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Old 09-24-2016, 09:00 PM   #21
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I just replaced my old Norcold with a new Norcold. What can I say? It fit in the hole. The price was astonishing. I'm a marine dealer so I can get it Wholesale. $1800 CAD plus freight. I installed it myself, pretty easy, and not too heavy. It is about 1/4 as noisy as the possibly 40 year old reject, and runs about 1/2 as much. My friend who we often raft with says he sleeps much better now that we have a new quieter fridge!


HOLY SMOKY!!!!! Your fridge bothered someone rafted with you????


Heck, I cannot hear much at all but Wifey can hear a flea poop but she cannot hear our Summit! Yes, I do rave about it especially with its self defrost feature along with having a lighted interior when the door is opened.

Marine fridges must have hidden mystic properties that keep their manufacturers in business but they cannot fool all the people all the time!
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Old 09-24-2016, 11:43 PM   #22
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I think the key in comparing a domestic 120v fridge to a 12v/120v marine unit would be the differences in energy draw. I don't want to run a genset at night and my wife needs to use her CPAP. Until I get a 12v CPAP for her, I need to run the inverter at night to keep it powered. I am not sure that adding the load of a 120v reefer wouldn't be a bit too much.

So, while domestic units may be great, I think they would take more power than a 12v/120v convertible.
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Old 09-25-2016, 12:01 AM   #23
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We went with the Isotherm/Webasto. The Admiral liked the freezer on the bottom, I liked that it had one compressor for the frig and one compressor for the freezer.
BTW it has an interior light so I can find my beer without turning on the cabin lights.
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Old 09-25-2016, 06:59 AM   #24
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The main reason many people pay for the marine unit is because of carpentry and space usage.

I didn't want to lose convenient pantry space and do that much carpentry at this time.

Had the fridge been newer and worked better, I might have held out till a complete galley makeover....but life is too short and the cist is offset by all the other projects I have done/do....
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Old 09-25-2016, 07:22 AM   #25
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"Replaced my Norcold with an apartment size Summit fridge. Even has self defrost with an interior light."

Some of the features of house fridges are not welcome on a cruising boat.

Interior space is kept as large as possible , by using very thin insulation.

This requires heating wires on the insulation and along the door seals.

This electric is no problem at the power pole but adds considerably when running with an inverter and its 10%-15% power loss.

Before purchase simplt get the model number and look online for the schematic to see weather heating wires are installed.

K street has made the power consumption of the heating setup NOT part of the annual KW shown on the sticker.

House fridges are usually NOT built into a closed area and may require extra fans to remove the heat of operation.

Some marine units vent into the cabin , solving this boxed in problem.

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Old 09-25-2016, 08:05 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FF View Post
"Replaced my Norcold with an apartment size Summit fridge. Even has self defrost with an interior light."

Some of the features of house fridges are not welcome on a cruising boat.

Interior space is kept as large as possible , by using very thin insulation.

This requires heating wires on the insulation and along the door seals.

This electric is no problem at the power pole but adds considerably when running with an inverter and its 10%-15% power loss.

Before purchase simplt get the model number and look online for the schematic to see weather heating wires are installed.

K street has made the power consumption of the heating setup NOT part of the annual KW shown on the sticker.

House fridges are usually NOT built into a closed area and may require extra fans to remove the heat of operation.

Some marine units vent into the cabin , solving this boxed in problem.

Caviat Emptor
Ok, so how much power consumption does this add? Not interested in amps, KWs per year.

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Old 09-25-2016, 08:07 AM   #27
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What kind/size of boat? What is the electrical system(s). What are your needs. Style of boat use? How much space allocated for a refer?

i have 3 Engle 12v units 2 refer, 1 freezer allocated all run full solar most of the time. I have a friend that has a huge domestic 110v powered by a monster battery bank and inverters.

One extreme to the other, so what are your needs?
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Old 09-25-2016, 08:15 AM   #28
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Oh jeez, totally confused now! I cannot install it myself, just don't have the muscle to throw it over the rails and squeeze it through the door and go go down a few steps to the galley. I HAVE TO hire it out.

I think I'll just bite the 2000.00 bullet and go with Vitrifrigo.
Good choice. Mine are two years old and are prefect. Both the Fridge and freezer keep temp within a few degrees of hwere set.

Also, compressors are ver quiet. They consume about 60 watts per hour for both.

Spend the extra money and get the variable voltage regulator.

BTW, Vitrifrigos are still made in Italy. Isotherms are made in both Italy and China.

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Old 09-25-2016, 10:14 AM   #29
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"Replaced my Norcold with an apartment size Summit fridge. Even has self defrost with an interior light."

Some of the features of house fridges are not welcome on a cruising boat.

Interior space is kept as large as possible , by using very thin insulation.

This requires heating wires on the insulation and along the door seals.

This electric is no problem at the power pole but adds considerably when running with an inverter and its 10%-15% power loss.

Before purchase simplt get the model number and look online for the schematic to see weather heating wires are installed.

K street has made the power consumption of the heating setup NOT part of the annual KW shown on the sticker.

House fridges are usually NOT built into a closed area and may require extra fans to remove the heat of operation.

