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09-10-2019, 03:41 PM
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#1
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Senior Member
City: Corpus Christi
Vessel Name: Moonstruck
Vessel Model: 1990 Californian/Carver 48 MY
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 245
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Survey note, aft fuel tank not used, status unknown
Looking at my 3rd 48 Californian MY, this one the current owner and PO, did not use the aft tank. Should I consider this a red flag? Is this something I should negotiate over? Its seem this would be important. Isn't balancing the fuel and issue? I plan on running this boat up and down the East Coast.
On my cat it wasn't a big issue to remove the tanks and clean it them. On these motor yacht's is tank cleaning a big issue?. I have my own external fuel polisher with Racor filters and I've always pump fuel from can's into my tanks thru this process. I'm not sure I'm going to be able to do that on this motor yacht as the volume of fuel is much greater. I've always been rather anal about fuel going in my boats.
The Brockerts
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09-10-2019, 03:48 PM
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#2
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Guru
City: Here
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 2,940
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Was the tank left empty or does it contain decades old fuel ?
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09-10-2019, 04:21 PM
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#3
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Senior Member
City: Corpus Christi
Vessel Name: Moonstruck
Vessel Model: 1990 Californian/Carver 48 MY
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 245
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No sure, fuel gauge reads empty, but I'm guessing some/little old fuel, no one seems to know, and it's been that way for atleast 2 1/2 + years, probably more like 5-7 years. So anything in there can't be good.
The Brockerts
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09-10-2019, 04:24 PM
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#4
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Senior Member
City: Bellingham, WA
Vessel Name: Excellent Adventure
Vessel Model: 1995 Jefferson Ker Shine 45
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 395
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Can you get a camera down to take a look?
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09-10-2019, 04:42 PM
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#5
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Guru
City: Gig Harbor
Vessel Name: Kinship
Vessel Model: North Pacific 43
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 9,046
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Brockerts
Looking at my 3rd 48 Californian MY, this one the current owner and PO, did not use the aft tank. Should I consider this a red flag? Is this something I should negotiate over? Its seem this would be important. Isn't balancing the fuel and issue? I plan on running this boat up and down the East Coast.
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I would consider the aft tank to be non-funtional until proven otherwise. A 48 Californian MY with a non-functional tank is worth less than the same boat with all tanks functional. If you made the offer on the boat before finding out the unknown status of the aft fuel tank, then I would renegotiate to have them get the tank in good shape, or lower the purchase price to reflect replacing the tank.
If you knew about the tank issue when you made the offer, then it is just a matter of deciding how much you want to invest in cleaning/replacing that tank.
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09-10-2019, 04:43 PM
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#6
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Guru
City: Edgewater, MD
Vessel Name: Catalina Jack
Vessel Model: Defever 44
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,585
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When we bought our DeFever 44 the aft tank was decommissioned. No matter because the rwo saddle tanks carry more than 700 gallons. After purchase we had it removed as it was rusted badly. When the top was cut away about four inches of "mud" was found. That mud I think was the dead bodies of fuel bugs. We absolutely do not miss having the aft tank as with have plenty of capacity remaining. Plus, why drag around another 2,000 pounds of fuel to go where.
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09-10-2019, 04:57 PM
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#7
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Moderator Emeritus
City: Au Gres, MI
Vessel Name: Black Dog
Vessel Model: Formula 41PC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 21,187
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How hard is it to access the unused tank? Can you get it out and a new one in? What capacity is there without the tank? If you like the boat negotiate the price with having the tank replaced. Then enjoy the boat.
__________________
Boat Nut:
If you are one there is no explanation necessary.
If you aren’t one, there is no explanation possible.
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09-10-2019, 06:15 PM
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#8
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Senior Member
City: Corpus Christi
Vessel Name: Moonstruck
Vessel Model: 1990 Californian/Carver 48 MY
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 245
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I had a quick survey of a few hours before I decided to even haulout and have full survey. I've chased to many boats at this time not to do a prelim survey. I'm doing a full survey next week and will get a camera down there or atleast find out more about the status of the tank.
Thanks for the info.
Then Brockerts
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09-10-2019, 08:32 PM
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#9
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Guru
City: Boston
Vessel Name: Adelante
Vessel Model: IG 30
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 1,609
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Somebody is not telling someone everything.
The only reason I would close off a tank would be a leak. Borescope would be a start but baffles might prevent a complete view. If there are inspection plates I would insist on removing them as part of survey. There is always going to be a certain amount of unreachable fuel. If the bottom of the tank is an inch of black gunk I would get a quote for replacement.
