Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 01-31-2011, 01:31 PM   #41
Guru
 
Carey's Avatar
 
City: Bellingham, WA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Happy Destiny
Vessel Model: Custom Lobster Yacht
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,101
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

Quote:
Delia Rosa wrote:

We use our flybridge when the weather is nice and the lower helm in our pilothouse when the weather is poor and also for all close work.
I find it interesting that you choose the lower helm for close work. I do quite the opposite. I find that from the bridge, I can see both ends of the boat. I can't do that from below, and the other side of that is that from the bridge I can communicate better with those on deck or on the dock.*

*
__________________
Advertisement

Carey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 01:45 PM   #42
Scraping Paint
 
City: -
Country: -
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,748
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

Quote:
Carey wrote:
I find it interesting that you choose the lower helm for close work. I do quite the opposite. I find that from the bridge, I can see both ends of the boat. I can't do that from below, and the other side of that is that from the bridge I can communicate better with those on deck or on the dock.*

*
It's a personal preference.* We never drive our boat from the flying bridge because while the view is nice we feel totally disconnected from the boat up there.* And for close-in maneuvering, I find it much easier and more accurate to judge the boat's position from the lower helm that from the upper helm, even though in theory it should be easier from up top where I can see the whole boat.* But it just looks "wrong" to me from up there.* Plus I can be on deck in seconds from the lower helm if I need to be.* Other people can better judge their boat's close-in position from up above.

My wife says I'm a far better driver in the UK than I am here at home and I agree with her.* I've never had a problem or even a learning curve driving on the right side in the UK--- it worked for me from the first time I did it.* I have no idea why the sight picture from that side of the vehicle works better for me than from the left side.* Everybody's different.

*
__________________

Marin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 01:55 PM   #43
Guru
 
jleonard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,739
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

I run almost exclusively from the flybridge. I don't like the lack of visibility from below even though my lower helm* has pretty good vis as far as trawlers go.
jleonard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 02:01 PM   #44
Curmudgeon
 
BaltimoreLurker's Avatar
 
City: Stoney Creek, MD
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Moon Dance
Vessel Model: 1974 34' Marine Trader Sedan
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,629
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

I've used the lower helm only in wet or cold weather.* Otherwise, I'm on the flybridge enjoying the sun, air and view.
BaltimoreLurker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 02:07 PM   #45
Senior Member
 
Delia Rosa's Avatar
 
City: St. Catharines
Country: Canada
Vessel Name: Delia Rosa
Vessel Model: C & L Sea Ranger 47 Raised Pilothouse
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 378
Do you really need a lower helm?

Carey wrote :

"I find it interesting that you choose the lower helm for close work. I do quite the opposite. I find that from the bridge, I can see both ends of the boat. I can't do that from below, and the other side of that is that from the bridge I can communicate better with those on deck or on the dock."








You are correct that the visibility from the flybridge is actually better than from the pilothouse, but we still prefer to use the lower helm for close work. **

Dan will drive from up top until we are just approaching the dock and then he scoots down our stairway into the pilothouse to handle the rest of the approach from there. I always handle all the lines but with him at the lower helm,*he can help in an emergency. *We also use*small two way headsets so that we are in constant communication... so far, this system has worked well for us.



-- Edited by Delia Rosa on Monday 31st of January 2011 03:10:31 PM
Delia Rosa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 02:27 PM   #46
Guru
 
skipperdude's Avatar
 
City: Whittier AK
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Apache II
Vessel Model: 1974 Donald Jones
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,147
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

Personally I think all boats should have a lower helm.

Think about it. How are you going to use your boat?*

If you are a fair weather boater and never go out in the ocean. You are probably right you don't need one.

Get*caught in one storm and you will be wishing to God you had a lower helm.

The Fly bridge is what it is. You are up topside out in the weather.

I would reverse the question. Do you really need a fly bridge.

SD

*
skipperdude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 02:29 PM   #47
Senior Member
 
SOMERS's Avatar
 
City: Southampton
Country: BERMUDA
Vessel Name: ANDROMEDA
Vessel Model: MAINSHIP 400
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 147
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

Someone lit the roman candle here !

I have me an upper helm and lower helm, very nice, however nothing suitable at the lower helm to sit on.
Well ! The boat did come with rotating kitchen stools but somehow they don't really look or feel the part.

Now a Stidd is very nice, but i am not so sure as a trawler guy i would look right perched up on a Stidd, i am not royalty.

My Question is what else is our there that would be suitable it would seem that every manufacturer has a different helm Chair criteria, could it be that the ultimate helm chair is an egg crate ?

Donald & Mavis
Mainship 400
Andromeda .
Bermuda
SOMERS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 02:37 PM   #48
Guru
 
skipperdude's Avatar
 
City: Whittier AK
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Apache II
Vessel Model: 1974 Donald Jones
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,147
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

Quote:
SOMERS wrote:

Someone lit the roman candle here !

