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Old 10-06-2014, 06:02 PM   #21
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I do not remember the name brand of the cherry sport fisher...but a big un., twin 8/92,s The buyer wanted DD because they will run on really shitt##y fuel. Hell it is routine to change oil and put it in the fuel tanks. She was put on a ship to East Africa. Da boy knew what he was doing.
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Old 10-06-2014, 10:58 PM   #22
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DD's vs Perks

Still about even... I talked to a friend in the logging industry here in B.C. DD's are used extensively in boom boats, skidders etc. He said you just can't kill them. I'll talk to a friend who worked for Cullen Detroit Diesel. I'm sure he can shed any light needed on the nuances of the Jimmies.
Getting close to making an offer.

Murray
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Old 10-06-2014, 11:52 PM   #23
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We have the "Range 4" 6354 Turbo's (200HP) in our 1986 CHB 42. What year is the Boat? Year built and HP will determine your maintenance exposure..... Be sure to have a COMPLETE engine survey by an experienced Perkins Mechanic before you purchase. Maintenance will become a nightmare if you have to replace the mani-coolers (Perkins no longer sources these and the aftermarket units are ~$5K each). Our engines have ~3600 Hrs (mani's replaced 3 years ago by PO) crank instantly and run strong with very little oil burn or smoke.....we have no mufflers and the noise level is acceptable.
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Old 10-07-2014, 12:05 AM   #24
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DD's vs Perks

The boat is a 1976 model, DD engines are original, 2600 hrs. Not many hours for a boat of that vintage. I would never consider dumping crankcase oil into the fuel tanks, I can afford good fuel. I had a look at the engines and heard them run. They were spotless. No oil leaks apparent. Getting close to making an offer...

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Old 10-07-2014, 06:13 AM   #25
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The DD parts will still be aviliable 40 years from now , Perekins? Doubtful.
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Old 10-07-2014, 03:07 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saltcod View Post
The boat is a 1976 model, DD engines are original, 2600 hrs. Not many hours for a boat of that vintage.
Murray
Did you look at the other boat and compare them against each other and are they the same style? Is this a 41' sedan or aft cabin boat?

Don't forget you want to do a sea trial either before or contingent to an offer and run the boat up hard for 30 minutes or so and make sure it runs smoothly, normal pressures and temperatures. Recheck the engines and drip pans after the run for any signs of water or oil leaks.

If the other boat is about the same age, the Perkins engines will most likely be T6.354-M 165 - 185 HP, no manicoolers.

The manicoolers (combined multichanger) were on much later engines. Those engines were designated 6.354.4 (Range 4).

For you Perkins guys with Range 4 engines. . . Marine Exhaust Systems of Alabama (MESA Marine) is developing a complete kit to phase out the old manicooler style exchanger. They're planned for sale in 2015 and should bring the cost down substantially.
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Old 10-07-2014, 06:15 PM   #27
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Make sure the engines are propped properly and can attain rated rpm.

Don't let anyone gloss over this issue.
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Old 10-07-2014, 09:17 PM   #28
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Been running 1984 vintage Perkins range 4 6.354 for 8 years. Approx 2,600 hrs. No significant issues with them. One starter replacement, one alternator and a freshwater pump.
My biggest gripe is the amount of smoke they put out while warming up. Tried a few things to lessen the amount, but no change. Once they hit around 150deg. it pretty much is gone. I did install block heaters a few years ago and that has made a big difference, but I don't leave them on all the time, and it takes 4 hours or so to heat up the block enough to make a significant difference. To me, that is the trade-off of owning a 30 year old trawler that I go into for a lot less than a newer model.
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Old 10-08-2014, 05:52 AM   #29
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Once they hit around 150deg. it pretty much is gone.

This is usually a worn out cylinders or stuck rings.

The smoke and a bit of extra oil consumption is the downside.

Mechanics are expensive , oil is cheap , with onlr 2600 hours , it will operate for another 2600 easily , but change the oil more often to help with the combustion products pushed into the crank case while it is smoking.

An oil sample on oil change might give a snapshor of the wear .
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Old 10-08-2014, 08:18 AM   #30
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Again FF hits another home run...
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Old 10-09-2014, 06:43 AM   #31
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One advantage of the larger Detroits is the air box covers.

