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Old 03-03-2012, 12:40 PM   #21
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How Slow Can I Go?

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Nsail wrote:*
I realize that this isn't a trawler, but thought I could just drive it slow and be as happy as we would be in a real trawler (and, if I ever needed the extra power, it's available). However, last night a friend of mine mentioned that I wouldn't be able to drive slow for very long stretches without damaging the engines (of course, the broker today told me that it wouldn't be a problem). This would be a deal killer.
*


*If you do a search for "75%" you'll see a thread listed entitled "engine loading."* That thread might start to answer your question.

The manufacturer of my 80-h.p., normally aspirated JD4045D warns not to idle for longer than five minutes at a time.* ...* Is it coincidental that operating at 75% (1900 RPM, or about 40 h.p.) of maximum RPM the engine runs "happy" and moves the*Coot about a knot under hull/maximum speed?*


-- Edited by markpierce on Saturday 3rd of March 2012 01:53:46 PM
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Old 03-03-2012, 06:24 PM   #22
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How Slow Can I Go?

I think of the hundreds of hours I have spent idling my Perkins engines while fishing and*trolling for salmon with one engine idling at 500 rpm.* That has been going on now since 1976 (35 plus years?)**By all accounts, If excessive idling diesels was that*harmful*my engines should have seized up years ago??*

Also what about all the tractor trailer rigs sitting at the truck stop near*my office, idling away all night long.* I always wonder why they do that, when diesel is nearly $4.00 a gal.* I guess those drivers must have large wallets can afford the fuel and*rebuild their engines every couple of years??

Larry B


-- Edited by Edelweiss on Saturday 3rd of March 2012 07:26:58 PM
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Old 03-03-2012, 06:27 PM   #23
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How Slow Can I Go?

I agree, Larry, it is a wonder, but then your engine-builder may have different advisories.


-- Edited by markpierce on Saturday 3rd of March 2012 07:39:25 PM
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Old 03-03-2012, 06:47 PM   #24
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RE: How Slow Can I Go?

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Edelweiss wrote:
Also what about all the tractor trailer rigs sitting at the truck stop near*my office, idling away all night long.* I always wonder why they do that, when diesel is nearly $4.00 a gal.* I guess those drivers must have large wallets can afford the fuel and*rebuild their engines every couple of years??
*It is tax deductible!* (Deductible from gross income, that is.)* Or perhaps their employer pays for the fuel.)
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Old 03-03-2012, 06:54 PM   #25
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How Slow Can I Go?

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Edelweiss wrote:
*

Also what about all the tractor trailer rigs sitting at the truck stop near*my office, idling away all night long.* I always wonder why they do that, when diesel is nearly $4.00 a gal.
First, make sure it's actually the tractor that's running, not a trailer refrigeration unit which often has it's own engine and can be almost as loud as the tractor's engine.

Second, in cold weather it can be better in the long run to let the tractor engines continue to run than to shut them off and face a cold start later.* For example, I read an article years ago in the New Yorker about the truckers who hauled oilfield equipment during the winter from manufacturers in Texas to the North Slope oil wells after the pipeline was opened.* So this would have been in he late 1970s, early 1980s.* From the time the trucks left the loading docks in Texas to the time they got back to their bases in Texas the engines were never shut off.* At night in the Yukon and Alaska the drivers had to get up every two hours or so and idle the trucks back and forth in the parking lot for awhile to keep the lube oil limber in the differentials and transmissions.* And when the trucks got back, more often than not the engines needed a full or partial overhaul because of the hours and hours they had spent idling.* I do not remember what the article gave as the reason for needing the overhauls.

However the idling practice may be on the wane.* I have stock in one of the nation's larger railroads.* In an annual report a few years back they announced a new cost-savings measure which was to abandon the practice of letting locomotives idle for long periods of time--- overnight or longer in many cases--- which until then had been the practice because of the time-consuming process of getting the cold diesels going again and up to temperature.* The price of fuel and labor had reached the point where the savings in shutting the locomotives off now exceeded the value of the time used to restart them and get them up to temperature, which can require a couple of hours.* (Applying a load to a not-properly-warmed-up locomotive diesel can destroy it right now.)* There is a small railyard adjacent to our marina.* Until fairly recently the two or three locomotives that are always in the yard were left running seemingly all the time* Today when we drive past the yard, unless the locomotives are being used or about to be, they are shut off.

On our weekly drives to and from Bellingham we often eat at an I-5 restaurant that has a truck stop adjacent to it.* In years past, the trucks parked there, even late at night, would most often be running.* Today, the trucks parked in the "long stay" section of the lot are silent except for the reefer units on the trailers.


