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Old 12-22-2014, 07:41 PM   #1301
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Fisherman's best friend. Steveston lifeboat.
Unfortunately she sank in a storm last week. It was during a training cruise at night, but everybody got off as they were only a half-mile from the dock in Steveston.....
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Old 12-22-2014, 07:48 PM   #1302
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Unfortunately she sank in a storm last week. It was during a training cruise at night, but everybody got off as they were only a half-mile from the dock in Steveston.....
It's still alive ... needs new captain.

Damaged Steveston Lifeboat pulled from Fraser River - Professional Mariner - Web Bulletin 2014
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Old 12-22-2014, 09:03 PM   #1303
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Even considering the damage estimate of 250K or more, it'd be hard to replace such a boat for that price, save possibly a donation from the military.
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Old 12-22-2014, 09:07 PM   #1304
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So is this a government motor lifeboat or a private one? Or is it a Coast Guard Auxilliary boat? Doesn't paint too good a picture for a lifesaving crew to hit a rock wall in their home waters....
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Old 12-22-2014, 09:14 PM   #1305
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Here's the skinny. Looks more like $100K now, with mostly electronics.
http://www.richmondreview.com/news/2...tml?print=true
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Old 12-22-2014, 10:33 PM   #1306
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So it sounds like a totally volunteer, non-government organization that owns and operates the boat. Is that correct?
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Old 12-22-2014, 10:39 PM   #1307
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So it sounds like a totally volunteer, non-government organization that owns and operates the boat. Is that correct?
Correct
Canadian Lifeboat Institution – Our Mission
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Old 12-22-2014, 11:09 PM   #1308
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Thanks, West, for the information. Interesting that they pattern themselves after the RNLI, an organization I know a fair amount about having friends serving with it. The CLI even uses the RNLI's paint scheme on their boats.

But..... there is one huge difference, and I think it's a significant one. While there is no age limit to being a member of the RNLI, there is an age limit to who can serve on the boats themselves. If I remember correctly, the cutoff age is either 45 or 50.

The reason was effectively illustrated in the writeup of the Steveston boat's grounding. There is mention of the difficulty of gettting some of the crew off because of their age and associated mobility problems.

While it's all politically correct and stuff to talk about age not being a limitation, the fact is it very much can be. The RNLI goes out in hideous weather at great risk to their own crews to save lives off the coasts of England, Scotland, and Wales. To be on a boat in heaving waves and high winds demands a certain (quite high) level of mobility, strength, coordination, and quick reflexes. Hence the maximum age limit to being on a boat crew in the RNLI.

The CLI obviously has no such limit as evidenced by the crew of the Steveston boat. While I don't believe in an age limit for individuals operating their own boats, I don't feel that way about people operating boats that are intended to act as lifesaving vessels in all weather and sea conditions. To have a lifesaving crew impaired by mobility issues-- which was apparently the case here--- trying to do a job which by its very nature demands a high level of physical strength, coordination, and dexterity is, in my opinion, a really bad idea. Not only are they putting themselves at risk, they are putting the people they're trying to assist at an even greater risk than they're experiencing already.

Frankly, I think the Canadian government should throw the book at these folks as a result of this accident, as well-intentioned as CLI members undoubtably are, and force them to do what the RNLI does: ensure that their boat crews are physically up to par. That doesn't mean their less physically fit members can't assist the CLI's endeavors with whatever skills they may have. Like the older RNLI memers, they just can't go out on the boats.

Otherwise it's just a matter of time before a CLI boat crew member, or worse, a boater they're trying to assist, is seriously injured or killed because a CLI crew member wasn't physicallly up to the job.

Age sucks, but there's no getting around the fact that it happens. I think the CLI needs to take a realistic view of what they're doing and change their practices..
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Old 12-22-2014, 11:18 PM   #1309
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Totally agree. They should be up to Firemen standards.
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Old 12-23-2014, 07:15 PM   #1310
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Their community. Their risks. Their trade offs. Their lives to live or not. Glad they are ok. Hope they get their boat fixed. They will figure out if they need a new skipper and if they need to update their rules.
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Old 12-23-2014, 07:23 PM   #1311
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It's the government fobbing off their responsibilities by closing Coast Guard stations. The volunteers are trying to fill a gap. If the entire boat was staffed by paraplegics it would be better than nothing.

Our Conservative government is big on lip-service for our military and quasi-military institutions, bangs a big drum over Arctic Sovereignty, then guts the programs.

We have about a dozen useful military ships and a couple of leaky submarines, slightly better than North Korea's rusty and leaky submarines, but that's it.

It looked to me like that cutter was made of wood?
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Old 12-23-2014, 07:46 PM   #1312
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XsBank;
But what do we get w all our aircraft carriers and bombers?
We are respected and loved throughout the world. Hmmmmmm
If our government gets any worse I'm coming/going back to Canada.
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Old 12-24-2014, 03:28 AM   #1313
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Xsbank-a leaky submarine is a scary thought!
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Old 12-24-2014, 01:12 PM   #1314
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It is a scary thought, some of our guys have been hurt and killed driving those old POS submarines we bought from the Brits. They were smart enough to know when they were obsolete. Should have sold them to North Korea.

