marinetrader vs. defever

[bfloyd4445]

Look a little further north. There are tons of Nordic Tugs, American Tugs, Nordhavns, etc. for sale in Washington and BC.

I wish i had run accross a tug or two while i was up there last week but i didnt. The holidays have me spinning wheels i guess. I should have spent the whole week up in the sound shopping

 

[Marin]

The tugs are lighter because, once they started putting bigger engines in them, they can cruise faster than the typical diesel cruiser. In fact the tug people coined a term for their boats, "fast trawlers." Which is a bit of an oxymoron although I suppose no more inaccurate than calling a recreational cruiser a "trawler" in the first place.

 

[bfloyd4445]

The tugs are lighter because, once they started putting bigger engines in them, they can cruise faster than the typical diesel cruiser. In fact the tug people coined a term for their boats, "fast trawlers." Which is a bit of an oxymoron although I suppose no more inaccurate than calling a recreational cruiser a "trawler" in the first place.

chuckle...so thats were fast trawler began. Are tugs more economical to operate than the typical trawler then?

 

[Marin]

chuckle...so thats were fast trawler began. Are tugs more economical to operate than the typical trawler then?

Probably all depends on how you operate them. Go fast, you'll use a lot of fuel. Go slow and you won't.

 

[Formosa]

I wish i had run accross a tug or two while i was up there last week but i didnt. The holidays have me spinning wheels i guess. I should have spent the whole week up in the sound shopping

I suggest checking out Northwest Yachting magazine, a high-quality free monthly available at many regional chandleries and marinas (but, alas, not in Coos Bay -- the closest place to get it is Crescent City to the south or Newport to the north). But you can go to nwyachting.com to read the online edition for listings of literally hundreds of trawlers and coastal cruisers, for sale both at brokers and privately. Next to Yachtworld, it is probably the best trawler/powerboat hunting resource on the west coast.

 

[bfloyd4445]

Probably all depends on how you operate them. Go fast, you'll use a lot of fuel. Go slow and you won't.

over the years i have grown more and more fond of puttin along with a fishing line out than going fast. Just nice to putt along with nature and the voice of the sea as her currents, breath, conveys her intent.
Now i often dont even bother with the fishing pole.

God bless all and HAPPY THANKSGIVING!!

my favorite holiday

a matter of principal Marin<smile>.....

 

[psneeld]

ya also gotta know who to believe...for 30 years or so I though Albins were well built boats...after 1000 man-hours of redoing the bottom, decks, flybridge, sanitation, electrical...etc..etc... the mags, surveyors and previous owners may need a few lessons on a well built boat.

If Albins were middle of the road in construction...I'd hate to have to redo something further down the list.

 

[bfloyd4445]

I suggest checking out Northwest Yachting magazine, a high-quality free monthly available at many regional chandleries and marinas (but, alas, not in Coos Bay -- the closest place to get it is Crescent City to the south or Newport to the north). But you can go to nwyachting.com to read the online edition for listings of literally hundreds of trawlers and coastal cruisers, for sale both at brokers and privately. Next to Yachtworld, it is probably the best trawler/powerboat hunting resource on the west coast.

thanks.
The Yatchsman is the one i am most familiar with printed in the SF bay area

 

[BruceK]

The tugs are lighter because, once they started putting bigger engines in them, they can cruise faster than the typical diesel cruiser. In fact the tug people coined a term for their boats, "fast trawlers." Which is a bit of an oxymoron although I suppose no more inaccurate than calling a recreational cruiser a "trawler" in the first place.

Beneteau, essentially sailboat builders, make a 42ft boat they call a "fast trawler" ,2 engines of around 300hp. It was at the Boat Show, looked lightly built and not enough saloon for size. I was too busy drooling over the Alaska 46 anyway.

 

[Sceptic]

I was fortunate to spend a half hour with Mr. DeFever a few years ago. He is adamant that the boats he designs are not trawlers but motor yachts.

He said that trawlers drag nets around the sea bed. He pointed out that early in his career he did design trawlers, but he has not done so in 40 years.

He is well over 90 years old but still sharp. I asked him to send me copies of his drawings of my boat no matter what the cost, but he said there was a problem with who actually owned the drawings.

He told me his favorite design was my Jensen Marine 40, but I suspect he says that to all the “girls”.

Nice guy, smart, and an incredibly skilled draftsman who really knows boats. I hope he gets his drawing ownership issue worked out before he leaves us.

Mike

Edit to add -

The marine design software I own has a very hard time drawing the bow of a DeFever. Too many compound curves for nurb surfaces to fair.

I can duplicate it by hand with ducks and splines after a lot of thought but Rhino, Prosurf, and Autoship just go crazy. Mr. DeFever really was a skilled draftsman.

Ever wondered why late model boats look the way they do? It’s the software.

Mike

 

[bfloyd4445]

I was fortunate to spend a half hour with Mr. DeFever a few years ago. He is adamant that the boats he designs are not trawlers but motor yachts.

He said that trawlers drag nets around the sea bed. He pointed out that early in his career he did design trawlers, but he has not done so in 40 years.

He is well over 90 years old but still sharp. I asked him to send me copies of his drawings of my boat no matter what the cost, but he said there was a problem with who actually owned the drawings.

He told me his favorite design was my Jensen Marine 40, but I suspect he says that to all the “girls”.

Nice guy, smart, and an incredibly skilled draftsman who really knows boats. I hope he gets his drawing ownership issue worked out before he leaves us.

Mike

Edit to add -

The marine design software I own has a very hard time drawing the bow of a DeFever. Too many compound curves for nurb surfaces to fair.

