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Old 05-04-2014, 11:21 PM   #21
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Old 05-04-2014, 11:28 PM   #22
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Greetings,
Two self rescued groundings (hard sand) and a really good thump all within three hours in one day just north of New Smyrna (ICW). Poop occurs.
Rock House Creek, or intersection of the ICW and Inlet Channel?
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Old 05-05-2014, 12:07 AM   #23
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Well, it took me twice before I got it.

What I'm still trying to figure out is how nobody ever runs aground if they just followed those 8 simple steps. Especially since a current tide table is not on the list.
Capt.Bill - Please note I carefully included caveat phrase "... jus bout taint no..." in my last portion on post #5; which means there is still a chance of grounding even when/if my eight (8) simple “Old Salt” rules are followed.

And, I agree - current tide table is another good item to be aware of. That said... irrespective of tide level - the same 8ight items I list could help keep ya off the bottom during highs or lows!!

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Old 05-06-2014, 02:59 AM   #24
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Old 05-06-2014, 07:34 AM   #25
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Greetings,
Mr. M. The best I can figure out from AC and remember it was the Halifax River where it joins Ponce de Leon cut. We came north the following year through the same area and didn't see less that 10'. Good ole CoE.
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Old 05-06-2014, 10:28 AM   #26
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Greetings,
Mr. M. The best I can figure out from AC and remember it was the Halifax River where it joins Ponce de Leon cut. We came north the following year through the same area and didn't see less that 10'. Good ole CoE.
RTF, I had the fortunate happening of being asked by the USCG at St. Augustine Marine on the Sebastion River if I would move my boat back for them to dock next to the haulout slip. I said that I would do that if he would update me on the trouble spots around. He laughed and said that it was a deal.

One of the trouble areas that he noted was the area from the entrance to the North Channel of Ponce Inlet, Rock House Creek, and the South entrance just above New Smyrna Beach. He said that the currents run so fast in there that the sand is shifting constantly. Out nearer the inlet you can see the weekend boaters anchored and playing on the spoil bank beaches.
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Old 05-06-2014, 11:19 AM   #27
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Mr. M. 29*05.629'N 080*58.897'W I think... When we approached the area in question and slowed to an idle, we were greeted by a multitude of markers that was, at the time, mind numbing-seemed like 15 or 20 with no obvious route. Charts were no help as they showed 4 or 5 markers. We attempted to navigate through the maze twice (hence the two self rescued occurrences) to no avail. A larger cruiser in the 70' range approached from the south. We backed well off the channel and carefully observed what route he used and after he passed, we were successful in our passage. Shortly thereafter we experienced a solid bump, in the channel, about half way southbound in the P de L cut. It's all good.
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Old 05-06-2014, 11:46 AM   #28
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Perhaps the fellow needed more powerful thrusters:



....

With shifting bottoms/silting, charts updated every few decades, and postponed dredging, it's a question of who hasn't gone aground in the SF estuary.
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Old 05-06-2014, 11:47 AM   #29
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Greetings,
Mr. M. 29*05.629'N 080*58.897'W I think... When we approached the area in question and slowed to an idle, we were greeted by a multitude of markers that was, at the time, mind numbing-seemed like 15 or 20 with no obvious route. Charts were no help as they showed 4 or 5 markers. We attempted to navigate through the maze twice (hence the two self rescued occurrences) to no avail. A larger cruiser in the 70' range approached from the south. We backed well off the channel and carefully observed what route he used and after he passed, we were successful in our passage. Shortly thereafter we experienced a solid bump, in the channel, about half way southbound in the P de L cut. It's all good.
Success often happens in boating, when as I say lastly in post # 5:

