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Old 03-15-2016, 03:32 AM   #1
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New Boat - Engine Question

So, I bought myself a boat:

The engine is new, 225 HP Perkins turbo.
The boat cruises at hull speed at 1,600 RPM and turbo comes on at approx.2,000 RPM and is not much faster then. Hull speed suits me.

If I keep going like that the turbo will never spool properly; will this be OK or should I rev the engine periodically (how often then and how long?) to exercise the turbo? Max RPM seems to be 2,600 RPM.
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Old 03-15-2016, 06:25 AM   #2
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That is a Perkins Sabre 225 TI I can only but assume without a few more pictures. The turbo is waste gated and starts to engage at around 1200 RPM. You can hear this especially when throttling back and turbo whine drops off. Max RPM is 2500. Your book has this information.

The engine should be able to pull 2500 RPM if it is propped correctly. Cruising at 1600 to 1800 RPM is the optimum range. Sure, run it up to 2000 or so RPM now and then, not really required too often if it is maintained properly. The temperature should stay in the 175 to 180 range.

Spend some time learning about the engine and required maintenance, it is a good one.
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Old 03-15-2016, 06:39 AM   #3
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Plenty will say yes, you should rev her up for about 10 minutes every time you go out - personally I doubt it matters, just as long as she is got up to full operating temp for reasonable periods when you go out, the turbo will tend to look after itself. It is in the exhaust stream after all, so carbon build-up is hardly likely. Stopping the engine immediately after a hot on boost run would be far worse for it, although if it is like turbo cars these days, the turbo is probably water cooled anyway. However, still not good to switch off immediately after a full boost run, but realistically that would never happen, would it.
So, in my view, and I've owned (still do) several turbo'd cars, (not boats tho), I would say just happily keep doin' what you're doin'...
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Old 03-15-2016, 10:34 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Janusz View Post
So, I bought myself a boat:

The engine is new, 225 HP Perkins turbo.
The boat cruises at hull speed at 1,600 RPM and turbo comes on at approx.2,000 RPM and is not much faster then. Hull speed suits me.

If I keep going like that the turbo will never spool properly; will this be OK or should I rev the engine periodically (how often then and how long?) to exercise the turbo? Max RPM seems to be 2,600 RPM.
At 1600 rpm what speed are you seeing in flat water?

Very nice looking boat by the way.. you should really love the layout and covered decks.
Thanks
HOLLYWOOD
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Old 03-15-2016, 10:43 AM   #5
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although if it is like turbo cars these days, the turbo is probably water cooled anyway.
It is aircooled.
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Old 03-16-2016, 08:50 PM   #6
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At 1600 rpm what speed are you seeing in flat water?
HOLLYWOOD
Thank you, everybody, for answers.

Hollywood, I just bought the boat as of today and I have never been in flat water in it yet!!

The sea trials last week we had in a really good blow, I think the strongest in Strait of Georgia this year yet. That was a real fun, fun, fun. I was steering the boat and the surveying mechanic asked for 2,600 RPM for approx. 10 min.
The owner got apprehensive but I was glad to give it some berries.

On the way back home the ferry Nanaimo-Horseshoe Bay was struggling (one hour delay) due to reported 50 kn winds.
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Old 03-16-2016, 09:31 PM   #7
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Meanwhile, I'm happily avoiding any turbocharged difficulties with an NA engine.
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Old 03-16-2016, 09:33 PM   #8
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Janusz-that sounds like a helluva sea trial!
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Old 03-16-2016, 11:18 PM   #9
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We were in protected bay so the sea was not built up, but the wind was stiff and the boat was struggling-lots of windage.

I was happy and curious to see how it behaved. I have no experience at all with small power cruisers/boats/trawlers; this is going to be my first. All I know is all sizes of sailboats and commercial ships.
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Old 03-17-2016, 11:04 AM   #10
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Rule of thumb, run 75% load for 10 mins, for every four hours of run time. This will ensure engine temps, and turbo boost climb to designed levels, and keep everything exercised.
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Old 03-17-2016, 11:26 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by Janusz;
So, I bought myself a boat:
Congratulations.
Boat looks good in the picture, what is it?
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Old 03-17-2016, 11:49 AM   #12
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2600 rpm at WOT is 100rpm under propped re sunchaser's input. By "max rpm" I assume he's talking about "rated rpm". Perfect .. FYI a governor will kick in and prevent the rpm from going any higher than 2 or 300 above rated rpm. but I would'nt want a WOT rpm any higher than that. It wouldn't be harmful .. just not as ideal. I consider 50rpm under propped .. to right at rated rpm to be perfect. Hard to get perfect though as one inch pitch change will change WOT rpm 200 turns .. or so. If you were to increase pitch 1" ( for example) you would probably be over propped. Prop shops don't make 1/2" pitch changes. So you're about as good as usually can get.