I can duplicate it by hand with ducks and splines after a lot of thought but Rhino, Prosurf, and Autoship just go crazy. Mr. DeFever really was a skilled draftsman.

Ever wondered why late model boats look the way they do? It’s the software.

Mike

I'm jealous, i would love to meet him. Since you own a forty which do you think is better, the 40 or 41? I am pretty sure i will end up with one or the other, but the costa mesa built usa ones.

 

[Sceptic]

I can not answer your question.

As has been stated here many times before when you are dealing with boats of a certain age it is much more important, in general, to evaluate how the boat was maintained rather than who was the builder.

Mr. DeFever refers to the DeFever 38, built in wood by the Oriental Boat Co. in Japan, the Jensen DeFever PassageMaker 40 , and the Blue Water DeFever 41 as the “38". There are more of these 3 boats around than all of the other DeFever designs combined.

I’ve never seen a wood 38, but I have seen a lot of the 41's. I’ve never seen a 40 other than my own.

I have rafted to several 41's - they are exactly the same size as my 40. The difference between the two is that the Jensen 40 has a radius chine, and the 41 has a sharp chine.

If you come across a boat listing for a DeFever PassageMaker 40, and it has a sharp chine, then you are being lied to. There are a couple of liars on Yachtworld now. I would never trust a broker.

Mike

 

[bfloyd4445]

thanks Mike
is the downeast model and the passagemaker the same boat but made in diferent locations? At the defever website they list them as diferent models

 

[Sceptic]

The DownEast hull, deck and cabin were built in the molds purchased from Jensen. They are identical.

DownEast tooled a interior fiberglass liner to locate all the bulkheads and interior structure.

They rearranged the galley and settee from one side to the other.

New flybridge mold.

Other than that they’re the same.

I know nothing about the fiberglass layup of DownEast vs. Jensen.

Mike

 

[bfloyd4445]

The DownEast hull, deck and cabin were built in the molds purchased from Jensen. They are identical.

DownEast tooled a interior fiberglass liner to located all the bulkheads and interior structure.

They rearranged the galley and settee from one side to the other.

New flybridge mold.

Other than that they’re the same.

I know nothing about the fiberglass layup of DownEast vs. Jensen.

Mike

ah, i have seen that change in one. wonder which one is which? but i guess it dosent matter. Just joined the defever group and don't even own one yet

 

[baldpaul]

Here is some Defever history:

http://www.defevercruisers.com/defever_history.asp:

My boat was built by POCTA yard in China. They have been building boats for many years and now only build Defevers. Last year I was looking for my original electrical schematics. I emailed them and a few days later they sent me my boat schematics. I was pleasantly surprised. My opinion is that my boat will always have a market, as it is well built with a Classic design.

 

[Egregious]

Here is some Defever history:

http://www.defevercruisers.com/defever_history.asp:

My boat was built by POCTA yard in China. They have been building boats for many years and now only build Defevers. Last year I was looking for my original electrical schematics. I emailed them and a few days later they sent me my boat schematics. I was pleasantly surprised. My opinion is that my boat will always have a market, as it is well built with a Classic design.

I love this statement in the article:

"A DeFever never looks outdated. And not a single one of them looks like a giant plastic basketball shoe"

The Admiral calls the bubble decked boats "shoes" or "sneakers."

From personal experience, we looked at many Marine Traders as well as DeFever, Albin, Jefferson, Grand Banks, and others before buying our Monk. In my opinion the DeFever was a better boat, at least for me. At the time, most of them we looked at were more boat than we needed, but if I ever move up, I'll take a hard look at them.

 

[bfloyd4445]

Here is some Defever history:

http://www.defevercruisers.com/defever_history.asp:

My boat was built by POCTA yard in China. They have been building boats for many years and now only build Defevers. Last year I was looking for my original electrical schematics. I emailed them and a few days later they sent me my boat schematics. I was pleasantly surprised. My opinion is that my boat will always have a market, as it is well built with a Classic design.

but quality and standing behind their products is what has made them popular.
Nice to know the manufacturer stands behind his products

 

[Pinball63]

Inspect the top of each fuel tank for corrosion. The water gets under the fuel fill if the bedding goes bad and runs down the outside of the hose to the top of the tank!

 

[bfloyd4445]

Inspect the top of each fuel tank for corrosion. The water gets under the fuel fill if the bedding goes bad and runs down the outside of the hose to the top of the tank!

on the top outside of the tank? I was thinking of condensation inside the tank not on the outside.
Thanks
Britt

 

[Marin]

Steel/iron fuel tanks generally rust from the outside in, not from the inside out. The two major culprits are the leakage of water down past a poorly bedded deck fill to pool on top of the tank, and moisture that gets trapped between the bottom of a tank and its mounting supports or mounting platform. If these two situations are successfully avoided, steel or iron tanks can last a very long time.

 

[bfloyd4445]

boy i was on the wrong track in regards to thos issue. I was aware of the tank problem but i thought its cause was the same as with cars, trucks, from condensation from storeing the vehicle with the tank empty or partially full.
thankls for the clarification

 

[grahamdouglass]

My 41' Marine Trader

I have a 1980 Marine Trader 41, that measures 42' from Anchor to swim grid. It is, as far as I can tell, identical to a Defever 42. The exterior looks the same, the interior looks the same. The measurements are the same. The shear looks the same. It was built in Taiwan in 1980 by Miracle Marine Corporation, has a single Leman 120. It has a long keel and skeg to protect the propeller.

So the question, "What is better a Marine Trader or Defever can be a little misleading. It comes down to the yard and the actual vessel. It comes down to the model. After 42 years a poorly maintained Defever can be ready for the scrap yard and a boat house kept Marine Trader that has been maintained can still be a thing of beauty.