h. Open Eyes that don't fixate on equipment screens and that consistently survey all surroundings and boat portions!
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Old 05-06-2014, 12:00 PM   #30
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Capt.Bill - Please note I carefully included caveat phrase "... jus bout taint no..." in my last portion on post #5; which means there is still a chance of grounding even when/if my eight (8) simple “Old Salt” rules are followed.
Guess I should have read it 3 times.
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Old 05-06-2014, 12:41 PM   #31
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Greetings,
Mr. Art. Agreed. Open eyes. I'm NOT a magenta line cruiser. I DO use the magenta line as a very rough guide as to where the channel might be. Charts are always on deck and used as an adjunct to electronics. The Admiral, after decades of telling me where to go, is the navigator. She uses a Post-It note flag on the chart to denote where we are so I can quickly glance and get an overview. Post it Arrow Printed Flags 12 Sign Here Assorted Colors 30 Flags Per Pad Pack Of 4 Pads by Office Depot Easily moved in a timely fashion.
In this particular circumstance it appeared a buoy tender barge had haphazardly dumped their load just to confuse. There were a sh*tload of markers. If ever in doubt, I idle through areas with a close eye on the sonar and two close eyes on surroundings. As I said before, poop occurs.
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Old 05-06-2014, 02:25 PM   #32
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Greetings,
Mr. Art. Agreed. Open eyes. I'm NOT a magenta line cruiser. I DO use the magenta line as a very rough guide as to where the channel might be. Charts are always on deck and used as an adjunct to electronics. The Admiral, after decades of telling me where to go, is the navigator. She uses a Post-It note flag on the chart to denote where we are so I can quickly glance and get an overview. Post it Arrow Printed Flags 12 Sign Here Assorted Colors 30 Flags Per Pad Pack Of 4 Pads by Office Depot Easily moved in a timely fashion.
In this particular circumstance it appeared a buoy tender barge had haphazardly dumped their load just to confuse. There were a sh*tload of markers. If ever in doubt, I idle through areas with a close eye on the sonar and two close eyes on surroundings. As I said before, poop occurs.
Don't get me wrong RT

I was meaning to praise you for this in your post: "A larger cruiser in the 70' range approached from the south. We backed well off the channel and carefully observed what route he used and after he passed, we were successful in our passage."

First time I ventured deep into SF Bay Delta from SF Bay itself: It was a stop at friend’s island we were going to visit before taking our (then new to us) slip at a Delta marina. Being a careful soul regarding depths and obstructions I was on flybridge keeping eyes open and creeping off the relatively deep slough into a little bay at front of his island. Suddenly depth sounder alarm went off; I looked at readings and saw where seconds before it read 15’... it then read 2’. I have the alarm set to sound off at 3’ which still gives us approx 2’ under props due to where the sounder’s sender is located. Anyway – wind was blowing pretty good and pushing us into even more shallow water. I immediately hit low rpm reverse and due to wind had to increase reverse throttle on one engine to back out straight. Delta base is dark silted-mud; water around boat quickly began looking like chocolate pudding. Needless to say, as tide was already fairly low and still out going, we did not visit his island with our Tolly tri cabin boat.

Due to that experience and the fact I quickly learned there are too many sunken obstructions/snags in Delta waters, especially inside islands’ small bays (e.g. old tree trunks/branches, old outboard motors, concrete blocks and the like used for moorings, as well as other natural or un thoughtfully discarded manmade “prop-benders”) I do NOT take our Tolly into party island shallow bays – at all! We visit friends and islands in our tow behind, out board runabout while our Tolly-Boat rests peacefully on its hook in certified deep waters.

An item regarding “Delta-Times” on the deep sloughs that is pretty phenomenal: Sloughs generally range from 20’ to 35’ deep. Main rivers which sloughs spider web in between are quite deep and carry commercial cargo ships / freighters to Sacramento and other ports from the Pacific. All together there is 1,100 miles of Delta water ways. That said; even minor sized sloughs are still plenty deep (20’ +/-). Most sloughs (small or large) stay deep nearly up to the very edge of tule filled shores (often there is drop off in depth from 0’ to 20’ in just 20’ distance from shore, i.e. 12/12 pitch). So... I often ground the nose of our Tolly on edge of a slough in location of tules or at a clear location. While nose of boat is grounded at our rear in 34’ distance water is seldom less than 15’ deep for diving and swimming. I’ve a light weight aluminum anchor with just line attached for throwing it like a cowboy off the bow and snugging us to shore for time desired. When ready to move on we simply back off, stow lightweight anchor and all is bliss!

Picture shows our Tolly nosed in at 0’ depth with some 20’ depth to rear for swimming and other fun activities. Damn I love being nearly anywhere on/around/in the water and with fun boats! Ain’t life grand!! It is important we enjoy every minute we have... cause, like a flash it/we can suddenly evaporate! Which... it/we are sure to do via the simple, unstoppable means of “cosmic” eventuality.

Happy Boating Daze! - Art
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Old 05-07-2014, 06:48 AM   #33
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>Reverse thrust of the big-boat would provide MANY times the power of little Sea Ray.<

Perhaps the capt knew that reverse thrust moves as much sand or mud as water ,
and chose not to create an island under the hull.
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Old 05-07-2014, 09:05 AM   #34
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>Reverse thrust of the big-boat would provide MANY times the power of little Sea Ray.<

Perhaps the capt knew that reverse thrust moves as much sand or mud as water ,
and chose not to create an island under the hull.
Gooood thinken, Fred! Ya jus mite hav somen there!

We'll just neva kno, now will we??!!

