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Old 09-29-2014, 11:26 PM   #1
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Defever 49 for $95K - Sign of the times?

This 1981 Defever 49 was just listed in La Conner for $95K - all the others of similar vintage are listed at $120K to $$219K.

Seems pretty unmolested - which also means that the wood looks kind of, well, out-dated. I know some folks have said they were looking for this model, which has been always been a good value - but this is a lot of boat for under $100K asking.

I also happened to read today Paul Krugman's piece on "Our Invisible Rich", and I think this Defever really highlighted the wealth inequality in this country.

But here's the thing - we all boat in the same waters and go to the same destinations. I've seen recent threads on this forum about how inland waterways are declining - and I know it's a struggle for small resort & marina operations in the PNW - but it really seems like there's a disconnect between the yachting world that can afford new 50' boats and the world of this 49' Defever. This forum has members with more expensive and vastly less expensive boats, and we all seem to be able to share and learn from one another.

Anyway, just some random thoughts, triggered by the observation that a 40' Defever for under $100K might not be a positive indicator for the type of boats and boating we do share.
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Old 09-30-2014, 12:07 AM   #2
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Well developed thoughts but you are jumping to assumptions that aren't supported. There are always bottom of the class priced boats. Don't draw any conclusions.
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Old 09-30-2014, 12:27 AM   #3
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This 1981 Defever 49 was just listed in La Conner for $95K - all the others of similar vintage are listed at $120K to $$219K.

Seems pretty unmolested - which also means that the wood looks kind of, well, out-dated. I know some folks have said they were looking for this model, which has been always been a good value - but this is a lot of boat for under $100K asking.

I also happened to read today Paul Krugman's piece on "Our Invisible Rich", and I think this Defever really highlighted the wealth inequality in this country.

But here's the thing - we all boat in the same waters and go to the same destinations. I've seen recent threads on this forum about how inland waterways are declining - and I know it's a struggle for small resort & marina operations in the PNW - but it really seems like there's a disconnect between the yachting world that can afford new 50' boats and the world of this 49' Defever. This forum has members with more expensive and vastly less expensive boats, and we all seem to be able to share and learn from one another.

Anyway, just some random thoughts, triggered by the observation that a 40' Defever for under $100K might not be a positive indicator for the type of boats and boating we do share.
My first thought would be that it's worth either $95,000 or probably less. Without seeing the boat, I can only go on the basis that the owner, who knows more about it that we do, felt it was worth no more than that. The reasons would only be known after a closer look and/or survey.
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Old 09-30-2014, 12:37 AM   #4
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I saw that boat as well. We are in the market for a boat between 40-50 ft and we really like the walk around deck that these boats offer. But we are afraid of the age of all these type/era boats that have Teak decks/older engines ect. For roughly 100k, give or take, there are also 1990-98 Bayliner 4588 & 3988's respectively. We keep going back and forth on what we want and we just can't decide Opinions on these older Vs newer boats? We love the walk around decks but not the age. I am not retired yet so don't have a lot of time to tinker on them.
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Old 09-30-2014, 01:06 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by refugio View Post
This 1981 Defever 49 was just listed in La Conner for $95K - all the others of similar vintage are listed

I also happened to read today Paul Krugman's piece on "Our Invisible Rich", and I think this Defever really highlighted the wealth inequality in this country.

re.
Want to see wealth disparity, go over to Yachtforums.com and look at the photos of the Yacht Show going on in Monaca right now.. Yowsa, that collection must make some there feel inadequate for only having one or two billion dollars. They must consider millionaires nothing but "riff raff" to be kept behind the velvet ropes.
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Old 09-30-2014, 01:25 AM   #6
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Man, I wish that boat was on the East Coast! The pictures look really nice and my guess is it's for sale at that price because he doesn't want 2 boats.
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Old 09-30-2014, 01:35 AM   #7
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Want to see wealth disparity, go over to Yachtforums.com and look at the photos of the Yacht Show going on in Monaca right now.. Yowsa, that collection must make some there feel inadequate for only having one or two billion dollars. They must consider millionaires nothing but "riff raff" to be kept behind the velvet ropes.
Yes, Illusion at 89 meters sold for $99.5 million last month. Nirvana which is a 2012 Oceanco is for sale at just over $250 million. And that's without even looking at yachts like Azzam at 590 ft. Now I've never been on any yachts the size of these and each to their own, but I can't imagine it seeming like boating. More like a floating hotel, which is how they're mainly used. They have to use the tenders to actually boat. It's more like a cruise ship. Or maybe we just say that about things we couldn't afford anyway.
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Old 09-30-2014, 01:37 AM   #8
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Well, the hailing port on the transom is Edmonton Alberta - that's a 13 hour drive and (apparently) 6 hour set of flights away. And despite the apparent lack of use (I think I see 2468 engine hours on the meter) it's obvious the boat has been well maintained cosmetically. The only things that made me go "huh" were that ladder on the stern and the degraded varnish on the inside of the starboard midships door. Oh, and the total lack of any personalization items. I'm guessing they already removed those (and the dinghy!) for their new boat.

