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Old 02-03-2016, 04:36 PM   #21
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I get the impression some folks are using the words pilothouse and lower helm (interior helm) interchangeably?

Don't know about that. So far as I'm aware, a pilothouse and a lower helm are two different things. Unless perhaps if one has a pilothouse boat with a flying bridge above that in which case the pilothouse helm could be considered the lower helm.

But to me a pilothouse boat is a boat with a raised pilothouse that is some level higher than the main deck/main cabin of the boat. It's a configuration.

Lower helm is just a position description to my way of thinking. Our boat has a flying bridge helm and a lower helm which is at the forward end of the main cabin.

We have no use for operating our boat from the flying bridge even though it has a full helm and engine instrument setup. We originally operated from the flying bridge in good weather when we first got the boat but several events plus the fact we decided that nether of us like the sight picture from up there for close-in maneuvering caused us to operate only from the lower helm.

A pilothouse boat, however, solves all our issues including the poor sight picture and deck access limitations of a flying bridge.
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Old 02-03-2016, 05:01 PM   #22
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Greetings,
We have a PH but it is NOT raised. It is separate from the galley and saloon.
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Old 02-03-2016, 05:44 PM   #23
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Greetings,
We have a PH but it is NOT raised. It is separate from the galley and saloon.
Good point. I suppose one could say, then, that the correct definition of a pilothouse is more along the lines of a separate compartment used for controlling the boat. As opposed to a control station that's incorporated into a compartment that also serves other functions like a saloon/galley/etc.

As such a pilothouse can be higher, level with or even lower than the compartments adjacent to it.
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Old 02-03-2016, 06:02 PM   #24
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Greetings,
Mr. Marin. Correct. When doing night passages, crew can carry on in the saloon and the PH remains dark. Great for feeding/watering the crew on watch.
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Old 02-03-2016, 06:05 PM   #25
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We have a trawler with an upper helm on the flybridge, great for nice days but useless for docking etc. It's nice to have everyone in the cabin together but it can get close. No pilothouse, which would be nice for visibility. There's a blind sport for me, because I'm short, so I am constantly needing to scoot forward or open the helm door and stick my head out to see better.

I really like the new Helmsman Camano 31. We looked at Camano Troll when we bought our trawler, and loved the visibility from the helm, but the cabin felt a little cheesy for the price. The new ones have enough wood inside (still no brightwork) to really add a homelike feel, and they're well laid-out. The visibility from the helm is wonderful. The cockpit is small than we'd like, but it works for two people.
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Old 02-03-2016, 06:08 PM   #26
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Greetings,
Welcome aboard.
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Old 02-03-2016, 06:09 PM   #27
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Thanks!
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Old 02-03-2016, 06:52 PM   #28
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Boat designs are tailored to the market, the main segment of the market. That means that those with eclectic or non-mainstream tastes will have to look harder. I would not expect the owner of a Devlin 48 to be attracted to they typical production boat.

There are variations within those boats that look on the surface to be the same but none of them stray far from the base.

We all have such different tastes. I can fully appreciate the beauty of eyschulman's boat. That doesn't translate into me wanting to purchase similar. Honestly, if that suddenly became mainstream then it would detract from the entire Devlin persona. Likewise, we can appreciate all the boats at a trawlerfest, but we're not customers for anything that won't cruise at 20 knots. We are not mainstream either in terms of the long range cruising market.

We love Riva's, but I can imagine most here going to a show, seeing one, liking or not liking the style, but wondering why in the world would anyone want to buy such a thing. A gas guzzler boat with speed and so little space and definitely not made for fishing.
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Old 02-03-2016, 06:54 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by debbiet View Post
We have a trawler with an upper helm on the flybridge, great for nice days but useless for docking etc. It's nice to have everyone in the cabin together but it can get close. No pilothouse, which would be nice for visibility. There's a blind sport for me, because I'm short, so I am constantly needing to scoot forward or open the helm door and stick my head out to see better.

I really like the new Helmsman Camano 31. We looked at Camano Troll when we bought our trawler, and loved the visibility from the helm, but the cabin felt a little cheesy for the price. The new ones have enough wood inside (still no brightwork) to really add a homelike feel, and they're well laid-out. The visibility from the helm is wonderful. The cockpit is small than we'd like, but it works for two people.
Get a camera. They aren't that expensive and then you'll be able to see your stern. No reason to continue with a blind spot.
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Old 02-03-2016, 08:16 PM   #30
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There is a relatively new wrinkle in the equation regarding visibility and docking. No mater if a boat has a fly-bridge raised pilot house or not, the entry of reliable wireless control trumps all else in my opinion. I have owned and extensively used a wireless Yacht Controller system for two years now for what is single handing of my 52 ft LAO boat. I typically back into my home slip and have used it in all types of tight BC docking situations. The beauty of the system is that I can move to either side fore or aft and closely observe all maneuvers. I can step off the boat and still control it while I handle lines. For those who fear wireless just check out boat yards where the travel lift operator is walking behind or in front of the lift or more critical those big cranes at construction sites and other heavy equipment may be on wireless. Yes there were some early growing pains with this technology but that is old history.
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Old 02-03-2016, 08:18 PM   #31
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There is a relatively new wrinkle in the equation regarding visibility and docking. No mater if a boat has a fly-bridge raised pilot house or not, the entry of reliable wireless control trumps all else in my opinion. I have owned and extensively used a wireless Yacht Controller system for two years now for what is single handing of my 52 ft LAO boat. I typically back into my home slip and have used it in all types of tight BC docking situations. The beauty of the system is that I can move to either side fore or aft and closely observe all maneuvers. I can step off the boat and still control it while I handle lines. For those who fear wireless just check out boat yards where the travel lift operator is walking behind or in front of the lift or more critical those big cranes at construction sites and other heavy equipment may be on wireless. Yes there were some early growing pains with this technology but that is old history.
Good point. We have the same and it's very helpful. Docking stern in or med docking, it's just the best possible tool.
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Old 02-03-2016, 08:33 PM   #32
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Boat designs are tailored to the market, the main segment of the market. That means that those with eclectic or non-mainstream tastes will have to look harder.
*Sweeping Generalization Alert*