I have me an upper helm and lower helm, very nice, however nothing suitable at the lower helm to sit on.
Well ! The boat did come with rotating kitchen stools but somehow they don't really look or feel the part.

Now a Stidd is very nice, but i am not so sure as a trawler guy i would look right perched up on a Stidd, i am not royalty.

My Question is what else is our there that would be suitable it would seem that every manufacturer has a different helm Chair criteria, could it be that the ultimate helm chair is an egg crate ?

Donald & Mavis
Mainship 400
Andromeda .
Bermuda
The way I see it if you are like most of the respondents to this thread you will usually be up on the fly bridge.

If the weather gets snotty you will be at the lower helm and if you are down there (Becaus of the weather)* you will probably want to be standing anyway.

I think that is why so many of the trawler type boats will have a moveable helm seat.* So you can get it out of the way when not in use.

SD

*
skipperdude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 03:01 PM   #49
Guru
 
koliver's Avatar
 
City: Saltspring Island
Country: BC, canada
Vessel Name: Retreat
Vessel Model: C&L 44
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,168
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

I use both. I have no sense that I use one more than the other.
In good weather, where the visibility is good (most of the summer cruising, despite the horrid local weather that others have reported) I tend to be up top, unless it is too cold. In poor visibility, when I need the radar and/or the computer display for the GPS/charts, or when it is cold out, down below.
I used to dock exclusively from up top, but in the last few years I have forced myself to become more proficient at knowing where the ends and other side are from below, so now I can do it equally well from below. The worst was docking port side to, from below. I would check my distance off, thinking I had just a fender's width, to find I had more than my wife could safely jump - more than 3 times too much. That took a few tries to get the hang of it.
koliver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 03:12 PM   #50
Guru
 
Nomad Willy's Avatar
 
City: Concrete Washington State
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Willy
Vessel Model: Willard Nomad 30'
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,711
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

Well I see no real use for an upper helm on any boat under 50'. Quite a few boats have poor visibility fwd and almost force one to go topside. The Willard 36 is such a boat and I'll never buy one for that reason. And if I had one I'd remove the FB and raise the lower helm/wheelhouse about 2'. That would give me a huge engine room that would be far better than a FB. I offer this photo (again) as evidence that there is someone here in Alaska that dosn't seem to need a lower helm. Just for laughs.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	sth71062.jpg
Views:	60
Size:	137.8 KB
ID:	4562  
Nomad Willy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 03:16 PM   #51
Senior Member
 
Delia Rosa's Avatar
 
City: St. Catharines
Country: Canada
Vessel Name: Delia Rosa
Vessel Model: C & L Sea Ranger 47 Raised Pilothouse
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 378
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

Quote:
Old Stone wrote:
As to upper or lower, I can't see my stern from either station, so that is why I am getting a rear camera set up.
What kind of rear camera setup are you planning?

*
Delia Rosa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 03:49 PM   #52
Senior Member
 
Delia Rosa's Avatar
 
City: St. Catharines
Country: Canada
Vessel Name: Delia Rosa
Vessel Model: C & L Sea Ranger 47 Raised Pilothouse
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 378
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

Old Stone, we have been thinking about doing a similar camera installation to improve viz.... I will be interested to hear what you finally decide to buy and how it all works out!
Delia Rosa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 03:50 PM   #53
Guru
 
Woodsong's Avatar
 
City: Atlanta
Country: USA
Vessel Model: Bayliner 4550 Pilothouse
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,630
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

Carl,
Are you using a laptop for your GPS? If so, you may want to think about running USB cable and a simple webcam for your back up camera. Clarity can be pretty good if you get a good quality cam and it requires no additional power plug in except for the USB into the laptop. If you are placing it in the covered cockpit area out of the weather it should work pretty well and be a lot easier to install.
Woodsong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 03:57 PM   #54
Senior Member
 
Delia Rosa's Avatar
 
City: St. Catharines
Country: Canada
Vessel Name: Delia Rosa
Vessel Model: C & L Sea Ranger 47 Raised Pilothouse
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 378
Do you really need a lower helm?

Woodsong, re your suggestion to Carl.... we don't use our laptop for our GPS, but it would certainly be simple to try out the webcam idea on our laptop... We have a small webcam and a 60 foot long USB cable so that could be a really simple hookup... can't wait to try it out next spring! *

In the meantime, I just checked the one Carl mentioned.... I will be looking forward to hearing how it all works out.


-- Edited by Delia Rosa on Monday 31st of January 2011 05:09:52 PM
Delia Rosa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 04:11 PM   #55
Guru
 
Woodsong's Avatar
 
City: Atlanta
Country: USA
Vessel Model: Bayliner 4550 Pilothouse
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,630
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

Delia,
That is how I am setting up my engine room camera- long USB cable and a webcam! I've dry fit it all and tested it in the slip and it seemed to work great- just need to make a permanent mount for it. Maybe I'm just cheap though....I like the low cost and the fact you don't need additional power or another screen (for us since we use laptop for our GPS).

