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Old 01-27-2014, 12:33 PM   #21
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A 10 HP DC motor night be the size of a garbage can and weigh a few hundred pounds.

Small light ones need an electronic controller , not just an off on switch. which might cost what a wing diesel would cost.
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Old 01-27-2014, 12:41 PM   #22
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If your "get home" motor can't overcome the currents (and wind) in your boating area, it's pretty pointless.
Unless it's not really a come home engine but a second means of propulsion to get you out of harms way whether other traffic or environments issues. Most single engine boats thinking of secondary propulsion usually lose the engine...not the drive train...not to say it doesn't happen but I would say singles stopping are because of engine issues by a large margin.

It may take a lot of HP to buck wind and current but it doesn't take nearly as much to go perpendicular or even with it to safer water.
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Old 01-27-2014, 01:29 PM   #23
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Assuming I could still stay afloat after a catastrophic powertrain failure, the farthest away from land I'll be would be in the Gulf Stream (to or from the Islands), or perhaps crossing the Gulf of Mexico on the loop, so I'd likely call for a tow anyway. I'm just thinking of those moments when your engine goes down and enough directional stability could be had to stay out of trouble. The worst zero power situation I've been in was waiting for a bridge while with and current were taking me toward the supports as other go-fast boats were coming off plane at the last moment, throwing huge wakes abeam. Maybe I had 30 seconds. Taught me a great lesson in staging my boat too close to the bridge. High pucker factor.

As expensive as a diesel outboard would be, it would be a bracket and a fuel line job. With my rudder, I think one knot or so is all I need for acceptable directional control. The unit would be out of the water, fairly easy to service or remove, and you could take it with you or sell it separately when you moved to another boat. If one needed to dock or maneuver under 1 knot, a handle while standing in the veranda or swim platform would probably work in a pinch. Of course, a remote throttle and/or shut off would be convenient while single handling. Two aboard would be better.

I find it hard to deny that in this case, twins with separate fuel filters and day tanks take some of the worry out of this, but they gotta have decent rudders. This was one of the criteria that kept me looking at Great Harbour's and a few Catamarans right up to the end.
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Old 01-27-2014, 03:24 PM   #24
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10 hp electric power is going to need a bit more then a belt or two to connect to the main shaft I would think.

I would rather see the elect running a hydro. pump then send it to a hydro. motor. But if you do that then just run the hydro's off the gen-set and forget the elect.

My get home motor is cheep and requires no maintenance, I call it Sea Tow.
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Old 01-27-2014, 03:33 PM   #25
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Here is a 30 or 55hp outboard that runs on all fuels, gas, diesel, jet fuel even. Only weighs 10-20 pounds more then a standard motor, Cost I have no idea?




http://www.evinrude.com/en-US/engines/MULTI_FUEL_ENGINES
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Old 01-27-2014, 04:17 PM   #26
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10 hp electric power is going to need a bit more then a belt or two to connect to the main shaft I would think.
I think you're right Scotty....I wouldn't do it anyway. Even if you could manage a decent ratio, lateral Loading of the shaft couldn't help the log and seals much.

What about Hydraulics? After coming back to the US from living and cruising in Germany, I imagined that I'd take my boat all hydraulic. The Euro 400 river trawlers we were renting had Nanny-Peachment (Kabota) diesel/hydraulic drives with a hydraulic bow thruster. You could pull the throttle right through the gate from full ahead to full reverse without hesitation, no issues. When I saw that the drive shaft was nothing but a simple hydraulic motor bolted to the transom with maybe a 8-10 inch shaft and a prop on the other side, I figured hooking-up a get-home system would be nothing more than another smaller hydraulic motor bolted elsewhere on the transom, perhaps with a folding prop....so simple. Problem is that you do loose efficiency through the hydraulics. I got to know the owner of LeBoat Charter of Europe as he only lived a few blocks away in Berlin. The Nanny/Peachment system stopped all his rental transmission and shaft issues immediately, but the 85 HP Kabota behaved more like a 40 HP, no kidding. Maybe 5.5 to 6 knots WOT with a 40 ft. WL.

If I began with an 11 HP diesel Genset and PTO, it's not hard to imagine that I wouldn't have much left after the Hydraulic Motor and stuff like line friction and simple mechanical loss through a few bearings and PTO, not to mention less efficiency at the prop location, less efficient prop, and on and on. I could probably do better with a paddle.
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Old 01-27-2014, 04:43 PM   #27
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Larry, I was not aware of the lose experienced with hydro's, wow! I can see why it's not done. I guess the best set-up is a wing with a smaller diesel for power.

Reinventing the wheel, while not very likely, does bring some interesting conversation to the table, and you do learn things.

