Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 01-27-2013, 07:51 AM   #1
Guru
 
Moonstruck's Avatar
 
City: Hailing Port: Charleston, SC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Moonstruck
Vessel Model: Sabre 42 Hardtop Express
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 7,854
Cruising Skills

This quote from PSNEELD in the "Taming the Single Screw" thread made me do some thinking

"The real trick isn't putting your boat into your slip every weekend...it's putting it where the dockmaster tells you to, no matter time of day, weather or any other distraction every day of the week in a different place for months on end.

Then and only then are you getting the hang of your boat."

To me that is a profound observation. Real cruising takes many skills. They can't be all learned in a class room, or by practicing one time. There is no way to simulate many of the situations a cruiser is faced with. This keeps things interesting to say the least. The lines have to be taken in and experience gained. You get experience by doing. Get the feel of the boat until handling it is almost instinctive.

Cruising is problem solving. Size up a situation, and get on with it. Whether it's reading the water, the weather, limited visibility, mechanical problems, or medical emergencies cruising takes your full attention. Being fully engaged is what makes it so interesting. When you add the beautiful surroundings and sometimes glorious isolation, It makes it all worthwhile.
__________________
Advertisement

__________________
Don on Moonstruck
Sabre 42 Hardtop Express & Blackfin 25 CC
When cruising life is simpler, but on a grander scale (author unknown)
http://moonstruckblog.wordpress.com/
Moonstruck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 09:32 AM   #2
Art
Guru
 
Art's Avatar
 
City: SF Bay Area
Country: USA
Vessel Model: Tollycraft 34' Tri Cabin
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 7,984
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonstruck View Post
This quote from PSNEELD in the "Taming the Single Screw" thread made me do some thinking

"The real trick isn't putting your boat into your slip every weekend...it's putting it where the dockmaster tells you to, no matter time of day, weather or any other distraction every day of the week in a different place for months on end.

Then and only then are you getting the hang of your boat."

To me that is a profound observation. Real cruising takes many skills. They can't be all learned in a class room, or by practicing one time. There is no way to simulate many of the situations a cruiser is faced with. This keeps things interesting to say the least. The lines have to be taken in and experience gained. You get experience by doing. Get the feel of the boat until handling it is almost instinctive.

Cruising is problem solving. Size up a situation, and get on with it. Whether it's reading the water, the weather, limited visibility, mechanical problems, or medical emergencies cruising takes your full attention. Being fully engaged is what makes it so interesting. When you add the beautiful surroundings and sometimes glorious isolation, It makes it all worthwhile.
Don - Very well put! - Art
__________________

Art is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 10:17 AM   #3
Guru
 
koliver's Avatar
 
City: Saltspring Island
Country: BC, canada
Vessel Name: Retreat
Vessel Model: C&L 44
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,174
Right on the money Don!

One of the most impressive dockings I have witnessed took place several years ago when I had a sail boat. I was part of an organized cruise of 33 sailboats, out for a week to enjoy the summer sun, an event done every year by our yacht club. We had to get all the boats safely tied up at each destination, in time for games for the kids, happy hour for the adults, etc. One such destination was a small marina near Egmont, BC, just outside the famed Skookumchuk rapids, which we would be transiting in the morning. The current in the marina was sufficient to drag one of our dinghies under the dock and pop it out on the other side!

In the midst of all this a 30 ft commercial boat needed to get to the fuel dock which was aligned with the current, but on which there was only a few feet more than his length of empty space, and that was between boats rafted two deep at both ends.

The degree of familiarity that operator had with his boat was sufficient to get him in to the dock without coming too close to any of the moored boats, get tied up, and get out again in the same way, all in a current that didn't slacken below 5 knots from his start to finish. It was also quite clear that this was not an unusually difficult docking for that skipper.

All who witness that docking were in awe. It was well discussed by the skippers on the cruise and we all took a lesson from him, in the hopes that we could one day demonstrate the same level of comptence with our own boats.
koliver is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 10:27 AM   #4
Art
Guru
 
Art's Avatar
 
City: SF Bay Area
Country: USA
Vessel Model: Tollycraft 34' Tri Cabin
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 7,984
Damn calm, w/ no seen wind or current - but... pretty nice any hoooo!