Anyway- see if it works. Sometimes the simplest solution is the best.
Woodsong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 04:30 PM   #56
Senior Member
 
Rusty's Avatar
 
City: WA
Country: US
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 214
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

Greetings all. I'll go ahead and chime in here since I just went through this. I also have Garmin Chartplotters. I have two cameras connected to the chartplotter in the lower helm.

The engine room camera is from Fry's. The IR functionality is reasonably good with the lights off. Much better with the lights on.

http://www.frys.com/product/5820453?...H:MAIN_RSLT_PG


The second camera is on the back of the mast. I got a really good deal on a Garmin reverse image camera so I used that there. I flipped the video over since the photo. Seems a bit more natural.




As I understand it, all Garmin chartplotters will display the image full screen except the 4212 (which is what I have). A quirk with the Fujitsu video board in it.


The Garmin network does not allow chartplotters to share video so you would need to use a coax splitter and run coax to both chartplotters if you wanted to see the video on both displays.


Rusty


Archimedes
1978 Grand Banks 42 Classic #572
Seattle
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	img_0856.jpg
Views:	98
Size:	58.3 KB
ID:	4563   Click image for larger version

Name:	img_0855.jpg
Views:	95
Size:	122.5 KB
ID:	4564  
Rusty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 06:58 PM   #57
Guru
 
jleonard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,739
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

"Think about it. How are you going to use your boat?*

If you are a fair weather boater and never go out in the ocean. You are probably right you don't need one.

Get*caught in one storm and you will be wishing to God you had a lower helm."


No. Enclosed bridge. I love being up there, even in a storm, if I happen to be dumb enough to get caught in one and I have experience there to be sure.
jleonard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 09:57 PM   #58
Master and Commander
 
markpierce's Avatar
 
City: Vallejo CA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Carquinez Coot
Vessel Model: 2011 Seahorse Marine Coot hull #6
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 10,262
Do you really need a lower helm?

Yes indeed.* I have no need for an upper helm, however.* For fresh air I can open the pilothouse doors and the middle-front pilothouse window.* The doors have upper and bottom halves:




-- Edited by markpierce on Monday 31st of January 2011 10:59:20 PM
markpierce is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2011, 11:24 PM   #59
Guru
 
Giggitoni's Avatar
 
City: Vallejo, California
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Mahalo Moi
Vessel Model: 1986 Grand Banks 42 Classic
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,532
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

The only time I use the upper helm in the California Delta in the Summer is after the sun is down. It's too hot during the day! Even with a bimini. I would also rather be in the lower helm in Winter when it's foggy and the temp is down in the low 40s. Spring and Fall is groovy, though. I always use the lower helm when cruising down the coast because, like Marin, I feel connected to the boat's systems and can hear, feel, and smell the normal and abnormal workings of the boat. I guess I could live without an upper helm except for those perfect summer nights when our favorite adult beverages taste just a little better under the stars.
Giggitoni is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2011, 06:48 AM   #60
JD
Guru
 
JD's Avatar
 
City: New Bern NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Stella Di Mare
Vessel Model: Mainship 34t
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,702
Re: Do you really need a lower helm?

A little late to this but here is my 2 cents.

Mainship built the 34t with the lower helm as an option in the earlier years of production (04 -06).* It became standard in 07 I believe.* I think it was a price point gimmick.* Anyway there are a few out there without the lower helm.* From what I saw when I was buying my boat they suffered in their sale asking*price by about 20% and they still were not selling. One had been on the market going on two years.

So use it or not the resale will suffer without the lower helm and in a down market that will really hurt.


My boat does not have any electronics at the lower helm, none, nada.* So the plan is to take one of the Raymarine*E-80's (there bridged together)*move it down and replace it with a Garmin 5200 series.* That will give me everything down, depth, radar and chart.* Get a remote for the*Auto and a remote mike*for the radio.* Now where did I put that lottery ticket?

Carl,

Will you use a step down transformer to power the Camera?* I see it is 9V DC.* Or do you plan on using a small inverter to drive the 120V unit?* Or run the Gen-set all the time.*

I need to do something because I can't see the swim platform from the top.*
__________________

JD is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
34 LRC Lower helm visibility at cruise?? Fighterpilot Californian 6 04-18-2011 10:13 AM
Adding a captain's chair to lower helm - ideas? 7tiger7 General Discussion 34 03-29-2011 09:20 AM
Upper vs Lower Helm Budds Outlet General Discussion 59 12-01-2010 06:49 PM
RainX on Lower Helm glass? Woodsong General Discussion 29 11-27-2010 10:42 AM
best lower helm electronics? Woodsong Electrical and Electronics & Navigation 36 09-08-2010 11:32 AM




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:11 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012