So part of me was thinking "that's a lot of boat for the money", and another part of me was thinking "yeah, but it's still going to be expensive to maintain particularly if you don't have covered moorage". But the net message I actually got was that used boats aren't worth very much money. And that also made me wonder about the future values of higher end boats as well. Perhaps I can afford a 50' Nordhavn in another 30 years? Only downside is that I'll be in my 80s. <sigh>
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Old 09-30-2014, 01:52 AM   #9
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What makes it such a bad boat?
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Old 09-30-2014, 01:55 AM   #10
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It's so hard to tell just looking online. First question is how current are the photos. Do you weigh the low engine hours or the age of the engines most. The new Generator or the old teak?

One thing that gives me reason to pause is that the same broker, Fairhaven Yacht Sales, has a 48' Defever a year older for sale for $150,000. So what makes this one worth that much less? Is it something we can't see? Or just a motivated seller?

At the least a starting place of some questions to ask the salesman and see if the answers make sense. Wonder how long the current owner has owned it.
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Old 09-30-2014, 02:16 AM   #11
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The add said the owner moved up and like someone stated before, all the personal stuff is moved off so it seems the owner has moved on. Looking at the pictures, the boat seems to be in good shape. I'm sure a survey is needed, but to me, it seems like a good deal with a motivated owner.
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Old 09-30-2014, 02:41 AM   #12
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It's so hard to tell just looking online. First question is how current are the photos.
Advt says awlgrip paint job just done. So exterior at least, very recent.
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Old 09-30-2014, 04:38 AM   #13
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The pics look great.
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Old 09-30-2014, 06:04 AM   #14
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And that also made me wonder about the future values of higher end boats as well. Perhaps I can afford a 50' Nordhavn in another 30 years?

The govs of the world are in a state of panic as they are unable to create inflation.

The Euro inflation rate was reported at 0.3% , even after loads/years of money creation.

The Value of money is what it will purchase , commodities are down , gold , silver are down.

To common folks this is GREAT , as your money purchases more , the fear of gov is Japan Style , where deflation , assets going down, slows purchases ,

When it is realized THINGS will require less money to purchase , if you wait, the economy declines.

The unwinding of the Fanny / Freddy caused housing bubble is one example.
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Old 09-30-2014, 07:57 AM   #15
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Well, the hailing port on the transom is Edmonton Alberta - that's a 13 hour drive and (apparently) 6 hour set of flights away.
Canada's has a list of mandatory hailing ports, can't just use any city like in the states. Edmonton is the only hailing port for Alberta.

Furthermore, only one name can be registered. So in theory, you could go to the Registy list at Transport Canada, find the registry number (828044) and share owners name, and call him (in Calgary).
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Old 09-30-2014, 09:25 AM   #16
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I struggle with the notion that a 43 year old boat selling for 75% of its build cost is a sign of economic disaster looming.
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Old 09-30-2014, 09:56 AM   #17
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Damn! Looks like a pretty nice boat for the price. I'd have to unload my boat before I could consider something like this, and I do like the DF49's. But since the crash and the drop of the boating market, I'm not sure I could even give my boat away today!
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Old 09-30-2014, 10:36 AM   #18
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Most things depreciate with age, it's that simple. Anybody who's purchased a high end car (or furniture, carpet, plane, jewelry) can tell you this in just a matter of a few years, so decades old? I don't know why people think yachts should be any different. It's always been like this. That's not an unusually low price by any mean at all. I have a page on my site of old print advertisements going back into the 80s, and you can see the prices of similar sized boats from back then. They weren't that much then.
Then there was the recession of 08, where prices on new boats from manufacturers fell off a cliff. Of course that effected used boat values with a vengeance, which led to the avalanche of repos. All those boats became the new comps. It's why 57' boats from 99-02 that cost over a million dollars new, sold for $450k in 08(with $600k payoffs) can be bought today for $300k. OLDER boats in beautiful condition who's owners owed the bank $600k were selling for $50k -$75k. There were some incredibly low prices just years ago. The expense to care and feed boats keeps going up, which doesn't add value. In the early 90s I had all the slips I wanted at a marina for $150.00 a month, and insurance wasn't required. One of an average income could afford that. Now in Miami? $1700.00 a month,

plus proof of insurance required. THIS is whats killing boating.
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Old 09-30-2014, 10:50 AM   #19
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Bay Pelican was built for $85K US in 1985, was worth $325K in 2007 (Bay Pelican is fully loaded with everything) now worth (estimate) $225K. This drop in prices is the first time a Krogen 42 owner sold for less than he bought it for.
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Old 09-30-2014, 10:50 AM   #20
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Just a thought, what would be the ballpark cost of having that boat transported to the MS. gulf coast?
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