"How to Dock a Boat"

Art is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 10:46 AM   #5
Guru
 
Moonstruck's Avatar
 
City: Hailing Port: Charleston, SC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Moonstruck
Vessel Model: Sabre 42 Hardtop Express
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 7,854
We have guys out there doing it. LarryM and Daddyo are doing it almost everyday. Great Papa Bear is preparing to cruise Europe and the Baltic. Delfin is preparing for a great circle cruise of the Pacific. I take my hat off to them all. It takes skill, guts, preparation, and commitment for that kind of cruising. Many here are on or have been on the Great Loop. We also have some pros like Capt. Jack here that have done things that we can only imagine. Eric was kind enough to share his great blog of the cruise South on Willy.

This forum is a great resource. The experiences here are varied, and we get the benefit of their experiences. Thanks to all that are so willing to share. There is always more to learn.
__________________
Don on Moonstruck
Sabre 42 Hardtop Express & Blackfin 25 CC
When cruising life is simpler, but on a grander scale (author unknown)
http://moonstruckblog.wordpress.com/
Moonstruck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 01:18 PM   #6
Veteran Member
 
City: Pender Island
Country: Canada
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 70
Echo,,,,,,

I'm with Don ... the information/support I've gained from the TF contributors has helped me sooo much in the vessel purchasing process ..... the most recent topic relates to Boat Handling with loads of info. being made available...... the links to boatsafe.com and John Mellor's book Boat Handling under Power have been fantastic ......... to experienced knowledgeable boaters some info. may be quite basic BUT for a rookie invaluable ..... thank you john
Lucy 11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 01:40 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
deckofficer's Avatar
 
City: Northern California
Country: US
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 409
Docking and other close quarters work is where a catamaran trawler, even in the hands of a low hour skipper, really shines.

When I was at the Academy as a freshman we learned on a single screw diesel launch in the heavy currents that plagued our docks in the Carquinez Straits. This required the use of spring lines deployed by your deck crew so that you had something to work against in dealing with the currents. Later as an upperclassman we used the twin screw diesel launches, and docking was now easy. Our separation of these props was only around 3', but what a difference in control of the vessel. A cat trawler will have around 12' of separation, so you would be a pro in no time, being able to turn your boat around in the length of the boat.

I'm on the fence as to what my next boat will be, power or sail. Are there any members cruising in a cat trawler?
__________________
Bob
USCG Unlimited Tonnage Open Ocean (CMA)
deckofficer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 04:03 PM   #8
Scraping Paint
 
City: -
Country: -
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,748
There have been in the past. A search of the archives should unearth their posts and information using "cat" or "power cat" or some such thing as the keyword.
Marin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 04:16 PM   #9
Guru
 
Moonstruck's Avatar
 
City: Hailing Port: Charleston, SC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Moonstruck
Vessel Model: Sabre 42 Hardtop Express
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 7,854
Quote:
Originally Posted by deckofficer View Post

I'm on the fence as to what my next boat will be, power or sail. Are there any members cruising in a cat trawler?
The thread "Southern Migration" by DVD chronicles their cruise south from Chesapeake Bay to Stuart, FL on their new to them PDQ 34 cat trawler.
__________________
Don on Moonstruck
Sabre 42 Hardtop Express & Blackfin 25 CC
When cruising life is simpler, but on a grander scale (author unknown)
http://moonstruckblog.wordpress.com/
Moonstruck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 09:06 PM   #10
dvd
Senior Member
 
dvd's Avatar
 
City: California Bay Area
Country: US
Vessel Name: BOOSTER
Vessel Model: Nordic Tug 37
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 362
Having 2 months and a couple of thousand miles under my belt on my PDQ 34 power cat, I still smile when maneuvering in tight quarters. Yes, I can turn my boat around in its own length and do most anything but go directly sideways (and I can come close to doing that with enough wiggle room). After forty years of boating, this is my first boat with twin engines, and my first cat. I waited too long. It's fast, stable, economical, roomy... A big reason I bought this boat was that when my wife (not as enthusiastic boater as I) first went on board, she said "Now, I could live on something like this." Three months later, we've sold the house, we're living on board and enjoying the hell out of it.

dvd
dvd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 09:22 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
deckofficer's Avatar
 
City: Northern California
Country: US
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 409
Thanks DVD, I've always been impressed with the PDQ 36 sailing catamaran's build quality and layout. I bet it is nice not having to deploy flopper stoppers in the anchorage. Care to share other first impressions of your first two months with the cat vs your past 40 years on monohull boats?
__________________
Bob
USCG Unlimited Tonnage Open Ocean (CMA)
deckofficer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 09:50 AM   #12
dvd
Senior Member
 
dvd's Avatar
 
City: California Bay Area
Country: US
Vessel Name: BOOSTER
Vessel Model: Nordic Tug 37
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 362
deckofficer,