To lern mo - Someone could call dat boat's Captain and further em-bare-ass he by asken WTF was he doen after runnen that BIG Expensive Yacht aground; ... To the point where he b needen a little dink sized Sea Ray for reverse pull??

Matter O' Fact... WTF was he doen to hit groung that solidly in the first place??!!

Go very slow in narrow/shallow/confined areas, keep eyes wide open and have spotters distributed on a boat that size, WATCH the depth sounder closely, be ready to alter course in an instant, be ready at slow speed to go into full reverse. Just a few ways to help "stay off ground"!

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Old 05-07-2014, 09:10 AM   #35
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>Reverse thrust of the big-boat would provide MANY times the power of little Sea Ray.<

Perhaps the capt knew that reverse thrust moves as much sand or mud as water ,
and chose not to create an island under the hull.
It really doesn't create an island. In fact it can dig a big hole. The sand and mud tends to blow out the sides of the hull not pile up under it.

More than likely he/she was more concerned about damaging the props. And using the bow thruster was not a bad idea. It could help break the bow free or move it over to deeper water. It's certainly worth a try.
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Old 05-07-2014, 09:27 AM   #36
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It really doesn't create an island. In fact it can dig a big hole. The sand and mud tends to blow out the sides of the hull not pile up under it.

More than likely he/she was more concerned about damaging the props. And using the bow thruster was not a bad idea. It could help break the bow free or move it over to deeper water. It's certainly worth a try.
Piece of line with weight attached would have told if there was water enough to try reverse (ya know, old-school tests and stuff like that - lol). With length of that boat... as its nose was aground, chances are there was still plenty depth to rear at props. Unless he hit ground at excessive speed; or the shallow area was nearly a dead flat bottom underwater. But, if that were true the little Sea Ray would not be much help - unless of course tide was rising??
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Old 05-07-2014, 09:32 AM   #37
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To lern mo - Someone could call dat boat's Captain and further em-bare-ass he by asken WTF was he doen after runnen that BIG Expensive Yacht aground; ... To the point where he b needen a little dink sized Sea Ray for reverse pull??

Matter O' Fact... WTF was he doen to hit groung that solidly in the first place??!!
"further em-bare-ass he"!? Seriously?

Unless you are just trying to be funny, holier than thou people like you should leave the rest of us less than perfect people alone when we are in the middle of an honest human mistake. We have enough going on without dealing with stupid questions asked only in an attempt to "em-bare-ass" us while feeding your apparently staving ego.

Then again, like I said, maybe you just have an odd sense of humor to go with your odd writing style.
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Old 05-07-2014, 09:42 AM   #38
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"further em-bare-ass he"!? Seriously?

Unless you are just trying to be funny, holier than thou people like you should leave the rest of us less than perfect people alone when we are in the middle of an honest human mistake. We have enough going on without dealing with stupid questions asked only in an attempt to "em-bare-ass" us while feeding your apparently staving ego.

Then again, like I said, maybe you just have an odd sense of humor to go with your odd writing style.

Calm down Capt. Bill or you become the a-hole here.
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Old 05-07-2014, 09:45 AM   #39
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Piece of line with weight attached would have told if there was water enough to try reverse (ya know, old-school tests and stuff like that - lol).
Old school line and a weight works fine to tell you what the depth is right under you but it doesn't tell you much about what's lurking out from that area. And since many times you have to wiggle a boat off you never know what might be to the sides of you or what you might suck up off the bottom while horsing it off with the engines. But it's certainly worth a try if you're careful and understand the potential damage you could do.

Not sure if you can be to conservative in those situations though.
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Old 05-07-2014, 09:49 AM   #40
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"further em-bare-ass he"!? Seriously?

Unless you are just trying to be funny, holier than thou people like you should leave the rest of us less than perfect people alone when we are in the middle of an honest human mistake. We have enough going on without dealing with stupid questions asked only in an attempt to "em-bare-ass" us while feeding your apparently staving ego.

Then again, like I said, maybe you just have an odd sense of humor to go with your odd writing style.
Capt.Bill - Wrong side of bed today?

Sorry, I don't mean to assault your or anyone else’s sensibilities. Don’t get too uptight on what I post. I highlighted in your post what is true and correct about me. I b funnen.. most of the time in posts I place. But, beware... much of what I fun about is spot-on!

I often need to be on my computer by 4 AM or earlier in response to business dealings. TF is simply a valve to let my mind wander while working. BTW – my mind seldom stops working!

You or anyone else can poke fun at me too, or you can say what you like about me. I’ve a very thick IRISH Skin! And, simply love to debate!

Happy Boating Daze! - Art
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