Contacting War Ships via VHF for Communication

[angus99]

I give them a lot of room.

 

[TowLou]

I wonder how far the ship is pushed from a full broad side blow.....

 

[cappy208]

I wonder how far the ship is pushed from a full broad side blow.....

Seems barely measurable, in spite of hearsay otherwise.

http://www.navweaps.com/index_tech/tech-022.php

 

[dannc]

...
Wasn`t Missouri a battleship put back into service by Reagan, for reasons of national pride?

Not really national pride but strategy against the Soviets if they invaded Europe. The Iowa class battleships were brought back as part of the US Navy's plan to have a 600 ship navy. There were several reasons to bring back the Iowa's but a Warsaw Pack invasion was a big reason.

If the Warsaw pack headed west, the US would have to transfer large numbers of men, equipment, and supplies across the Atlantic. Many of the soldiers would be flow over on commercial aircraft, the US had contracts with some US airlines to takeover planes and use them as transports in case of war, but equipment and heavier supplies would still have to go by ship.

The Soviets would want to block the convoys moving across the Atlantic so they would send their very large submarine fleet, as well as their not too shabby surface fleet, west to intercept. But to get to the convoys, the Soviets would have to get passed the GIUK(Greenland Iceland UK) Gap. In turn, NATO would use the GIUK Gap to block the Soviets to protect the convoys.

The battle around the GIUK Gap, hopefully, north east of the gap would be an air and submarine action for the most part but once the sub threat was minimized, the US Navy would move up the coast of Norway to attack the Soviet bases around Murmansk. This would be done with carriers and the Iowa class battleships.

This naval attack, along with USMC landings to help hold Norway, would force the Soviets to move air units from central Europe to defend the Soviet Union, which would in turn, reduce the pressure on NATO on the main front. The Iowa's could take a beating due to their heavy armor and with cruise missiles could attack land targets.

Back in the day when I was reading about all of this, it sounded like the Iowa's would be sent in ahead of the carriers but with air cover. The Soviets would have to attack the Iowa's because of their cruise missile threat to land targets. The battleships would give US air power a chance at destroying the Soviet bomber forces while minimizing the risk to the carriers. The Soviets would have to send fighter units to protect the bombers and if their planes were going after the US Navy in around northern Norway, then they could not be helping the attack in Central Europe. This also kept the bombers away from the convoys streaming across the Atlantic to resupply NATO.

Even though the Iowa's had very effective armor, the Soviets had some very large and fast cruise missiles with heavy warheads. And they still do. Not sure how many of those an Iowa class can take before sinking but it was not going to be pretty that is for sure. Flip side is that the modern ships could likely be sunk with one or maybe two hits by these missiles so the Iowa's were much more survivable but they would also be attracting lots of attention. Which I think was the point. Let the Soviet forces attack the Iowa's so their bomber fleet could be reduced, if not destroyed, before getting near the carriers. This in turn reduced the Soviet forces attacking in Central Europe while protecting the convoys resupplying NATO.

While all of this was going on, I don't think there would be lot of chatter on channel 16.

Later,
Dan

 

[BruceK]

I appreciate the pics and information. I think Missouri (?aka Big Mo) was here in 1988. We circled her in my "Folkboat" (a 26ft long keel fractional rig heavily built f/g sailboat of Scandinavian design) and were loud hailed by the crew to keep our distance, we complied promptly.
Apologies to the OP for the drift, but it seems to have struck a chord.

 

[HiDHo]

The Navy missle cruiser I served aboard operated with the battleship New Jersey off the coast of Viet Nam. Story was one night a small auxilary ship picked up the New Jersey on thier radar and challenged them to identify themselves or they would open fire. The responce was " this is the USS New Jersey fire at will ".
You can believe if your are any where near a Navy warship they have already tracked you and IDed you.

 

[Pgitug]

Since the carrier was at your 9-12 sector on the port side, you have the right away. Should have told the carrier to stand off until you passed.
Right???????

 

[O C Diver]

We had the massive Missouri anchor in Sydney harbour some years ago, for our navy celebrations. A magnificent sight indeed.
A newspaper published a photo of Missouri firing her guns off the coast, the entire side of the vessel appeared engulfed in flames. The shells were reported to be the size of a Volkswagen Beetle.
Wasn`t Missouri a battleship put back into service by Reagan, for reasons of national pride?

Not size, but weight of a Volkswagen Beetle.

Ted

 

[HiDHo]

During gun fire support it's amazing to visually be able to see 6 of her 16" projectiles when she fired in support of the Marines. Usual report was " entire vc bunker complex gone " !

 

[FF]

For fun just get a couple of GREEN flairs for your very pistol.

Green to the military means

"mark my attack from this position".

Dont worry , they will call you!

 

[JDCAVE]

This Missouri came into Vancouver Harbour in the late 1980's sometime. We looked down on her from halfway up Grouse Mountain. Golly she was a wonderful sight!



