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Old 10-06-2019, 10:02 AM   #1
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Magellano vs Tasman Sea

Hi all,

As you can tell this is my first post here and I'm looking forward to learning and gaining insight from you knowledgeable group of individuals Please excuse the long post!

My partner and I are considering an OE via boat in the coming years. While we've both been around boats our whole lives (we're still reasonably young so that isn't majorly long haha), passage-making and deep water is quite new to us and we hope to learn from boating courses and knowledgeable folk such as yourselves as we get more into it.

We live in New Zealand, a relatively little island in the corner of the world. Our plan is to make our way to Sydney via Lord Howe Island and then cruise along the coast and up into Indonesia and further on.

However before we get that far we need to consider the Tasman sea and what would be appropriate to cross in. I understand the Tasman can be quite rough, and as someone on another forum said if you cross the Tasman and don't get into a storm you'll be having one on the way back haha.

Looking at our options, we would like to purchase a new powerboat to do this trip. I understand Nordhavn and Kady Krogen are the go-tos for such journeys however there are several reasons we would prefer a different option, one of which being the speeds of full-displacement are obviously limited to predominately single digits.

While looking at options we came across the Azimut Magellano series. Specifically, the Magellano 53. Azimut is mostly known for their cruisers for coastal stuff, however, (according to their spiel) the Magellano line is intended for "offshore" work. With a supposedly "un-slammable" semi-hull (taking this with a grain of salt) among other features, they seem to be designed to take on at least more than the majority of cruisers while delivering an alright 5.5GPH at 8 knots (1,100 miles), 2.4GPH at 6.6 knots (2,100 miles) and the potential for 24 knots when range isn't an issue.

Details and reviews here:

https://www.azimutyachts.com/azimutmagellano53.html

https://www.powerandmotoryacht.com/b...t-magellano-53

The interiors are gorgeous and feature all the ameneties and niceties one would expect. That's ticks that box, but I'm more concerned about rough weather handling. It's CE A-category rated (over Beaufort 8 and over 4m swells) but seas don't always fall nicely into a category and despite planning and going at the best times possible, when you're halfway across the Tasman with a sudden storm coming up with 8m swells you've got not much choice but to ride it out.

We've fallen in love with this yacht and would plan and equip meticulously with professional training, safety equipment (liferafts, EPIRB, survival suits if need be) and would be spec'ing it with a Seakeeper stabiliser. We don't want to be naiive boaties who plow off into the distance in a Bayliner. However in your honest opinions, would such a vessel be capable of taking on the Tasman? From there onwards it'll be majority small hops to different countries' coastlines and running the coasts from there which doing at 6 knots wouldn't be our cup of tea which is why a dual-purpose yacht such as the Magellano is so appealing.

My primary areas of concern are:
- Stability of semi-displacement hulls (with and without a Seakeeper)
- What risk if any of being pitchpoled in large seas
- Waves over the bow / structural strength
- What sort of swells could a 16m boat such as this handle
- The vessel being able to handle the potential rogue wave (not a massive Hollywood wall of water, but the textbook definition of 2 times significant wave height) which do make occurrences and have caused others crossing the Tasman to come unstuck with severe consequences.

I understand KK and Nordhavn would be the go-to, however even Nordhavn have a small 41 they've circumnavigated with and a 59 semi hull with others doing the journey in small sailboats. Is full displacement the only option for ocean-going or would the Magellano be capable of such journeys?

Thank you in advance and I look forward to your inputs

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Old 10-06-2019, 10:21 AM   #2
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If it is CE-A rated I think you should not have much to worry about. But regardless of the boat you still need to select a good weather window. Surviving a voyage is great but enjoying it is the goal. Seakeeper would add greatly to your comfort.
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Old 10-06-2019, 10:33 AM   #3
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Old 10-06-2019, 01:04 PM   #4
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What is the Azimut reputation for service in your area? I ask because it's good in Europe and bad in the U.S.

As to the Magellano, I thought when they introduced the series it was a great idea.

A couple of misleading aspects of the boat test. It was conducted in 1-2' seas and very lightly loaded. Less than half fuel, less than half water, 6 people but only 250 lb of gear and you'll have many many times that much. With normal loads and normal conditions you won't reach those numbers. You must plan for worse conditions and in 8' seas with full fuel and water and thousands of pounds of gear, rather than hundreds, you're talking far less.

I'd see it as perhaps appropriate for going to Australia and other islands in your general area. However, for crossing large ocean expanses, for circumnavigating, I would not see it as the boat.

Definitely need stabilization on that boat.

Back to speed for a moment, cruise speed on that boat is 16 knots. That's from Azimut. WOT is only to be run very briefly. At 16 knots though, your range is less than 350 nm. Still fine for coastal cruising but never comes into play on long range cruising. My guesses at 8 knots and 6 knots are more like 900 nm and 1800 nm and those numbers can drop if you're into a strong wind or current. Also, keep in mind, you'll be running the generator and it uses fuel.

Could it cross the Tasman Sea? Yes, at 6 knots in good conditions taking about 7 days. You might speed up to 8 knots for the latter part of the trip after seeing you were in a good fuel situation.