This boat represents a number of changes from my past boats beyond the number of hulls. My past boats were either sailboats or older trawler-style powerboats used for weekend get aways and occasional multi-week coastal cruises (while living on the West Coast, ranged as far south as Ensenada and as far north as Canadian Gulf Islands; while East, from New England south to Florida, currently on our way to the Bahamas). The more recent had bow thrusters, but none ever had stabilization. The PDQ, besides being a different platform, is also the newest boat I have owned being a 2005 model with twin Yanmar 75 hp engines. Although maintenance on this boat, like any boat, is still a significant demand, in general, things work better, longer on a newer boat and I worry less about significant breakdowns. I like things simple, and not needing thrusters or stabilization is a real plus. Even among other power cats, the PDQ hull design is very efficient and cruising at 14 knots, burning 4 gallons/hour is very satisfying after years in the 6-8 knot range. This speed gives you many more options when coastal cruising. The salon is spacious and light with excellent visibility. One compromise is the aft cabins which I call "bunk rooms" rather than staterooms. They are comfortable bunks, but one must crawl into them. My wife loves the galley with the storage and efficient layout. She bakes bread routinely, and cooks great meals, even while underway. We have only one head, but it is well laid out with a separate shower that accommodates me (6', 200 lbs) easily. The large flybridge is comfortable, easily accessed and has excellent storage. I have just installed an "aft bimini" which keeps weather and sun off the aft deck and allowed me to mount a solar panel on top. I am in the process of installing a watermaker to give us more cruising options in the Bahamas. Like any boat, there can be challenges running new wiring and plumbing, but the overall access I would rate as "good." The engine compartments are a bit cramped and there are times I wish I were 5' tall and 100 lbs with extreme flexibility, but, so far, I have managed to get everything done that needs to be done. The deck space, dinghy davits and transom steps are wonderful.

It is designed, and I use it, as a coastal cruiser, not a passagemaker. An acquaintance has run his from Canada down to his home in Guatemala, however, without difficulty. With good fuel management, range can be around 1000 nautical miles. My first impression is that one does need to be quite mobile to live on board, as there are several changes in levels in the living area, however, I just learned of a paraplegic owner of a PDQ 34 who has installed appropriate hand holds to get around.

We have seen 4-5 ft seas in 30 knot winds, and although we had to slow down considerably, the boat handled them just fine. Seas or wakes on the beam can cause a quicker roll than on a monohull, but the roll is rarely more than about 10-15 degrees. Significant head seas can result in some bridge deck pounding and an occasional "sneeze" with spray being shot forward and blown as high as the flybridge. One just needs to adjust speed or angle to the waves. Although prevalent in urban lore, and unlike a sailing multihull, the risk of turning turtle in a powercat is, essentially, non existent. The only documented case I could find was a boat anchored in an unprotected anchorage during a severe hurricane.

Although my heart is still occasionally captured by the sight of a pretty monohull cruising boat, my head is totally convinced that our decision to purchase the PDQ was the right move.

dvd
dvd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 10:09 AM   #13
Guru
 
motion30's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 740
One thing I learned when approaching a strange dock ...ask the dock master the conditions. I learned that the hard way in Riverera beach The current rips tru there Two windows and a small hole in the topside later .....
motion30 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 12:29 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
Dswizzler's Avatar
 
City: LaPaz ,Mexico and the Sea of Cortez
Vessel Name: Delta Swizzler
Vessel Model: 1988 58' Vantare
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 215
DVD,

Loved your explaination about living and choosing the CAT, we followed the development of the solor cat the Island Pilot DSE for year only to be disappointed upon it's delievery, and toyed with the idea of an Endouver CAT, but never really saw any out west. Attended a few shows in Annapolis but could never plug the trigger. looking forward to more of your Cat Travels being posted
Dswizzler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 12:52 PM   #15
Senior Member
 
deckofficer's Avatar
 
City: Northern California
Country: US
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 409
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dswizzler View Post
DVD,

Loved your explaination about living and choosing the CAT, we followed the development of the solor cat the Island Pilot DSE for year only to be disappointed upon it's delievery, and toyed with the idea of an Endouver CAT, but never really saw any out west. Attended a few shows in Annapolis but could never plug the trigger. looking forward to more of your Cat Travels being posted
Thank you DVD, every item you mentioned was spot on with the Sailing PDQ 36. Too bad all PDQs are now very large, expensive, and I think built in Chile.