Jim
Sent from my iPad using Trawler Forum

 

[JDCAVE]

Not really national pride but strategy against the Soviets if they invaded Europe. The Iowa class battleships were brought back as part of the US Navy's plan to have a 600 ship navy. There were several reasons to bring back the Iowa's but a Warsaw Pack invasion was a big reason.



Snip!

Later,

Dan

With Putin's sabre rattling, maybe they need to be recommissioned again!


Jim
Sent from my iPad using Trawler Forum

 

[Sailor of Fortune]

Those battleships were an impressive sight. I wouldn't want one angry with me.

 

[sdowney717]

Lets say your engines are dead, and your drifting in the current and that Navy boat and you are on a closing course, you better hope your radio also is working.
And your closer now than 500 yards away.

What do you do?
what do you say?
What do they do?
What do you do if your radio also failed? What then will they do?

 

[LarryM]

Lets say your engines are dead, and your drifting in the current and that Navy boat and you are on a closing course, you better hope your radio also is working.
And your closer now than 500 yards away.

What do you do?
what do you say?
What do they do?
What do you do if your radio also failed? What then will they do?

What a horrible scenario. First of all, at 500 yards, hopefully you are not on an actual collision course, because at 20 knots, you only have about 40 seconds to impact! Time for life jackets!

What do you do? What do you say?

On Ch16 immediately hail them to apprise them of your situation, then probably a Pan-Pan would be appropriate.
​

What do they do?

Well, they are not going to intentionally run over you. That can be a career-ender. If they hear and see you, they would most likely just alter their course to avoid you and signal their intentions via VHF or ships whistle. If you do not respond, depending upon the type of ship and their mission, they could launch a helo to investigate, or launch a ships boat if close enough. I've seen Navy ships render aid in some situations where it was felt there was a potential for loss of life, and they were the closest asset available. In my experience, this is pretty rare though. They would more likely notify the Coast Guard and monitor the situation by radio as they continue their operations.

If they don't see you, or if they are engaged in an activity that limits their ability to manoeuver, then all bets are off, and I wouldn't want to be in your boat shoes. No joke here, have everyone don life preservers and prepare for the worst.
​

What do you do if your radio also failed?

By day, hoist your orange distress flag and fly your ensign upside down. Signal with your arms. Signal with your horn. You could also use pyrotechnics to get their attention. At night, horn and pyrotechnics.
​

I'm sure there is more you could do, but these are my initial thoughts. This is pretty much the same I would do in if broken down in a shipping lane or channel

 

[rwidman]

......... Would you contact them on 16? I avoid 16 because we all know it’s for emergencies, and I don’t want to bother a carrier unless its important.
=>If you would contact them, would you use another channel, say 10?

Why would you expect them to answer on channel 10? Why would you expect anyone to answer on channel 10? Who monitors channel 10?

Channel 16 is the appropriate "hailing channel". Call them (or any other boat) on channel 16 and either you or the other boat can suggest a "working channel". Switch to that channel and discuss your business.

You may find that some commercial boats and possibly military boats will not be monitoring channel 16 even though we are taught that everyone is required to monitor channel 16. If you don't get a response on channel 16, try channel 13. If that doesn't work, try channel 14. In some areas, channel 9 is supposed to be a hailing channel so try that.

Some commercial and possibly military boats won't respond to you no matter what channel you try to call them on. Apparently, these folks think it's your responsibility to stay out of their way regardless of rules or circumstances. In this case, consider the size of their boat compared to yours or the fact that they may have large weapons readily available.

 

[BandB]

Wifey B: When I first saw the thread title, "Contacting War Ships via VHF for Communication", my first thought was "friendly or enemy?" Whose ships. Now I know the OP made it clear. Still the headline got my mind going wild. :lol:

 

[cappy208]

Lets say your engines are dead, and your drifting in the current and that Navy boat and you are on a closing course, you better hope your radio also is working.
And your closer now than 500 yards away.

What do you do?
what do you say?
What do they do?
What do you do if your radio also failed? What then will they do?

The answers to those and many more questions are....... In COLREGS!

 

[cappy208]

Since the carrier was at your 9-12 sector on the port side, you have the right away. Should have told the carrier to stand off until you passed.
Right???????

The answer to that is...... In COLREGS!

I meant the CORRECT answer.

 

[Bob Cofer]

I was aboard USS Sacramento (center vessel) during an unrep just like this in the Persian Gulf.
Only difference was the turrets were facing outboard.

 

[catalinajack]

A few years ago we were sailing down the Santa Barbara channel in our classic wooden schooner. It was a bright, clear Monday morning with no other boats in sight. A polite, clear, well-modulated voice came over channel 16 from a radio that was of obvious high quality, “Sailing vessel north of San Pedro Point, this is warship 63. We are changing course 10 degrees to starboard and will pass you on our port side.” We looked out and there was the battleship Missouri about a half mile away going perhaps 20 knots. It was one of the most magnificent sights I have ever seen on the water.