Thanks
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Old 01-27-2014, 06:35 PM   #28
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............. My get home motor is cheep and requires no maintenance, I call it Sea Tow.
I was going to suggest that but I didn't want to start an argument. Mine is TowBoatUS, but they cost about the same and provide the same service.
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Old 01-27-2014, 07:12 PM   #29
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It pays to read the fine print on the towing assistance insurance policies...while similar...they aren't exactly the same and one or the other may be better for your needs or where you primarily boat.

Especially if you boat in a relatively small geographic area...the best thing is to look over the fleet and equipment that may assist you and talk to the owners and captains that will assist you. Every franchise owner has some flexibility in what they will and won't do for you and often the equipment and competency levels between the 2 companies in a given area can be quite different.

So while the $$$ may be only a little different...the quality of service can vary quite a bit.
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Old 01-27-2014, 07:52 PM   #30
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Just asking: what about towing with the dink vs pushing? Assuming a 10 to 20-hp outboard, it would seem an easier way to maneuver to safety except into current or wind. The only additional equipment would be a rope.
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Old 01-27-2014, 08:40 PM   #31
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It pays to read the fine print on the towing assistance insurance policies...while similar...they aren't exactly the same and one or the other may be better for your needs or where you primarily boat.

Especially if you boat in a relatively small geographic area...the best thing is to look over the fleet and equipment that may assist you and talk to the owners and captains that will assist you. Every franchise owner has some flexibility in what they will and won't do for you and often the equipment and competency levels between the 2 companies in a given area can be quite different.

So while the $$$ may be only a little different...the quality of service can vary quite a bit.
Well, you can join both. It's still cheaper than some sort of contraption to try to get you home.

BoatUS membership gets you discounts at many marinas.
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Old 01-27-2014, 09:01 PM   #32
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Well, you can join both. It's still cheaper than some sort of contraption to try to get you home.

BoatUS membership gets you discounts at many marinas.
Sea Tow is trying to catch up with the discounts..though nowhere near as widespread as BoatUS.....

neither is cheaper if you wash up on the rocks......it's then you really wonder if a single was worth it's main points....
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Old 01-27-2014, 09:07 PM   #33
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AusCan, One of the guys on this forum did just that. He made a very nice mount for his swim platform and put a 5HP Lehr propane engine on it. If I remember right it was Murray who did that.
(It's a 9.9)

There's a local guy who makes up several of these pivoting brackets, drops them off at a marine supply store, then makes more when they sell out. We have no towing service on BC's north coast, so I guess he sells quite a few as most people have kickers...just in case...
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Old 01-27-2014, 10:12 PM   #34
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The Seatow franchise operating in Sydney went belly up last year, lost half my subscription. Now we have BoatAssist,seen them around, recently subscribed.
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Old 01-27-2014, 10:51 PM   #35
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Hi Murray, How's the Lehr doing?
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Old 01-28-2014, 01:04 AM   #36
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Hi Murray, How's the Lehr doing?
We fire it up once in a while, but it's lonely and unused for its original purpose as an emergency get home kicker
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Old 01-28-2014, 01:19 AM   #37
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I would call it a secondary propulsion engine. Not a get home motor.
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Old 01-28-2014, 06:37 AM   #38
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what about towing with the dink vs pushing?

None of these systems are for an open ocean problem.

A stern push is easily able to stick a boat in a slip , or along a dock, or just cleat a waterway to anchor,under good control.

The engine aft allows the push boat to move the stern as desired , the tow rope does not.
It also allows , slowly, the boats to be stopped where desired.
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Old 01-28-2014, 07:32 AM   #39
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When I worked for a Sea Ray dealership, the marina had very tight fairways and slip spacing...through the years they found 2 guys in a 18 foot stern drive, using the stern drive in reverse with a VERY short tow line was the most maneuverable of all...it also allowed the person on the towboat to see where they were going over any kind of push/hip tow.

It wasn't the most efficient use of towboat HP but that was secondary to a bunch of things at that point...

Each set of circumstances may determine which tow method is best for you and your one or two rigs...some won't work at all in certain situations...usually towing with a true dink is only possible for around marinas or very protected waters.

If you are fortunate to have a RIB or runabout , maybe something like a 13 Whaler with 25-40hp and enough fuel...then we are talking more serious towing...and then each situation is still very dependent which towing method would work best for you and your rig.
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Old 01-28-2014, 08:30 AM   #40
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For my bucks the answer would always be HYD.

The noisemaker with a hyd pump could power a cruise generator 6KW , bow thruster , dink crane, windlass and with belts or a chain the main shaft.

For main shaft disaster a wing Hyde feathering prop and hyd motor would be good for as many thousands of miles you have to go.

AS the noisemaker would power the get home its frequent inshore use would give hope that it would start..

A hyd pump on the main could power the 6KW underway , and the rest of the hyd power users should the noisemaker be down.

This might be a pricy retrofit if all done at once , but it is a very KISS way to cruise.

All with no WHITE SMOKE!!
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