ideal ocean crossing trawler yacht

[MRRiley]

I will admit, I have a bizarre fascination with big seas. I suppose I feel like I have something to prove, or maybe it's just suppressed juvenile aggression writ large, but I want to experience it. Maybe. I think.

I'm thinking you are likely to be ready for it to end as soon as it really gets going, but then you simply have to keep going till it's over.

I'd prefer endless days of boring at sea than being in the midst of a really good blow.

What's the old saying about never meeting an atheist in a fox hole? It applies to sailors as well...

 

[BandB]

Actually, my reply was meant to be light hearted or witty. As in "Why would you climb Everest?" ... Because it's there! I guess I failed in that attempt or it was lost in translation - sorry.


It just comes down to the size of the risk we are all willing to take as explorers. Really no right or wrong - just what each individual is comfortable with and that is how it should be.

I took yours as light hearted and witty.

As to the risk, I'm not a risk taker, but I am someone to work hard and figure out how to manage risks and minimize them. You're right that we all are different in comfort with various risks. There are things we do that others here wouldn't, but things others here do that I'd never consider.

 

[BandB]

I think the "why?" question is interesting. I don't get why people don't get why people want to do this kind of thing (did that make sense?)

Wifey B: Why do chickens cross the road?

 

[BruceK]

Those of us unlikely to do it, except like me on a massive cruise ship, should be allowed and forgiven a little fantasizing.
And,what do atheists have against foxes?

 

[BandB]

Those of us unlikely to do it, except like me on a massive cruise ship, should be allowed and forgiven a little fantasizing.
And,what do atheists have against foxes?

Wifey B:
A chicken ain’t chicken till it’s licking good fried
My uncle used to love me but she died

 

[Britannia]

I'm thinking you are likely to be ready for it to end as soon as it really gets going, but then you simply have to keep going till it's over.

I'd prefer endless days of boring at sea than being in the midst of a really good blow.

What's the old saying about never meeting an atheist in a fox hole? It applies to sailors as well...

Here are the three things you are thinking when you're in really bad conditions:

1) When will it end?
2) What if it gets worse?
3) What if something breaks?

Some risk won't stop me from going out, but I don't actively seek big seas.

Richard

 

[Art]

When getting into trouble from wind driven seas, and there is a piece of land available, you can take your boat into calmer conditions my traveling into the "lee of the land" where the land acts as a buffer between your boat and the wind. "Lee of the land" signifies that you are on the opposite (calm) side of land compared to the side of land being buffeted by oncoming winds (and waves). Thusly your boat becomes much more protected from wind driven waves while being in the "lee of the land" pressure-drop area.

 

[BruceK]

Lee Shore used to live 2 blocks from us. Or was that Harry?
A "lee shore" is that nasty place which looked so nice when you anchored,that you are going to get blown/washed onto by the now onshore wind and wind waves if your anchoring fails. A place best avoided.

 

[Peter B]

Those of us unlikely to do it, except like me on a massive cruise ship, should be allowed and forgiven a little fantasizing.
And,what do atheists have against foxes?

Yes, I was wondering about that bit as well.

However, the whys and wherefores about risk-taking is a fascinating subject. I put it down to imagination, or lack of it. By that I mean the ability of someone to imagine just what might go wrong, versus those who don't think about that so much. Then there's one's instinct for self-preservation. For example, lots of folk like sky-diving. My take on it is why would you want to jump out of a perfectly good aeroplane..? I also have no desire to climb mountains, as it is so damn cold, and is a long way down, and the view from a perfectly good aeroplane is even better and it's warm in there.

However, I must admit to a bit of an adrenaline buzz after weathering a nasty sea trip. But I have to admit the real buzz is when it's over, because it's a bit like hitting your head against a brick wall - it's great when you stop...

 

[Codger2]

Actually, my reply was meant to be light hearted or witty. As in "Why would you climb Everest?" ... Because it's there! I guess I failed in that attempt or it was lost in translation - sorry. .

No need to apologize as I did take it as such. It did, however, prompt me to address the difference between "planning to cross an ocean in a less than a 50ft vessel vs. fantasizing to cross the same ocean. I was in the Navy and crossed an ocean in a very nice vessel which I would do again, in a heart beat! We encountered seas of 25 feet or more with little trouble and I don't recall anyone suffering from sea sickness. Yes, the USS Enterprise was quite a ship!

 

[Art]

Lee Shore used to live 2 blocks from us. Or was that Harry?
A "lee shore" is that nasty place which looked so nice when you anchored,that you are going to get blown/washed onto by the now onshore wind and wind waves if your anchoring fails. A place best avoided.

Simply said:

Be it any item - boat, island, jetty, peninsula, buoy, tree-in-forest, house, telephone pole, person standing still... or any other solid item...

Side of any item where wind is hitting is Windward Side.

Side of any item where wind is not hitting is Lee Side

Happy Side Daze! - Art

 

[sunchaser]

the terms "lee shore" and "windward" or "ward shore" are nautical terms used to describe a stretch of shoreline. A lee shore is one that is to the lee side of a vessel — meaning the wind is blowing towards it. Wikipedia

ted

huh?

