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Old 02-06-2018, 12:37 AM   #1
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Help! About to purchase our First Trawler!

Hello All,
I'm a retired newbie about to purchase our first trawler.
We've pulled our cost of ownership (reading all of the great posts on this forum, speaking with other boat owners) and now about to make an offer on an 88 GB 42' Classic w/ twin FL engines(1500 hrs). The owner has put in over $110K in the boat in the past 4 years. They are looking for about $190K and I know they paid $134K almost 5 yrs ago. What I don't know is how much do owners expect to see a return on their $ spent on improvements ? Is 30% a reasonable percentage to expect on improvements? Should they hope to recoup $0 dollars and include the $ spent as Cost of ownership? Any opinions would be appreciated. I am not sure how to go about looking at the $ the current owner has spent.
The similar boats I've seen run about $165K+, but none seem to have the kinds of upgrades I see in our "future boat". The seller does not have a broker.
Any thoughts from the group?
Thanks for the reply!
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Old 02-06-2018, 01:25 AM   #2
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There is a difference between "improvements" which bring the boat back to good condition and are really maintenance, and novel additions, such as adding thrusters, that were not previously fitted.
Even recouping part of the cost of the "novel additions" might be difficult. But expenditure of both kinds should make the boat more readily saleable.
The seller sounds to be doing well,no need for a broker.
I suggest valuing the boat as it is, regardless of seller expenditure. It is what it is, and if that carries it above more commonly priced boats,it may well be good value for money. Buying quality, even if it costs a little more, can be worthwhile.
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Old 02-06-2018, 01:57 AM   #3
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Yes, Bruce K is right.
My boat, also an '88, the PO has has also spent $75k to redo the hull and fore-deck.
That was not reflected in his asking price.
Think of buying a car. If the PO has to replace the engine, it doesn't change the value of the car significantly.

I'd also post this on the GB forum. Price seems high for an '88
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Old 02-06-2018, 03:03 AM   #4
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+1. You never get back what you spend on a boat. It isnít like a house when you redo the kitchen and get more than you paid for it. I would get a broker to look at sold boats similar to this one and see what the market is. His improvements may add a bit to the sales price, but consider that most sold boats are paying 10% brokers fee. Therefore a 165K boat owner isnít getting the 165, but much less so if this boat isnít being sold through a broker the price should be lower than a comperable boat. Donít fall in love too soon.
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Old 02-06-2018, 09:04 AM   #5
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What you don't mention is what was purchased for $110K. If she needs new decks and/or new fuel tanks, there is still a lot money that may need to be put into the boat.

Have you gone to BoatUs and gotten an estimate of what the boat is worth based on sales of similar boats? If others are for sale for $165K, they will probably sell for a lot less.

Do not think you are getting a great bargain based on what a PO says he has put into the boat.
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Old 02-06-2018, 09:42 AM   #6
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I make improvements based on our predicted enjoyment factor. For example: Better enclosure, significant $$$, no expected gain at sale... but we really appreciate the better enclosure in the meantime.

Otherwise, I look at money spent on service, maintenance, improvements... as incentives for a faster sale, should the need arise.

No significant impact on selling price... although it may mean my asking price could be set toward the higher end of a plausible range for our particular boat type/brand/model/etc.

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Old 02-06-2018, 11:33 AM   #7
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I’ve never been able to make any money off boat improvements and I do most all of my own work. If I’m lucky I might get a fourth of the money spent on materials back , but not likely.
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Old 02-06-2018, 11:51 AM   #8
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Assuming you have or will have a survey of this boat done (and yes highly recommend a survey), a good surveyor will include his/her assessment of fair market value in the report. The surveyor should have access to the same boat-sold data that brokers use.

But I agree with others here; you generally don't get much of it back especially if it was just fixing stuff. The scenario where they might get a price bump is in major improvements; say someone installs a $30k gyro stabilizer... and even then maybe they only get a portion of it back.
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Old 02-06-2018, 11:54 AM   #9
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Good advice above. Make a low ball offer and work from there. You may already know this but once the offer is accepted, get surveys done on the hull and engines/Genny.


Dang Ham beat me to it.
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Old 02-06-2018, 12:11 PM   #10
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You should take a look at Yachtworld.com or similar listing service to see what the asking prices are for your boat, model and year. Bear in mind, the actual selling prices are less, sometimes much less. The above comments are true......the seller expecting to recoup his cost of improvements is not realistic in the the boat sales I've seen.
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Old 02-06-2018, 12:34 PM   #11
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I would not expect to make back any money spent on labor, but i would expect to make back most money spent on materials. If they put in $110k in just materials and did all the labor themselves, that boat would be in ridiculously good condition.
I have an '85 GB 42 motoryacht. The biggest headaches (and expenses) you face will be fuel (and water) tanks, teak decks, engines, and leaky windows - especially if they've damaged the surrounding wood. If all of these things are pristine, the GB might be worth close to $200k.
I wouldn't think about what they modifications/upgrades they did, but more what still needs to be repaired, and how much that might take out of your budget.
Best of luck!
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Old 02-06-2018, 02:17 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmooch View Post
Hello All,
I'm a retired newbie about to purchase our first trawler.
We've pulled our cost of ownership (reading all of the great posts on this forum, speaking with other boat owners) and now about to make an offer on an 88 GB 42' Classic w/ twin FL engines(1500 hrs). The owner has put in over $110K in the boat in the past 4 years. They are looking for about $190K and I know they paid $134K almost 5 yrs ago. What I don't know is how much do owners expect to see a return on their $ spent on improvements ? Is 30% a reasonable percentage to expect on improvements? Should they hope to recoup $0 dollars and include the $ spent as Cost of ownership? Any opinions would be appreciated. I am not sure how to go about looking at the $ the current owner has spent.
The similar boats I've seen run about $165K+, but none seem to have the kinds of upgrades I see in our "future boat". The seller does not have a broker.
Any thoughts from the group?
Thanks for the reply!
One way to look at it is, the current owner made the upgrades for HIS comfort and satisfaction, not yours.

Make your offer, if he doesnt accept it remember, 'there will always be another boat.' Maybe the next one will be even better.

Not matter which boat you finally settle on, once purchased, be prepared to spend even more money.

I can tell you from first hand experience, when my boat was dropped in a boat yard and was determined to be a constructive loss, the cost of my improvements meant nothing when it came to their insurance company's offer.
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Old 02-06-2018, 05:37 PM   #13
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Send an email to boatpoker@gmail.com and I will respond with the soldboats.com data (actual selling prices) for that model.
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Old 02-06-2018, 08:04 PM   #14
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If the boat is new to market, the owner still remembers writing the checks for the re-fit, once it has been for sale for a year or so he will be remembering the monthly checks for a boat he wants get rid of. If you are a serious buyer make a low-ish offer on whichever of your finalists has been on the market the longest. Knowing which seller is really ready to make a deal is the sort of thing that buyers brokers are useful for as well.
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Old 02-06-2018, 08:15 PM   #15
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in my experience, usually money spent above the average price of the top of the line similar boats is never gotten back...maybe a few bucks for certain items, but no wheres near the big expense.

if the average top of the pack of similar boats is 100,000K, even if the guy spent a 100,000 K last month on repairs and upgrades...tbe selling price of that boat usually isnt but 10 or 20K above the pack if they didnt get 100,000K facelift before going on the market.
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