I believe the boat buying public can be divided into three basic groups;

1) those which look at a vessel and think to themselves, "That's one good looking boat...looks like it'll fit our budget and carry us safely in about the worst conditions where we intend to travel without compromising comfort too much",

2) those which say to themselves, "That's one good looking boat...looks like it will fit our budget, be really comfortable, and has all the extras I want", and

3) those which say to themselves, "That's one good looking boat...I bet all the heads will be turning when I pull into the marina".

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Old 02-03-2016, 08:40 PM   #33
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*Sweeping Generalization Alert*

I believe the boat buying public can be divided into three basic groups;

1) those which look at a vessel and think to themselves, "That's one good looking boat...looks like it'll fit our budget and carry us safely in about the worst conditions where we intend to travel without compromising comfort too much",

2) those which say to themselves, "That's one good looking boat...looks like it will fit our budget, be really comfortable, and has all the extras I want", and

3) those which say to themselves, "That's one good looking boat...I bet all the heads will be turning when I pull into the marina".

For the retired Mom and Pop market I think the comfort equation is a major factor pushing new trawler and many other power boat marketing schemes. I don't think its all one way. Sales pitches will throw in economy-value and safety weather they are there or not..
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Old 02-03-2016, 08:42 PM   #34
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Zackly. Most new buyers fall under number 3.
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Old 02-03-2016, 08:44 PM   #35
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If you guys are talking trawlers or even broader "cruising boats"...I think you are talking a very small part of the boating market.
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Old 02-03-2016, 08:50 PM   #36
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If you guys are talking trawlers or even broader "cruising boats"...I think you are talking a very small part of the boating market.
Well the vast majority of boats are small trailer types and OB kept in a garage or drive way. No way we can be dealing with them on a Trawler Forum. A very big market but would not apply here.
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Old 02-03-2016, 08:50 PM   #37
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Greetings,
Mr. MM. No need to hide. That is a very astute observation that could be applied to almost any member of the buying public....

Take cars for example:

1)



2)




And we've ALL seen an example of #3...
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Old 02-03-2016, 08:52 PM   #38
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If you guys are talking trawlers or even broader "cruising boats"...I think you are talking a very small part of the boating market.
Talking a small part of the market and a conservative group. Those that fit into the looking good #3 aren't the target audience at Trawlerfest.

Custom boats are also a very small segment of the market.
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Old 02-03-2016, 09:08 PM   #39
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There is a relatively new wrinkle in the equation regarding visibility and docking. No mater if a boat has a fly-bridge raised pilot house or not, the entry of reliable wireless control trumps all else in my opinion. I have owned and extensively used a wireless Yacht Controller system for two years now for what is single handing of my 52 ft LAO boat. I typically back into my home slip and have used it in all types of tight BC docking situations. The beauty of the system is that I can move to either side fore or aft and closely observe all maneuvers. I can step off the boat and still control it while I handle lines. For those who fear wireless just check out boat yards where the travel lift operator is walking behind or in front of the lift or more critical those big cranes at construction sites and other heavy equipment may be on wireless. Yes there were some early growing pains with this technology but that is old history.
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Good point. We have the same and it's very helpful. Docking stern in or med docking, it's just the best possible tool.
Have to laugh. The marina where I was hauled out on Monday, has a wireless remote for there 75 ton travel lift. The remote stopped working as they were moving my boat across the yard. There is a reason all the controls on the remote are on the travel lift in a manual version. Wireless remotes in critical applications will be deemed reliable when there are no manual controls on the unit or a second wireless control.

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Old 02-03-2016, 09:28 PM   #40
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*Sweeping Generalization Alert*

I believe the boat buying public can be divided into three basic groups;

1) those which look at a vessel and think to themselves, "That's one good looking boat...looks like it'll fit our budget and carry us safely in about the worst conditions where we intend to travel without compromising comfort too much",

2) those which say to themselves, "That's one good looking boat...looks like it will fit our budget, be really comfortable, and has all the extras I want", and

3) those which say to themselves, "That's one good looking boat...I bet all the heads will be turning when I pull into the marina".

Murray:

I can't recall which one of those I said to myself. All I can remember is the moment where I said: "Man, that's one good looking boat"!
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