Removing them does allow cylinder and piston inspection ,

but for seasonal boaters the access to the cylinders allows fogging fluid to simply be sprayed into each cylinder.

This prevents the cylinders from rusting , and is impossible to do on other engine brands.

This is one reason there are so many OLD Detroits still running strong,
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Old 10-09-2014, 09:14 AM   #32
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Most diesels have a dished piston crown and I've often wondered how one would get a good dose of the carbon eating stuff called "Sea Foam" down around the rings. A slant or a V type engine may be helpful but w a vertical engine I would think the Sea Foam fluid/oil would just sit in the depression on the piston crown. Anybody addressed this and managed to get the fluid down to the rings where it needs to be?
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Old 10-09-2014, 09:45 PM   #33
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I sat with Billy Proctor (a Broughton legend) and discussed DD. He has a 471 in his trawler Ocean Dawn. Been fishing and logging for many years with it. He claims close to 100k hours. Said he used to change the oil every few hundred hours but now does it very few years. He figures that since he is always adding that it is being changed all the time! Probably going to rebuild it this Winter and wouldn't think of any other make. All the while we were talking the motor was running and sounded great.
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Old 10-10-2014, 02:31 AM   #34
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I love it when someone starts a discussion about a Jimmy against anything else!

"saltcod" as you're seeing from the replies, all engines have tradeoffs, but one thing that I can tell you from first-hand is that if you have the DDs in your bilge, and you expect to live for another 50 years, then you will be running the same engines until your end of days… and that's with poor maintenance

Mine were 50 years old and the worst problem was that the aluminum blocks had suffered from electrolytic corrosion on the seats of the water seals between block/head. I cleaned them up, squared them up with JB Weld, new gaskets, dropped the heads back on, and continued cruising without anymore problems.

Don't get scared away about comments about dripping oil. Place a small tin can under the breather tubes and wipe down you engine every now and then (like a good sailor should anyway).

Yes you can recycle engine oil back into your fuel tanks but I don't remember what the ratio was. If you're long range cruising and have to change two engines every 200 hrs then you might investigate those Puradyn or similar units that eliminate oil changes. Anyone have experience with those?

However, you should think about replacing the air boxes with air intake silencers (perhaps something from the trucking industry) and then upgrade the engine room sound absorption. Guy I knew ripped up his decorative sole, laid down a dense layer of 1/2" rubber matting and then another layer of 3/4" ply on top of that. Triple layer floor helped wonders.

Good luck on your purchase.
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Old 10-13-2014, 06:43 PM   #35
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Thanks for all the opinions, guys. I finally was able to talk to my friend Tom, who has 40 years experience as a diesel mechanic, a lot of it on boats. Not to hurt anybodies feelings but having extensive experience with both DD's and Perks, he recommended the DD's. Cheaper and more plentiful parts, more reliable, easier to work on and last forever. He also said they were noisy, that they leak, and if you start using ether the start them, you'll never stop. Just waiting to hear on an offer we made for the CC41.
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Old 10-13-2014, 08:16 PM   #36
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This conversation has changed my view of DD......thanks guys..
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Old 10-13-2014, 10:00 PM   #37
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Quote:
Yes you can recycle engine oil back into your fuel tanks but I don't remember what the ratio was.
Actually, DD goes out of their way to specifically prohibit this in their manual.
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Old 10-13-2014, 11:14 PM   #38
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[QUOTE=caltexflanc;275633]Actually, DD goes out of their way to specifically prohibit this in their manual.[/QUOTE

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Old 10-13-2014, 11:25 PM   #39
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I wonder how a 2-53 would fly in Willy?
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Old 10-14-2014, 06:45 AM   #40
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I know a few old fishermen who love the sound of screaming Jimmies,none of them will say anything against them.

I have a pair of 8v71n's in my current boat,they are the very models of reliability.
About the only thing I have to add to the discussion is don't fill them more than half way between the marks on the dipstick,keeps the oil loss down a lot.

My second favourite engine is the old 6 cylinder Ford Lehman,great motor that with normal TLC goes a long way.

I grew up with Gardners which go forever and are probably the most economical diesel engines you can get, mindblowingly expensive to overhaul though.
The sort of engines you leave to your kids in your will.
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