Some marine units vent into the cabin , solving this boxed in problem.

Caviat Emptor

I do not advocate just going to a local appliance store and order a fridge based on cost. The determining factors for me at least were to minimize the mechanical differences between what I had and its replacement. In my particular case, the Summit I ordered on line was specifically based on how well it fit into the existing void. It fit very well, about 1/4" on the sides and about an 1/2" on the top.

It did present a small challenge because it has wheels which would allow the thing to slide out of it position under normal boat use. I solved that problem by adding a ramp on the floor of each side....picture a wood shingle. The ramp ends where the fridge is pushed flush with the front cabinetry. At that point the wheels drop off the ramp. This prevents the fridge from moving.

Size-- ours has 8.3 cuft vs the Norcold with 8. Small difference. Norcold's compressors were located at the rear vs under the fridge. Insulation difference? Maybe but but in the Summit, the freezer will get to -20F if I set it that low. My Norcold was never cold.

Heater wires-- Didn't look but most likely it has them for self defrost WHICH CAN BE TURNED OFF. Energy consumption? Who cares! I wired mine to a relay that acts as a transfer switch. Inverter (on 24/7) connects to and powers fridge only when dock or genny AC not available.

The transfer switch I build has a small light to indicate dock/genny power. About two weeks ago I noticed the light was out. I had accidently turned off the wrong circuit breaker. How long had it been out is unknown......maybe a month? My solar had zero problems keeping my 12 bank fully charged.

Lastly, all fridges have to dump heat somewhere. It will either go into the cabin where the fridge is located or transfer to the water via a water cooling system which is a big PITA.

So which fridge should you purchase???? Whatever you will be happy with
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Old 09-25-2016, 11:20 AM   #30
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Modern, quality inverters have a 5 to 8% inversion power loss, not 10 to 15%. That being the case, there is something to be said for high efficiency residential units for your marine refer needs.
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Old 09-25-2016, 02:55 PM   #31
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Here is a discussion of inverter powered refrigeratation on a motor home.

Residential Refrigerator Power Requirements

Answers many questions.
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Old 09-25-2016, 03:15 PM   #32
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Donna --

I recently replaced an older Tundra with an 8 cu ft Vitrifrigio. It was supposed to be an exact replacement, but it wound up 1/4" taller and required some minor carpentry. Very happy with it, and it is performing much better than the old one, due to improvements in insulation, compressor, etc. I have the 120V/12V model.

Very pleased with my choice.
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Old 09-26-2016, 07:52 AM   #33
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Sure, it operates on AC but today one can purchase a 2KW true sine wave inverterter on EBay for under $200. So add the $500 cost for the fridge and the total for fridge and inverter is about 1/2 the cost for a marine replacement that offers fewer features.

Could be the right solution for some, even many, but... may slightly mask the complexity of the issue.

It's a system, so not just a fridge... or a fridge and an inverter... but batteries, chargers, shore/genset power, even the basic wiring and breakers, etc. are also involved.

An AC-only fridge powered by an inverter benefits from some thought about battery banks (sizes, types, charging). Are the batteries sufficient during all foreseen situations? Including duration away from shorepower or off genset power? Or is the user willing to start the genset every time the boat will leave the dock?

And then about inverters: Would that be a single-purpose unit, dedicated to only one fridge? Or should it be sized to service other circuits too? Or, how many inverters would an owner want to install/have aboard if other circuits could benefit from an inverter too? Or how many inverters can an owner find space for? Or can feed? Multiple battery banks? Space for same? Periodic service for same? How closely to the battery source can the inverter (s) be installed? (Wire sizes.)

And so forth.

Not a recommendation, just thinking about a bigger picture...

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Old 09-26-2016, 10:11 AM   #34
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Could be the right solution for some, even many, but... may slightly mask the complexity of the issue.

It's a system, so not just a fridge... or a fridge and an inverter... but batteries, chargers, shore/genset power, even the basic wiring and breakers, etc. are also involved.

And so forth.

Not a recommendation, just thinking about a bigger picture...

-Chris


Yes, everything on a boat is part of a system.

My very many years enjoying time on the water has shown me that for the most part, there are those who prefer to pay for all maintenance and those who try to minimize cost by doing things themselves. So expenses matter more to some than others even for purchasing refrigerators.

Inverters operating 24/7 as one of mine does causes a slight increase in our total 12v energy consumption. Prior to installing my 12v inverter my so called state of the art POS Xantrex 5012 (or 1250) just could not recharge my depleted batteries while on anchor with a 12vdc fridge. And my 7.5KW genny ran at least 6 hours/day. The Summit did not relieve the battery load at all, if anything it made it somewhat worse.

I got fed up with low battery warnings when away from the dock and installed 4 each 140-150 watt solar panels. Solar is just terrific! No more depleted batteries! We now are power pigs with two 32" TVs, lights, internet and the genny helps with hot water and coffee. Heck, Wifey even makes her toast and perks coffee using battery energy during times when we don't even run the genny.

My point pertaining to batteries is that no which avenue one chooses, marine or apartment style fridges, batteries require recharging.