I also followed the development of the Island Pilot diesel-electric solar hybrid. Not a aesthetically pleasing boat, but hard to do that and still sport 6 KW of solar panels. The first batteries were AGM Odyssey 2150's, which for a lead acid battery a good choice but I don't think any lead acid is a good choice. I use LiFePO4 cells, and these are the way to go for a house/inverter/propulsion bank hands down. I heard that later they switched over to LiFePO4. It is a great concept to have a trawler cat with solar assist that as long as you have 5.5 hours of sun each day your able to putz along at 3.9 kt solely on electrons for a 24 hour daily run. 90+ nm days without sails or dead dinosaur juice is appealing.
__________________
Bob
USCG Unlimited Tonnage Open Ocean (CMA)
deckofficer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 01:12 PM   #16
Guru
 
Moonstruck's Avatar
 
City: Hailing Port: Charleston, SC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Moonstruck
Vessel Model: Sabre 42 Hardtop Express
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 7,854
Quote:
Originally Posted by deckofficer View Post
Thank you DVD, every item you mentioned was spot on with the Sailing PDQ 36. Too bad all PDQs are now very large, expensive, and I think built in Chile.

I also followed the development of the Island Pilot diesel-electric solar hybrid. Not a aesthetically pleasing boat, but hard to do that and still sport 6 KW of solar panels. The first batteries were AGM Odyssey 2150's, which for a lead acid battery a good choice but I don't think any lead acid is a good choice. I use LiFePO4 cells, and these are the way to go for a house/inverter/propulsion bank hands down. I heard that later they switched over to LiFePO4. It is a great concept to have a trawler cat with solar assist that as long as you have 5.5 hours of sun each day your able to putz along at 3.9 kt solely on electrons for a 24 hour daily run. 90+ nm days without sails or dead dinosaur juice is appealing.
That boat was tied up ahead of me in Nov. '08 at the Coral Reef YC in Coconut Grove. They were doing some trials on Biscayne Bay and some magazine write ups. It just doesn't seem to be "there yet".
__________________
Don on Moonstruck
Sabre 42 Hardtop Express & Blackfin 25 CC
When cruising life is simpler, but on a grander scale (author unknown)
http://moonstruckblog.wordpress.com/
Moonstruck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 01:24 PM   #17
Senior Member
 
Dswizzler's Avatar
 
City: LaPaz ,Mexico and the Sea of Cortez
Vessel Name: Delta Swizzler
Vessel Model: 1988 58' Vantare
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 215
Love the idea, and I can handle function over forn to an extend, but agre this is not there yet. When they went from 6 knots for 9-10 hours to 4 knots for 5 hours...I lost all interest. Again love the concept
Dswizzler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 01:24 PM   #18
Senior Member
 
deckofficer's Avatar
 
City: Northern California
Country: US
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 409
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonstruck View Post
That boat was tied up ahead of me in Nov. '08 at the Coral Reef YC in Coconut Grove. They were doing some trials on Biscayne Bay and some magazine write ups. It just doesn't seem to be "there yet".
It is for sale now, which is too bad because it could fall into the hands of someone that doesn't know beans about electrons, and could set back green propulsion another decade by bad press.

Their choice of diesel propulsion, the efficient and light Steyr 75 hp, coupled to 7 KW motors, dual large inverters to support a fully electric galley including induction stove top, is right on IMHO. They even include as standard equipment a Torqeedo electric powered dinghy and a Segway for ground transportation, so no gasoline or propane on board, just how I plan on doing my next boat.
__________________
Bob
USCG Unlimited Tonnage Open Ocean (CMA)
deckofficer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 01:36 PM   #19
dvd
Senior Member
 
dvd's Avatar
 
City: California Bay Area
Country: US
Vessel Name: BOOSTER
Vessel Model: Nordic Tug 37
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 362
<<...and I think built in Chile.>>

Actually the PDQ sailboats are being built in Brazil. Unfortunately, the powercats are not in production anywhere. Pearson owns the molds and has them in the Northeast. There are occasional rumors of financial backing offers, but no concrete plans to resume production.

dvd
dvd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 01:40 PM   #20
Senior Member
 
deckofficer's Avatar
 
City: Northern California
Country: US
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 409
That's right, Brazil. I should have known that since I used to work in Brazil. I think it is the Chris White cats (sailing) that are being built in Chile.
__________________

__________________
Bob
USCG Unlimited Tonnage Open Ocean (CMA)
deckofficer is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:46 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012