How "new" is the engine? I sure would'nt want my new engine run WOT for ten min. Two or three should be sufficient IMO for sea trial unless the engine was completely "broken in". Perhaps it was good the engine was under propped. If it was over propped 100rpm it would have been much harder on the engine. It would have been slightly overloaded ... but not by much.
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Old 03-17-2016, 12:01 PM   #13
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nemier wrote;
"Rule of thumb, run 75% load for 10 mins, for every four hours of run time."

Steve De'Antonio of PM Magazine (tech ed) said at one time that one should cruise at 75% rated power most or all of the time. Did he cave on that or?

Your rule of thumb sounds good to me though. I'm shy of that as I don't run 75% very often. I do run at 50% almost all of the time though. I almost never run less than 50%. These numbers are % of load (or max fuel burn) not % of rpm. Very very different.
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Old 03-17-2016, 12:16 PM   #14
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.............

"Tony De'Antonio of PM Magazine (tech ed) said at one time that one should cruise at 75% rated power most or all of the time." ................
Any relation to Steve D'Antonio of Steve D'Antonio Marine Consulting, Inc. who once wrote tech articles for PM magazine (he quit writing for them in 2014)?
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Old 03-17-2016, 12:18 PM   #15
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OOPS my bad .... indeed Steve.
Thanks for posting quickly so I can correct it .. I did.
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Old 03-17-2016, 02:51 PM   #16
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Steve De'Antonio of PM Magazine (tech ed) said at one time that one should cruise at 75% rated power most or all of the time. Did he cave on that or?
I could be very wrong here, but it is my understanding that the newer common rail diesels don't suffer from being at less than that 75% power like the older diesels did.
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Old 03-17-2016, 03:14 PM   #17
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The old rule of thumb on running at 75 or 80% load now and then is not necessary for the PS engine in question. It has a coolant to oil heat exchanger that keeps the oil temps high enough at light loads that even at 1500 RPM oil temperatures are 180 F. But it won't hurt anything if the boat is correctly propped.
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Old 03-17-2016, 03:47 PM   #18
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Dave,
Read "not so much" I think ..... but don't really know for sure. As long as the lube oil gets up to 160 or above lower loading may be fine. Coolant temp means little as it's artificially held up by the thermostat. Not an indication of work being done. Now if you took out your thermostat and ran your engine at 180 degrees coolant temp ... Yup that's loaded. But running w/o a thermostat is not a good thing to do. I'm expressing my opinions but Tom (sunchaser) knows more about this so I mostly defer to him.
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Old 03-17-2016, 04:21 PM   #19
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Congratulations.
Boat looks good in the picture, what is it?
Thank you.
The boat is a 1982 4o ft OA Europa.

Now, this over/under propping business is somewhat unclear to me.
The boat originally had single Lehman.
It was repowered in 2011 with Sabre Perkins M225 TI and there is 364 hrs on it. The oil was changed once (how it should be) and sample was analyzed - all OK.
When mechanic asked for 2600 rpm I was at the controls and eased the throttle very slowly until 2600 - but I do not think I pegged the lever; in other words I think it was not totally WOT but very close. I did not even think about speed over the water since everything was quite turbulent.

I will ferry my new darling from Duncan home to Garden Bay next week and hopefully will have a chance to observe all the parameters. The bottom was powerwashed and I am looking forward to fine crossing.
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Old 03-17-2016, 04:32 PM   #20
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75% load? How would I determine that?

I am totally ignorant about marine diesels, but my seat of the pants tells me that to travel up to displacement speed I would need significantly less then 75% of max load.

We will see how it goes.
All I know that practice is frequently much different then theory and common sense is the best solution.
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