Foggy
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Old 09-26-2016, 01:42 PM   #35
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I'm not a fan of Vitrifrigo. Purchased a new GB a little over two years ago. The fridge needed work and was eventually replaced after two weeks as it would only maintain the temperature in the low 50s.Just replaced the thermostat on the freezer in the bilge after two years. Both units are drawer type that look good but need manual defrosting.
Previous boat was a Hatt that I ended up replacing the fridge and chest freezer with appliances from the large Brands Mart discount store. They would last between 7-12 years and then I replaced them (actually the delivery company installed the units). The cost is less than half than a marine unit.


Good luck.
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Old 09-26-2016, 07:13 PM   #36
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Yes, everything on a boat is part of a system.

My very many years enjoying time on the water has shown me that for the most part, there are those who prefer to pay for all maintenance and those who try to minimize cost by doing things themselves. So expenses matter more to some than others even for purchasing refrigerators.

Inverters operating 24/7 as one of mine does causes a slight increase in our total 12v energy consumption. Prior to installing my 12v inverter my so called state of the art POS Xantrex 5012 (or 1250) just could not recharge my depleted batteries while on anchor with a 12vdc fridge. And my 7.5KW genny ran at least 6 hours/day. The Summit did not relieve the battery load at all, if anything it made it somewhat worse.

I got fed up with low battery warnings when away from the dock and installed 4 each 140-150 watt solar panels. Solar is just terrific! No more depleted batteries! We now are power pigs with two 32" TVs, lights, internet and the genny helps with hot water and coffee. Heck, Wifey even makes her toast and perks coffee using battery energy during times when we don't even run the genny.

My point pertaining to batteries is that no which avenue one chooses, marine or apartment style fridges, batteries require recharging.

Foggy
Whoa, no way am I paying for everything. If you have seen some of my previous threads, I have done ALL of the engine work myself including replacing the sight lines on my fuel. I don't mind getting dirty and changing fluids, replacing belts, along with doing my own brightwork, plumbing, etc. BUT at 124lbs., there are simply things I cannot do like humping a refridgerator. I purchased the boat 4 weeks ago and it doesn't even look like the same boat. I work on her almost everyday. I have a reserve for the things I cannot handle myself. The divers are going down next week. Could I do that myself? I really don't know. What I do know is I don't want to!
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Old 09-26-2016, 09:05 PM   #37
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Whoa, no way am I paying for everything. If you have seen some of my previous threads, I have done ALL of the engine work myself including replacing the sight lines on my fuel. I don't mind getting dirty and changing fluids, replacing belts, along with doing my own brightwork, plumbing, etc. BUT at 124lbs., there are simply things I cannot do like humping a refridgerator. I purchased the boat 4 weeks ago and it doesn't even look like the same boat. I work on her almost everyday. I have a reserve for the things I cannot handle myself. The divers are going down next week. Could I do that myself? I really don't know. What I do know is I don't want to!


DONNA!!!!

You are cordially invited to spend next summer on my boat!!! There you will be able to enjoy most of New England's seabirds in flight along with their chasing fresh meals.

Wifey and I will occasionally see that you get a fresh pizza ......cheeze only and small of course for special events. I will see that my screw gun is fully equipped with charged batteries and my entire tool arsenal will be at your disposal.


Now on a serious side.............GOOD FOR YOU, GO GIRL!!!!! Purchase the AC fridge along with a 2-4KW inverter from EBay and get some one to help 'hump it' into its new home.

I am proud of you!!! I joke with Wifey about being a fix it guy such as with our apartments. I HATE IT! I humped though 4 years of college to get a BSEE while working almost full time and now I am a fix it guy. One has to just keep smiling.

Foggy
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Old 09-26-2016, 11:37 PM   #38
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Whoa, no way am I paying for everything. If you have seen some of my previous threads, I have done ALL of the engine work myself including replacing the sight lines on my fuel. I don't mind getting dirty and changing fluids, replacing belts, along with doing my own brightwork, plumbing, etc. BUT at 124lbs., there are simply things I cannot do like humping a refridgerator. I purchased the boat 4 weeks ago and it doesn't even look like the same boat. I work on her almost everyday. I have a reserve for the things I cannot handle myself. The divers are going down next week. Could I do that myself? I really don't know. What I do know is I don't want to!
Donna, where have you been all my life! You sound like the perfect woman...not counting my wife, of course.

Goodonya! I love a strong woman! Married one and raised two more.
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Old 09-27-2016, 06:47 AM   #39
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Aww c'mon guys! Blushing here.

I just get pride out of doing things myself.
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Old 09-27-2016, 09:38 AM   #40
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I'm pretty much convinced a residential type 'fridge is in my future. My old Norcold 6.3 died so I'm looking for something similar sized to fit in the hole. I have two breakers to feed my 'fridge. One 12V and one 120V. I figure I can hook an inverter to my 12V breaker and voila, have pretty much the same functionality. I also hope that with a good efficient 'fridge and inverter setup, I'll use less battery power than my old noisy Norcold for way less money. Now, I just gotta find something that will fit without too much trouble. I may even go a little smaller and make room for a microwave above.

Kevin
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