Cheap sailboaters

[Bigsfish]

BandB

Very true I bought a home on the Miami River with 100' of dock space to be a home for my boat and paid more than that. Safe from hurricanes and have been thru many there is the past 20 plus years. But a mooring? I wonder if he has to play property taxes on that ball?

 

[Gmarr]

There is a fee of 88 cents a month/foot to the island. Couple others there also listed for just shy of a million.

 

[Bigsfish]

If an earthquake comes and destroys the ocean bed there do you lose you mooring? Inquiring minds.

 

[dhays]

There is a fee of 88 cents a month/foot to the island. Couple others there also listed for just shy of a million.

Exactly what are they selling? A permit to have a mooring in that location?

 

[BandB]

Exactly what are they selling? A permit to have a mooring in that location?

No, the use of the mooring.

 

[ancora]

The mooring rates in Avalon are set by the Harbor Department...the mooring owner gets nothing. 30' and under $37.00 /night, 31' to 39' $41.00 /night 40' to 49' $50.00 /night and so on. The have special rates in the off-season, Sept 15th to October 14th- pay any 4 nights, get 3 free, From October 15th on pay for 2 nights, get 5 nights free. The way it works, if the owner is planning on using his mooring, he notifies the Harbor Department and they do not assign it. If you are on a mooring and the owner decides to use it, you have to move to another mooring designated by the Harbor Patrol. After a while you get real good at mooring and un-mooring.

 

[dhays]

Wow, that is a lot of money for nothing more than the ability to have a reserved mooring at your disposal.

 

[ancora]

Gettin' back to "cheap sailboaters" on more than one occasion,we had a sailing club come into our yacht club bar and do nothing but drink water and scarf down free popcorn while takin' seats away from our members. (As an aside, the bar covers 45 linear feet and has eight beer taps.) The club manager finally told them to leave and not come back.

 

[Pgitug]

Nobody can argue against the fact that most folks that skip out of paying the dock/Mooring fees are sailboaters.
However, who ever cheats the business out of their fee is hurting us all. You can't justify using services and then not paying for them unless there is a problem that you impart to the dock master.
But if you see a late arrival leave at first light do not assume the worst. Many times we were on a tight schedule and every time we called and gave them our credit card info for the charge.

 

[danderer]

Nobody can argue against the fact that most folks that skip out of paying the dock/Mooring fees are sailboaters.

Heck, I'll argue that because I've seen no quantitative data to support the assertion. Do you have any?

Or are you just trolling? If so you got me.

 

[DPTrainor]

All this disparaging talk about sailboaters. why? Sailors in general are the most knowledgeable with advanced skills in sailing and seamanship. I never got this resentment of sailboaters. Makes no sense. Should be held in high regard.

 

[Woodland Hills]

All this disparaging talk about sailboaters. why? Sailors in general are the most knowledgeable with advanced skills in sailing and seamanship. I never got this resentment of sailboaters. Makes no sense. Should be held in high regard.

I have met some sailors that agree with you, strongly! A few seem to hold themselves in very high regard indeed.

 

[DPTrainor]

I have met some sailors that agree with you, strongly! A few seem to hold themselves in very high regard indeed.

See this is what I mean. Is it envy? really, I don't understand what is it?

 

[mbevins]

While some do have a particular way of looking at life I agree, but to paint them all the same is not fair. The odds are they'll be better boaters than most power boaters. Anybody that thinks differently is fooling themselves.
That being said, a fair number of them don't have the time of day for the rest of us.

 

[dhays]

Gettin' back to "cheap sailboaters" on more than one occasion,we had a sailing club come into our yacht club bar and do nothing but drink water and scarf down free popcorn while takin' seats away from our members. (As an aside, the bar covers 45 linear feet and has eight beer taps.) The club manager finally told them to leave and not come back.

That would never happen at our Yacht Club. While recipricol clubs can use our guest moorage, they may not use our bar or restaurant. They are both cashless, meaning you put everything on your member number and are billed monthly. Maybe the club is giving up a potential profit center but there must be reasons they have gone that route.

 

[dhays]

Nobody can argue against the fact that most folks that skip out of paying the dock/Mooring fees are sailboaters.

I would argue against that simply because it has not been my experience. Maybe it is a East Coast vs West Coast thing?

 

[dhays]

All this disparaging talk about sailboaters. why? Sailors in general are the most knowledgeable with advanced skills in sailing and seamanship. I never got this resentment of sailboaters. Makes no sense. Should be held in high regard.

I agree with your completely. However, until last year I never owned a power boat and never hung out with power boaters. I had spent over 50 years hanging out with sailors almost exclusively. Surprisingly, power boaters aren't nearly as rude, ignorant, and boorish as many sailboaters think.

It goes both ways and in my opinion, the biases and prejudices are born out of not being familiar enough with each other.

 

[Bay Pelican]

But if you see a late arrival leave at first light do not assume the worst. Many times we were on a tight schedule and every time we called and gave them our credit card info for the charge.