 

[Nomad Willy]

Just to clarify on the whole lee shore thing:

I think some of the confusion is based on where you are. If you're on a boat, the lee shore is the one on your leeward side - with the wind blowing towards it. However, if you're on the island then it is called a windward shore, and it's on the windward side of the island. The wind is still blowing towards it.

Richard

Richard,
What a guy,
Nailed it ... and in so few words. Frequently few words is more clear and I try to be clear explaining w many words. Perhaps I should be "manywords" instead of manyboats? Anyway thanks for the very clear post.

 

[Wxx3]

Way to avoid the question. So you'd call all the Nordhavn's here small, regardless of size? And the Diesel Duck? And the KK's? What is the size at which you'd call large enough?

I know for some it's 400', for some it's 50'. We all have different ideas on it. But since you used the word, I was curious as to your interpretation. Or are you saying you'd consider all boats here to be too small for that?

My own answer is two fold. I would not personally cross the Atlantic in anything under 100', although I recognize many boats under that size that are fully capable. There are several boats owned on this site I'd consider capable but wouldn't personally do it. I suspect you wouldn't do it in anything short of a cruise ship and nothing at all wrong with that if so.

Totally agree. It's all in the mindset.

And my mindset comes as much from the books I have read as anything else. That works for me. Some have crossed the Atlantic in a rowboat, I wouldn't do that. I'd die of boredom.

But the simple fact is a lot more large ships have sunk in the Atlantic than small boats.

So, it's in your mind what you feel like doing or not. I don't criticize others for not wanting to go far offshore, just as I wouldn't criticize someone at the beach who was afraid of the waves.

I'm afraid of the f...ing dark. Really afraid.

TF loses it's usefulness when too many criticize others to justify their own decisions.

 

[Ted]

I always told my kids and grandkids
You don't have to be afraid of the dark
The dark won't hurt you
IT'S WHAT'S IN THE DARK YOU HAVE TO BE AFRAID OF!!
I wasn't always poular.

Ted

 

[stornoway7]

Here's today's new favourite for me,it's a Ned 70.
A bit like a Euro style FPB.
I'll just go check my bank account.

 

[Peter B]

No need to apologize as I did take it as such. It did, however, prompt me to address the difference between "planning to cross an ocean in a less than a 50ft vessel vs. fantasizing to cross the same ocean. I was in the Navy and crossed an ocean in a very nice vessel which I would do again, in a heart beat! We encountered seas of 25 feet or more with little trouble and I don't recall anyone suffering from sea sickness. Yes, the USS Enterprise was quite a ship!

Now Walt, that right there, was great come-back. A really cool gazzump..!

 

[Peter B]

Richard,
What a guy,
Nailed it ... and in so few words. Frequently few words is more clear and I try to be clear explaining w many words. Perhaps I should be "manywords" instead of manyboats? Anyway thanks for the very clear post.

Actually, I have always wished you'd go back to being 'Nomad Willy', like in the hey day of PMM, Eric. It sounds sort of friendlier, and more like I imagine you, and I doubt you've really had all that many boats. But what do I know..? It could be arranged though...the name change I mean...not how many boats, 'many' actually is.

 

[psneeld]

For the record..the windward side of an island is the "Lee shore" or the place you will wind up if your engine quits.

From my experience...there are rough conditions and survival conditions.

In rough conditions many things can be done to make it better and safer....each boat is a bit different and different techniques may or may not work.

In survival conditions you have no idea how your boat will react unless you have already tried some different techniques in extraordinarily rough conditions. I have not and hope never to...I would say the same is true of 90 plus percent of TFers and most skippers in general. They may have been in really bad conditions...but not necessarily in their boat.

Survival conditions are conditions where the boat is just about out of control and mostly needs external means of directional stability beyond propulsion to survive. It also means your superstructure and openings better be strong enough to survive many hours of direct green water beating.

Inlet waves are rarely similar to open water waves. Open water waves in certain areas of high currents can approach shallow water breaking waves but still rarely get as steep or curl as much. Going out is almost always easier/safer than coming in a breaking inlet.

So it boils down to the skipper and the ability to apply the right corrective action as quickly as possible. There are usually 2 kinds of skippers in survival conditions. Those that their boats make it and those whose boats don't. Just because your boat doesn't make it doesn't mean you automatically die...unless you believe in going down with the ship.

Blindly following what one skipper has done in a particular boat is no solution for success...it could be the complete opposite for your situation...it is almost luck more than anything that allows your "survival".....lots of experience just give the slight edge.

Survival conditions for many vessels are only rough conditions for others....hopefully you are in a vessel that suits the conditions as they are happening.

 

[Art]

For the record..the windward side of an island is the "Lee shore" or the place you will wind up if your engine quits.

From my experience...there are rough conditions and survival conditions.

In rough conditions many things can be done to make it better and safer....each boat is a bit different and different techniques may or may not work.

In survival conditions you have no idea how your boat will react unless you have already tried some different techniques in extraordinarily rough conditions. I have not and hope never to...I would say the same is true of 90 plus percent of TFers and most skippers in general. They may have been in really bad conditions...but not necessarily in their boat.