You talk about Rogue waves and such. Then you mention 8 meter swells. Well, lower your fuel to 0 nmpg in those conditions and while you likely would survive such swells, would you have fuel remaining? I'd suggest talking to others about conditions they've encountered crossing the Tasman. That said, an 8 meter swell scares me far less than 8 meter wind waves. With good planning, should the boat be capable of crossing the Tasman? Yes. I look at the normal safety of weather forecasts and the furthest distance from shore. At the worst point, you'd be 3 days or so from shore. Forecasts are pretty accurate within a 72 hour range allowing you to turn back or continue.

Frankly, I'd consider the 66' Magellano but even it has some of the same issues with a relatively small fuel capacity. There are other boats that are somewhere in between Nordhavn and the Magellano, boats such as Outer Reef, Cheoy Lee, Selene, and Horizon that are worth looking at.

Again, Magellano is a good concept. However, multipurpose boats or other items are never quite as good at anything as single purpose.
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Old 10-06-2019, 01:29 PM   #5
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Buy it in Aus and you wont have to cross the Tasman
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Old 10-06-2019, 02:06 PM   #6
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Having done the Tasman both ways, if you like that boat, why not buy it in Sydney?
The extra angst, effort and cost in getting that boat to a standard you will be happy to leave NZ, isn't worth it IMHO.
Remember you have to pass Cat 1 in an NZ registered boat to leave NZ waters as well.
From Sydney all the way to Phuket is much easier if you wait for your weather gaps.
Don't miss Lord Howe though, it's awesome.
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Old 10-06-2019, 05:12 PM   #7
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If buying new, then getting it delivered to somewhere in Australia is the way to go as others have already mentioned. But register it in NZ. Not only do you avoid the Tasman crossing in a new-to-you boat. You should not have to pay any GST/Duty initially as the boat has not formally entered NZ, which is when they are triggered. I seem to recall that those costs are 22.5% of the boat + transport cost? If you eventually take it back to NZ the import costs will be assessed on a used, depreciated boat. Big $$$ saved doing it this way.

And if you wanted to dawdle, remember that foreign registered boats can stay in Australia 3 years before triggering Australian GST/duty, provided the owners are not Australian citizens.
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Old 10-07-2019, 05:02 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by bayview View Post
Buy it in Aus and you wont have to cross the Tasman
Lol �� , but seriously , a good idea.
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Old 10-10-2019, 09:16 AM   #9
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Hi all, thanks so much for all your replies! I really appreciate all your inputs.

I'm glad to hear the Seakeeper seems to be a highly rated option. We've seen some examples of it in action and if it performs even half as a good as that we'll be happy. My takeaway from this is that in all but the worst conditions, the 53 should be capable of making the crossing (not taking into account fuel) with good planning and foresight.

Insequent, Darkside and Bayview; The idea of purchasing the boat in Australia is a brilliant idea. I honestly can't believe I never even considered this before haha! As you say, it will save a significant amount of money, planning and time and give us some proper, real-world cross-country usage with the boat before having to embark on a trip as big as the Tasman. We will be seriously considering this as our preferred option now and I'll be getting in touch with some reps from over there in the coming weeks. We'll more than likely be keeping it after our trip is completed so we'll need to look at the best way to get it back to NZ. Thank you for the heads up on the registration and GST tips, that's invaluable info!

As you mention BandB, the fuel consumption figures are in a very low load situation. We'll no doubt need to look at fuel bladders to get the capacity needed to cruise back with a good amount in reserve. We'll be paying close attention to our real-world consumption on the trip itself and make a decision whether its practical or feasible to cruise our way back home or whether we have to look at other options. The 66 is a beautiful yacht, but unfortunately too far out of our budget. Thank you for the tips on the other manufacturers though, we will be sure to take a look at them and see how they compare to the Magellano.

Thanks again for all your advice
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Old 10-10-2019, 10:26 AM   #10
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Where do I start? First of all I'm 78 years old and have never crossed an ocean. I have had 9 boats, all over 30 feet with the largest being 54'.

I have been reading, maintaining boats, and listening to others who have considerably more "on the water" experience than I do, daily for the past 50 years.

Conclusions:

1) Yes, a semi displacement boat that has been appropriately equipped can cross an ocean.

2) A Seakeeper is not the only means to smoothing out ocean travel and does require running the Genny constantly. (Not to mention the true cost of the purchase & installation.)

3) Buying a boat in Australia seems to be the smart approach. (besides, you only have to cross the Tasman once!) Not to mention being close to a nation of seafarers who have tons of the experience you covet.)

4) Buying a used boat will save a considerable amount of money and could result in acquiring a much larger boat, capable of meeting your wife's and your expectations. (I'm currently on my 10th boat since 1995. Bought only one new before this lesson was learned.)

5) Get a ton of coastal cruising in before attempting the Tasman crossing.

6) Other than being able to say "you've crossed an ocean",
the memorable enjoyment will be coastal cruising rather than days upon days of boredom with moments (or days) of complete terror while attempting an ocean crossing.

Whatever you decide, may you have the very best of luck in your endeavors.
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Old 10-11-2019, 01:30 PM   #11
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When you do bring the boat back to NZ you will have duty to pay of 5% plus GST of 15%.
However the assessed value will be less as the boat is then used. They seem to be quite generous on the depreciation rates applied.
However 20% is a fair lump and you may be better selling it in Thailand or thereabouts and buying something else in NZ. For us the boat that we wanted to do a long voyage on (5 years in our case) wasn't really the boat we wanted back here.
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