Our navy is rusting away. The government announced huge money for a round of shipbuilding, much to-do about which yards won the contracts, now they haven't released the money so most of the yards that won are either building little patrol boats or are idle, sitting on the new equipment needed to build the ships.

Why is it, that as soon as you add a bureaucracy to something, government couldn't run a hot-dog stand?

Our Arctic Sovereignty, protect the Northwest Passage claptrap is backed up by some Inuit hunters with Lee Enfield rifles. Nothing against the Inuit, but really?

Somebody famous said "...you can't make this stuff up!"
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Old 12-24-2014, 01:49 PM   #1315
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It is a scary thought, some of our guys have been hurt and killed driving those old POS submarines we bought from the Brits. They were smart enough to know when they were obsolete. Should have sold them to North Korea.

Our navy is rusting away. The government announced huge money for a round of shipbuilding, much to-do about which yards won the contracts, now they haven't released the money so most of the yards that won are either building little patrol boats or are idle, sitting on the new equipment needed to build the ships.

Why is it, that as soon as you add a bureaucracy to something, government couldn't run a hot-dog stand?

Our Arctic Sovereignty, protect the Northwest Passage claptrap is backed up by some Inuit hunters with Lee Enfield rifles. Nothing against the Inuit, but really?

Somebody famous said "...you can't make this stuff up!"
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Old 12-26-2014, 12:13 PM   #1316
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Nice looking boat ... Alyeska
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Old 12-26-2014, 04:26 PM   #1317
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It is a scary thought, some of our guys have been hurt and killed driving those old POS submarines we bought from the Brits. They were smart enough to know when they were obsolete. Should have sold them to North Korea.

Our navy is rusting away. The government announced huge money for a round of shipbuilding, much to-do about which yards won the contracts, now they haven't released the money so most of the yards that won are either building little patrol boats or are idle, sitting on the new equipment needed to build the ships.

Why is it, that as soon as you add a bureaucracy to something, government couldn't run a hot-dog stand?

Our Arctic Sovereignty, protect the Northwest Passage claptrap is backed up by some Inuit hunters with Lee Enfield rifles. Nothing against the Inuit, but really?

Somebody famous said "...you can't make this stuff up!"
In general I understand what you're saying. The subs were supposed to take on a Navy role in the Arctic. That hasn't happened because we can't get them operational(for a number of reasons, I believe people are as much a problem as the equipment) to a level that can do that.

That Federal money is building some new ships, the two joint support ships are under way in Vancouver. In about a year (maybe) the new Navy Arctic Patrol ships will start at Irving Shipyard in Newfoundland. Lord knows when or if the new Frigate project will get started. One new icebreaker will be built in Vancouver after the Navy support ships.

In the meantime the CCG has been playing a major role in the Arctic. Go to their website and look over the fleet and how it's being utilized. There are a lot of resources operating in the Arctic without too much fanfare and very little support. I think they deserve considerable credit for doing a huge job with a limited budget.
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Old 12-26-2014, 05:28 PM   #1318
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The 1986 Sir Wilfred Laurier still has a bunch of years left.
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Old 12-27-2014, 10:37 PM   #1319
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Now called the RCMSAR, Royal Canadian Marine Search and Rescue, used to be the CCG Auxiliary. The CLI is a similar group that has been around for a while also but tends to work the river, Fraser and area.

None of them get any support, other than some training maybe and I mean maybe, from the CCG, alias the Canadian Government.

These groups must now raise their own money, purchase the equipment from that money, and for the most part pay their own way. I can't swear to it but only a very few, if any, get paid. Upon returning home I will ask.

They are mostly volunteers who, through necessity, are retired because very few , still working people , can afford the time and loss of wages.
It's not surprising that too many of them are reaching an age that they should no longer be out there. On the other hand if they, the retirees, were not then there would be almost no one, or at least huge gaps in the coverage. They put themselves at risk and several have been seriously injured or killed in the process trying to fill that gap.

I know several people who are members of the the RCMSAR so although not highly knowledgeable , have a bit of info.

So I agree with Xsbank, our Federal government gives great lip service but little or nothing to back it up.

The CCG itself does a great job whith what it has but that keeps getting reduced every few years, whether budget cuts directly or from refusal to keep up with inflation , which low as it is, still adds up over the years to a reduction in service.

So this unfortunate event with the CLI boat is a problem, it would be worse without those volunteers.

The problem is not with the volunteers but at a much higher level for allowing this situation to develop.

Many of those retirees realize the problem to themselves and are withdrawing from active service as they get too old, to be replaced with younger retirees, maybe.

Rant enough.
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Old 12-28-2014, 12:21 PM   #1320
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As you say, something is better than nothing. Besides, today's 65 is yesterday's 45.
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