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09-10-2019, 08:48 PM
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#10
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Moderator Emeritus
City: Au Gres, MI
Vessel Name: Black Dog
Vessel Model: Formula 41PC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 21,187
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I would just proceed on the assumption that the fuel tank is bad and ask for an appropriate price reduction.
__________________
Boat Nut:
If you are one there is no explanation necessary.
If you aren’t one, there is no explanation possible.
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09-10-2019, 09:11 PM
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#11
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Senior Member
Vessel Model: Currently Boatless
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 397
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The best way to tell if the tank is bad is just cap off the inlets and outlets. Run an air line to one inlet and pump 2 to 3 psi air to the tank. If the pressure drops significantly over an hour, then you got a leak. This will find any pinhole leak that a scope will not see.
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09-10-2019, 09:50 PM
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#12
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Moderator Emeritus
City: Au Gres, MI
Vessel Name: Black Dog
Vessel Model: Formula 41PC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 21,187
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It may also force out any diesel that might be left in the tank.
__________________
Boat Nut:
If you are one there is no explanation necessary.
If you aren’t one, there is no explanation possible.
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09-10-2019, 10:17 PM
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#13
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Guru
City: Sydney
Vessel Name: Sojourn
Vessel Model: Integrity 386
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 13,329
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Isn`t the obvious step 1 asking the PO why he doesn`t use the tank? He might lie,he might not. Then confirm it somehow. If he lies, reconsider any other PO representations you relied on.
__________________
BruceK
2005 Integrity 386 "Sojourn"
Sydney Australia
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09-11-2019, 05:32 AM
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#14
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Guru
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 22,553
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Could just be the outlet is partially plugged , passes enough for a noisemaker , but not a larger engine.
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09-11-2019, 07:57 AM
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#15
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Guru
City: Tampa, FL
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 672
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dhays
I would consider the aft tank to be non-funtional until proven otherwise.
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This ^^^^^
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09-11-2019, 08:02 AM
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#16
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Guru
City: gulf coast
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 3,440
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Everyone is assuming that there is something wrong with the tank. An unused tank does not necessarily mean problems. Many boats have too much tankage for how the owner uses the boat. If it was my boat I too would have left the tank empty, after cleaning it.
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09-11-2019, 08:30 AM
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#17
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Guru
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 5,037
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bayview
Everyone is assuming that there is something wrong with the tank. An unused tank does not necessarily mean problems. Many boats have too much tankage for how the owner uses the boat. If it was my boat I too would have left the tank empty, after cleaning it.
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I probably wouldn't use it either. I would likely convert that space to fresh water.
__________________
Jay Leonard
Ex boats: 1983 40 Albin trunk cabin, 1978 Mainship 34 Model 1
New Port Richey, Fl
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09-11-2019, 09:12 AM
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#18
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Guru
City: Signal Mtn., TN
Vessel Name: Stella Maris
Vessel Model: Defever 44
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 2,742
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The PO didn’t use our aft tank for reasons he never specified. For some, it might simply be the notion of sleeping over a fuel tank.
We had it inspected—it was immaculate and not leaking—and now use it as a day tank. Of our three tanks, it’s by far the easiest to access and view. An onboard “polisher” very likely won’t clean a fouled tank, but you won’t know it needs it until you look. Some don’t have a need for an aft tank, but I’d make any offer contingent on proof that the aft tank is functional.
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09-11-2019, 10:21 AM
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#19
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TF Site Team
City: Westerly, RI
Vessel Name: N/A
Vessel Model: 1999 Mainship 350 Trawler
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 4,162
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I wouldn't immediately assume there is is an issue.
What is the total fuel capacity of all tanks?
What is the cruising burn rate?
I carry 300 gallons (2 x 150) and we both work full time. We live in New England and have, effectively, a 5 month season. The tanks are balanced port and Stbd and must contain the same amount of fuel, otherwise, the boat will list. I struggle to find ways to burn the entire seasons worth of fuel.
If I could isolate one tank and not introduce a list, I would.
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09-11-2019, 10:47 AM
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#20
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Guru
City: Palmetto
Vessel Name: Wanderlust
Vessel Model: 1999 Jefferson Rivanna 52'
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 713
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bayview
Everyone is assuming that there is something wrong with the tank. An unused tank does not necessarily mean problems. Many boats have too much tankage for how the owner uses the boat. If it was my boat I too would have left the tank empty, after cleaning it.
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That was the situation with our Jefferson, too. The saddle tanks hold 600 gallons, combined. The aft tanks (in the lazarette) hold a combined 135 gallons. The PO never used the aft tanks. The main tanks have about 1000 mile range, even with reserve. Still, I'm thinking about cleaning them and putting them back into service.
__________________
John Easley
USCG 100 ton Master
1999 Jefferson Rivanna 52’
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