your vessel if you attempted a Ocean crossing, unless you hired a professional crew. Just my opinion.

The problem, as evidenced by your questions, is that you donít know what you donít know.

There are hundreds of books about crossing oceans in small boats. You should read some. A few by Robin Knox-Johnson, or the Pardeys, or even J. Slocum, might change your mind.

The problem with Cruisers Forum is that the group answer to the post ďI donít know anything about boats, but Iím planning to sail around the world.Ē is ďGo for it!Ē

Best of luck,

Mike.
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Old 01-27-2013, 10:25 PM   #57
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GG,

My friends on the Nordhavn 43 plan on 150 nm daily runs. So if you ran at the same average speed of 6.25 kt, then Baltimore to Gibraltar in a tad over 23 days. Sound like fun?
YES!!! Sounds amazing. Can't wait for the day when I can cruise Europe on my own boat. May take me a few years, and maybe some blood, sweat and tears to get there, but I know for certain it will be a million times worth the wait.
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Old 01-28-2013, 12:11 AM   #58
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GG

Follow the thread about the 6000 mile trip to Brazil. BTW, how would you get your family into a N43? Your boat keeps getting smaller.
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Old 01-28-2013, 05:53 AM   #59
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Here are two Hatteras owner groups you can tap into for direct knowledge. I have a friend with a 58LRC whose prior owner circumnavigated.

Welcome to the Hatteras Long Range Cruiser Club

Hatteras Owners Forum & Gallery
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Old 01-28-2013, 06:19 AM   #60
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"There are hundreds of books about crossing oceans in small boats. You should read some. A few by Robin Knox-Johnson, or the Pardeys, or even J. Slocum, might change your mind."

Except for the Marn Marie , and one or two others most of the thousands of circumnavigations have been under SAIL.


Sailors don't usually travel in packs with electricians ready to swim over and repair their boats , mid ocean.
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