Survival conditions are conditions where the boat is just about out of control and mostly needs external means of directional stability beyond propulsion to survive. It also means your superstructure and openings better be strong enough to survive many hours of direct green water beating.

Inlet waves are rarely similar to open water waves. Open water waves in certain areas of high currents can approach shallow water breaking waves but still rarely get as steep or curl as much. Going out is almost always easier/safer than coming in a breaking inlet.

So it boils down to the skipper and the ability to apply the right corrective action as quickly as possible. There are usually 2 kinds of skippers in survival conditions. Those that their boats make it and those whose boats don't. Just because your boat doesn't make it doesn't mean you automatically die...unless you believe in going down with the ship.

Blindly following what one skipper has done in a particular boat is no solution for success...it could be the complete opposite for your situation...it is almost luck more than anything that allows your "survival".....lots of experience just give the slight edge.

Survival conditions for many vessels are only rough conditions for others....hopefully you are in a vessel that suits the conditions as they are happening.

Everything... Extremely well put.

Also, sentence at bottom of your fifth paragraph in quote above is extremely important, to me, and should be to everyone... I know about this structural factor from mid Century times in my youth on New England East Coast.

Too many do not realize what actually happens when a boat gets overcome by turbulent cross waves with wind swept top of wave white-cap breakers slamming into a rolling small craft's superstructure on both front and side.

I'd like to know just how many boats were lost in rough seas because the superstructure failed (windows especially) and the boat swamped; never to be seen again.

 

[Nomad Willy]

Actually, I have always wished you'd go back to being 'Nomad Willy', like in the hey day of PMM, Eric. It sounds sort of friendlier, and more like I imagine you, and I doubt you've really had all that many boats. But what do I know..? It could be arranged though...the name change I mean...not how many boats, 'many' actually is.

Peter,
I think you're right this time around. I'll keep the same avatar for good member identity. I have at least 10 boats and I heard the "manyboats" somewhere else .. can't remember where and thought it was a hoot. So after leaving TF for a few months I came back "born again" as manyboats.

So Peter make the change whenever you have time. Please make it as you've typed in your post #228 "Nomad Willy". The Willard model name is "Nomad" as in Willard Nomad and after we called her "Willy" while we were shopping for boats .. in time it stuck. That's the "ancestry.com" of the name Nomad Willy. Thank you Peter.

 

[Peter B]

Peter,
I think you're right this time around. I'll keep the same avatar for good member identity. I have at least 10 boats and I heard the "manyboats" somewhere else .. can't remember where and thought it was a hoot. So after leaving TF for a few months I came back "born again" as manyboats.

So Peter make the change whenever you have time. Please make it as you've typed in your post #228 "Nomad Willy". The Willard model name is "Nomad" as in Willard Nomad and after we called her "Willy" while we were shopping for boats .. in time it stuck. That's the "ancestry.com" of the name Nomad Willy. Thank you Peter.

Ok, Eric, you surprised me there a bit actually, but I'm glad you feel that way. However, I have sent you a PM re it just to make absolutely sure it's ok before we hit the button. I think admin have to actually do it anyway.
Cheers Nomad Willy,

 

[BandB]

Ok, Eric, you surprised me there a bit actually, but I'm glad you feel that way. However, I have sent you a PM re it just to make absolutely sure it's ok before we hit the button. I think admin have to actually do it anyway.
Cheers Nomad Willy,

Wifey B: I always thought he would want to be manyanchors.

 

[Peter B]

Wifey B: I always thought he would want to be manyanchors.

Ah, well...we don't want to sink him. Besides the worthy anchor tester, Steve of Panope, probably has that moniker bagged now if he wanted it..?

 

[MurrayM]

Here's today's new favourite for me,it's a Ned 70.
A bit like a Euro style FPB.
I'll just go check my bank account.

Got an extra $2,000,000.00 or so kicking around?

2012 NED 70 Long Range Cruiser Power Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com

 

[Peter B]

Here's today's new favourite for me,it's a Ned 70.
A bit like a Euro style FPB.
I'll just go check my bank account.

No, no, no...Stornoway..your Cheoy Lee 66 has looks to die for, don't even think of it..! But if you feel you must, then I want first dibs at your boat. I'll just have to win Powerball first is all.

 

[stornoway7]

I've always been a bit of a boating tart.
I love long thin boats on the outside,however I always seem to wind up with boats that have a few more curves and pounds.
I have the same problem with women.
Deep down I'm built for comfort not speed.
Another problem I have is "I like big butts and I cannot lie."

 

[stornoway7]

MurrayM,I wonder if crowd funding would work in this instance ?
This is what happens on long wet days.
Damn you Yachtworld.

 

[bowball]

That Watson 72 is for sale for NZ$2.1mm

https://www.rdhmarinesubic.com/pdf/watson_72.pdf

I think I’d rather have a Delta 72 probably. Very appealing.

(Or for coastal cruising the Fleming 65 )

 

[long-cours.62]

In this range of price (ok after a "small" negociation) I will prefer this one
https://www.devalk.nl/en/yachtbrokerage/100701/OCEA-33.html