Lucky you. And I believe that we should still have an Iowa-class battleship in active service as a living, demostrative symbol of power and might. Nothing compares in that way than the sight of a battleship. I don't care about the cost. I don't care about it's limited utility in today's Navy. It is a symbol. It's advertising much in the same way as are the Blue Angels. Don't build a few F-35's if cost is an issue. We won't miss them anyway. One last thought - service aboard the battleship should be reserved for the best, most deserving sailors, an honor for them to serve aboard her.

 

[FF]

"I don't care about it's limited utility in today's Navy. It is a symbol. It's advertising much in the same way as are the Blue Angels"

Just one of the new Chinese hyper sonic , anti ship missiles could make for really bad advertising.

 

[psneeld]

I love battleships too...

But air power replaced them.

And now air power is airliners flying into buildings and drones retaliating ....or even that is on its way down trying to fight kids with bombs strapped to them.

Not sure taking care of an 80 year old ship is a reward for snyone, without it undergoing some pretty big rehab projects.

I saw in the USCG by the 1990s the morale of the poor kids still serving on proud, but WWII Era ships versus those on the brand new toys. Rarely even close.

 

[sdowney717]

The military is eventually going to give AV (autonomous vehicles) the decision to fire on their own artificial intelligence derived decisions, most likely in battlefield conditions. So then the drones will no longer be mindless drones directly controlled by a human operator.

 

[CaptTPT]

I don't think you have any specific responsibility towards the warship. You are responsible to monitor channel 16. They know that. When and if you are violating their space you will know it soon enough. They will hail you by name on channel 16 and give you instructions on what they expect you to do. I had this exact situation happen with a carrier coming out of Bremerton Washington. They hailed me by name (AIS) and told me their expectations. Then angry looking guys with 50 caliber machine guns mounted on 2 RIBs came after me. I turned 90 degrees to the carriers direction and they turned off. They do not like you coming near them and they will let you know it.

 

[LarryM]

I don't think you have any specific responsibility towards the warship. You are responsible to monitor channel 16. They know that. When and if you are violating their space you will know it soon enough. They will hail you by name on channel 16 and give you instructions on what they expect you to do. I had this exact situation happen with a carrier coming out of Bremerton Washington. They hailed me by name (AIS) and told me their expectations. Then angry looking guys with 50 caliber machine guns mounted on 2 RIBs came after me. I turned 90 degrees to the carriers direction and they turned off. They do not like you coming near them and they will let you know it.

Actually, you do have a responsibility to comply with NVPZ (Naval Vessel Protection Zone - 33 CFR §165.2010-2025) requirements.

The basic guidelines are as follows:

Vessels within 500 yards of a U.S. naval vessel must operate at the minimum speed necessary to maintain a safe course and proceed as directed by the official patrol.

Recreational and commercial vessels are not allowed within 100 yards of a U.S. naval vessel, unless authorized by the official patrol.

Vessels requesting to pass within 100 yards of a U.S. naval vessel must contact the official patrol on VHF-FM channel 16. The official patrol may permit vessels that can operate safely only in a navigable channel to pass within 100 yards of a U.S. naval vessel in order to ensure a safe passage in accordance with the Navigation Rules.

Commercial vessels anchored in a designated anchorage area may be permitted to remain at anchor within 100 yards of passing naval vessels.

Mariners who violate a Naval Vessel Protection Zone will be perceived as a threat, and will face a quick, determined, and severe response. Violators are subject to arrest, prosecution, and, if convicted, imprisonment for up to six years and a fine of up to $250,000.

 

[CaptTPT]

Yes, I am aware of that. However, we're talking about inadvertently finding ourselves in the path of a warship from miles to several miles away. Not 500 yards. I'm guessing they will always contact you and give direction long before the 500 yards restriction comes into play. In my case they hailed me from about 3 miles away, in the channel, and beginning to execute a turn across my path. Actually, it was Coast Guard escort that contacted me, and told me not to continue on my current course and approach the warship. I was never less that 2.5 miles from the carrier.

 

[sbu22]

My first hand info is way out of date. However, on the subs I rode, when we were surfaced we watched civilian (and all) traffic like a hawk. I cannot believe that has changed. Aside from the humanitarian aspects, no Navy captain's career can survive a collision with anything, much less a boat load of civilians. In this respect, at least in the USN and CG, they are more scared of you than vice-versa - but for different reasons.

 

[BandB]

My first hand info is way out of date. However, on the subs I rode, when we were surfaced we watched civilian (and all) traffic like a hawk. I cannot believe that has changed. Aside from the humanitarian aspects, no Navy captain's career can survive a collision with anything, much less a boat load of civilians. In this respect, at least in the USN and CG, they are more scared of you than vice-versa - but for different reasons.

There's a sub just offshore around Dania today, just at the surface, apparently having some sort of field exercises in finding small items tossed on the water.

 

[Capt.Bill11]

There's a sub just offshore around Dania today, just at the surface, apparently having some sort of field exercises in finding small items tossed on the water.

This is the best shot of it I could get on the fly when we left for Cuba via Key West the other day.