Have done this several times. Also I have had occasions were I could not reach the mooring ball operator by phone, or in person. Not a question of arriving late, just in the afternoon, but we had to leave at first light.

 

[AusCan]

It goes both ways and in my opinion, the biases and prejudices are born out of not being familiar enough with each other.

Not just with boating. It applies to many ways we divide ourselves up into groups.

Owning a motorsailer, I try to walk the line.

 

[psneeld]

The blanket statement about sailors being more knowledgeable about things is as laughable as that they are the dregs of boating.


There are top tier in both camps...I know plenty of sailors that I wouldn't trust with a sunfish.


And yes I owned 4 sailboats including a liveaboard sailboat for the first 15 years of my personal boat ownership...and some of those years I did competitive racing.

 

[BandB]

All this disparaging talk about sailboaters. why? Sailors in general are the most knowledgeable with advanced skills in sailing and seamanship. I never got this resentment of sailboaters. Makes no sense. Should be held in high regard.

I don't go as far as you because I think Sailors include some of the most knowledgeable and skilled and some of the least. However, I don't like powerboaters attacking sailboaters or sailboaters attacking powerboaters as a group. The title of this thread didn't even need to include the word "sail". Could have been just "cheap boaters."

 

[BandB]

Not just with boating. It applies to many ways we divide ourselves up into groups.

Owning a motorsailer, I try to walk the line.

Wifey B: You're bi.

 

[CDreamer]

This whole subject is like arguing whether the players in the NBA are better or worse than the players in the NFL.

 

[Bigsfish]

The thread points to the fact that most stereotypes are hard to validate.

 

[dhays]

I know plenty of sailors that I wouldn't trust with a sunfish.

I resemble that remark.

I agree with your point.

 

[FF]

The question should be weather "rag baggers" vs "marine motorists " make better cruisers.

Underway there does seem to be many more sailors than boat drivers.

 

[O C Diver]

I see good and bad in both groups. The day boaters in both groups tend to give a bad name to their respective groups as they are by far the worst. My number one and two complaints with sailboaters are their overall poor monitoring of the radio and the "sailboats have the right of way always" attitude. If you would like a slow pass, monitor the radio and make the name on your boat legible!

Ted

 

[psneeld]

I think the ones who give each category the worst rep are the "squatters" who hog anchorages, abuse dingy docks, abuse "free transient" docks, abuse marinas for water/dumpsters/etc.....usually poor people using boats as homes. Which I don't have issue with...just those that take advantage of boating privileges that any boater should have access to.


They have all kinds of boats, some nicer and less "derelict" than others.


Clueless boat drivers abound in both camps...even experience boaters ....myself included make mistakes occasionally that others take as "clueless"....so those numbers can seem high when who knows how many are really rare occurrences


But Ted is correct that way too many sailboaters are difficult to contact by radio. But also....many powerboaters I have encountered will call the sailboaters but not me because I am in a big, square, salty looking trawler. They don't realize it is just as rolly poly as some sailboats.


This is one of those moving target stereotypes...clear cut examples but each group is so broad that many of us see "cheap sailboaters" with a different slant.

 

[DPTrainor]

Hard to generalize for sure without data. I do believe the learning curve for learning how to sail is much higher than learning how to drive a power boat. And the related knowledge. That in and of itself would tell you something. But, this is a power boat forum, so don't expect agreement.

My biggest pet peeve in at least in my area (Narragansett Bay), many (not all) Power Boaters blow right by you at speed and causing great havoc with sailboat getting hit hard with wake. It is more than disturbing. We curse and sound horn to object, but they never hear. And it happens all the time. I have come to believe they don't even know what their doing is wrong. No clue. The other thing I see is an apparent lack of knowledge of right of way rules. You could be coming about while tacking up wind and power boat seemingly does not know what to do or to slow down and/or change course, giving sailboat the right of way. When a power boater does the right things, we make a point of giving them the thumbs up or even calling them on the radio and thanking them. They are usually former or current sailors, as they tell us. They know what it feels like getting knocked around by a power boat passing. Not a good experience and at times dangerous.

Regardless, I think it is all education and understanding - this helps. And experience. What is not helpful is no learning and awareness and also calling sail boaters disparaging names. That is weak and unaware.

 

[psneeld]

Again your experience with sailboaters isn't mine.


Here on the East Coast ICW you see sailors without knowledge of the rules all the time.


You can learn to move a sailboat under sail in a day. Doesn't mean you know marlinspike, rigging, weather, rules, courtesies.....etc...etc...


As Ted pointed out there are daytrippers in everything...with small boats and jet skis sometimes seemingly the worst...but look at their numbers.


Nope, taking boating to heart doesn't come with form of propulsion...it comes with passion.


Only a few in any endeavor have passion...compare those...not the pinnacle of one to the beginner level of the other...plus there are just sheer statistical numbers in play.