-- Edited by Marin on Saturday 3rd of March 2012 07:58:53 PM
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Old 03-03-2012, 07:40 PM   #26
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RE: How Slow Can I Go?

Many of the trucking fleets are using APU's that are very quiet and use far less diesel, and they power the AC/heat/ and keep batteries charged. Others are using systems that are battery driven to heat and cool...and others still have diesel fed heaters most likely made by Webasto....that are silent. And others will just turn the engines off and if its cold...use more blankets... Companies are very sensitive to the cost of fuel...even with their bulk discounts...each semi will use 100 to 150 gallons of diesel in less than 24 hours, reefers not included. Owner operators normally will shut it down whenever they can...because the fuel comes out of their pockets.
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Old 03-03-2012, 07:56 PM   #27
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RE: How Slow Can I Go?

I was an oilfield geologist working the North Slope of Alaska many moons ago. We drilled exploratory wildcat wells on the NPRA. All of our equipment (trucks, loaders, etc.) was airlifted to the individual sites, including the trucks, loaders, etc. We drilled from about November through May (that way we wouldn't damage the ecosystem). Our pickups and equipment were started upon offloading from the transport plane in Novemeber and turned off when we loaded back up in May.
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Old 03-03-2012, 08:08 PM   #28
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How Slow Can I Go?

Quote:
Giggitoni wrote:
... Our pickups and equipment were started upon offloading from the transport plane in Novemeber and turned off when we loaded back up in May.
*Out of necessity, no doubt, but I doubt that the reduced life of those engines was significant in*the context of that*monumental effort, contrary to our boats' engines where their*life/health is*of primary consideration.


-- Edited by markpierce on Saturday 3rd of March 2012 09:09:18 PM
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Old 03-03-2012, 08:25 PM   #29
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RE: How Slow Can I Go?

Nsail, I can appreciate your questions and concerns. Most of us are familiar with the phrase, "happy wife, happy life" -- same with boating. Have you considered the*Kadey Krogen series of trawlers? I recently went aboard a super clean and well cared for late '80s KK in Anacortes WA.*She's equiped with a slow turning and economical Lehman*diesel, huge interior, pilothouse, walk-arouind decks, thruster, etc. I believe it's priced under $250K (I have no connection to this boat or broker, just toured it with a friend.)

http://www.yachtworld.com/core/listi...oat_id=2435269
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Old 03-03-2012, 08:41 PM   #30
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RE: How Slow Can I Go?

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nwboater wrote:
Nsail, I can appreciate your questions and concerns. Most of us are familiar with the phrase, "happy wife, happy life" -- same with boating.

Have you considered the*Kadey Krogen series of trawlers?
One of the main reasons we will never own a single-engine boat is that my wife--- who is just fine with us flying a single engiine floatplane out to God-knows-where in the BC Coast range--- is far more confident and comfortable with two engines under the boat's cabin sole. I like running engines--- the more the merrier--- but I have no philosophical issues with single engine boats.* But my wife does, so twins it will be forever :-)

We both really like the Krogen design.* We've been on a couple, a 37 (I think) and a 42 and we were very impressed with the layout.* Whoever drew up the plans was a smart person. Plus it's a very good looking boat in our estimation.* And if you aren't in a hurry and are interested in open or rough water capabilities and economic running, the Krogen is right up there as one of the best I think.

They have a model that the jury's still out in our minds but it seems like it could be a good idea, and that is their so-called "widebody" model.* What they've done is put a full length side deck down the startboard side (I guess on the theory that that's the side people are most likely to dock on) but run the main cabin aft of the pilothouse all the way out flush with the port side of the hull.* So you don't get a full walkaround deck, but you do on the starboard side of the boat. And it adds several feet to the width of the main cabin.

The only negative thing we ourselves have ever heard about Krogens has to do with their construction, specifically the hull.* They used--- at least for awhile--- a cored hull that some people have said can be problematic.* I have no idea if a Krogen hull can be problematic, can't be problematic, or that the people who say it is simply have a negative bias based on who- knows-what toward cored hulls.*

So all I would say that if all the other aspects of a Krogen really appeal to you, check out the hull bit on your own with people who will give you a straight answer.

But it's a great design.* In our opinions a pilothouse boat is the best configuration out there, particuarly when combined with a covered aft deck that can be enclosed, which is a great feature in the PNW and which is part of the Krogan design.
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Old 03-04-2012, 12:01 AM   #31
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RE: How Slow Can I Go?

Nsail

Link to 40' - 48'*Tollycraft - Strongly built, well designed, comfortble*boats!* Ed Monk Sr and Jr were hull and superstructure designers.* Best buy for the money - IMHO!!

http://www.yachtworld.com/core/listi...dedSelected=-1
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