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Old 11-12-2013, 10:40 AM   #1
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Casual Charter Insurance

Hello,
My wife and I are planning to become cruisers/liveaboards, and are considering which trawler-type boats best serve our needs. We have attended several events, walked quite a few marinas, and have now focused on a few boats that seem best for us.

We often read that chartering the model or at least the type and length of boat is advisible prior to purchase, which certainly makes good sense. But we are not finding the boats that we are interested in to be in charter.

We have sucesssfully completed some trawler training, and have had a couple of successful bareboat experiences.

My impression is that many, if not most, boat owners would not consider even loaning their boat out to a friend, which is understandable. And certainly not someone that they didn't know, like us. But having said that, it seems that some owners might be willing to casually charter their boat, to offest ownership costs, particularly if the boat was for sale and the charterer was a serious prospective buyer.

I thought that it might come down to insurance coverage restrictions, but it seems that some policies allow for casual charter, even if it is clearly a paid charter. Of course policies that allow that could be rare. But it could be that many insurance companies would issue an additional-fee rider, with documentation as to length/area/date of trip, specific limitations, charterer experience, etc. The charterer would sign a hold-harmless agreement in favor of the owner.

If anyone has had experience with this (particularly someone that is in the marine insurance business) please let us know of your thoughts on the matter.

Thank you,
MIke
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Old 11-12-2013, 10:59 AM   #2
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Hello,
My wife and I are planning to become cruisers/liveaboards, and are considering which trawler-type boats best serve our needs. We have attended several events, walked quite a few marinas, and have now focused on a few boats that seem best for us.

We often read that chartering the model or at least the type and length of boat is advisible prior to purchase, which certainly makes good sense. But we are not finding the boats that we are interested in to be in charter.

We have sucesssfully completed some trawler training, and have had a couple of successful bareboat experiences.

My impression is that many, if not most, boat owners would not consider even loaning their boat out to a friend, which is understandable. And certainly not someone that they didn't know, like us. But having said that, it seems that some owners might be willing to casually charter their boat, to offest ownership costs, particularly if the boat was for sale and the charterer was a serious prospective buyer.

I thought that it might come down to insurance coverage restrictions, but it seems that some policies allow for casual charter, even if it is clearly a paid charter. Of course policies that allow that could be rare. But it could be that many insurance companies would issue an additional-fee rider, with documentation as to length/area/date of trip, specific limitations, charterer experience, etc. The charterer would sign a hold-harmless agreement in favor of the owner.

If anyone has had experience with this (particularly someone that is in the marine insurance business) please let us know of your thoughts on the matter.

Thank you,
MIke
Mike - There are a couple of really good ins specialists on TF who I feel will soon chime in for ya.

That said: Visit - https://fun2rent.com/ The ins world you describe re private boat owners renting their boat to anyone is unusual... as I have found.

Best Luck! BTW - What size/model/make/year boat interestes you and your Admiral?

Happy Boating Daze! - Art
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Old 11-12-2013, 11:32 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by wizard View Post
Hello,
My wife and I are planning to become cruisers/liveaboards, and are considering which trawler-type boats best serve our needs. We have attended several events, walked quite a few marinas, and have now focused on a few boats that seem best for us.

We often read that chartering the model or at least the type and length of boat is advisible prior to purchase, which certainly makes good sense. But we are not finding the boats that we are interested in to be in charter.

We have sucesssfully completed some trawler training, and have had a couple of successful bareboat experiences.

My impression is that many, if not most, boat owners would not consider even loaning their boat out to a friend, which is understandable. And certainly not someone that they didn't know, like us. But having said that, it seems that some owners might be willing to casually charter their boat, to offest ownership costs, particularly if the boat was for sale and the charterer was a serious prospective buyer.

I thought that it might come down to insurance coverage restrictions, but it seems that some policies allow for casual charter, even if it is clearly a paid charter. Of course policies that allow that could be rare. But it could be that many insurance companies would issue an additional-fee rider, with documentation as to length/area/date of trip, specific limitations, charterer experience, etc. The charterer would sign a hold-harmless agreement in favor of the owner.

If anyone has had experience with this (particularly someone that is in the marine insurance business) please let us know of your thoughts on the matter.

Thank you,
MIke
Hi, Mike,

What you refer to is known as a bareboat charter; that is, a charter operation that does not have a fiscally interested (as in owner) person or professional hired captain onboard for the charter.

It is extremely difficult for a private pleasure power vessel to carry this type of coverage, due to the overwhelming number of factors that are involved:
  • How to vet the potential charterer for experience on the size and type of vessel
  • How to train (in a short period of time) a potential charterer to competently and safely operate the vessel
  • The high number of losses that this type of operation incurs

Hold Harmless agreements don't hold much water, except for the lawyers.


Some yacht policies do allow for occasional charter operations; these are skippered charters (either the owner as skipper or a hired USCG skipper).


Best thing I can recommend is to touch base with an established charter company and seek your rental there.
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Old 11-12-2013, 12:35 PM   #4
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I've chartered twice, both of them bareboat charters, and have been very happy with both charters. I had to pass a "driver's training" test given by the owner of the boats and had to get my own insurance coverage for the time we were going to have the boat.

In your case where you have no boating experience, I'd suggest you do a skippered charter. That relieves you from a lot of the responsibility for the boat. I'm sure if you discussed what your chartering goal was (learning if the boat fits your needs) with the owner/skipper he'd let you run the boat most of the time. If you demonstrated your ability to handle it he might even let you dock it.

Good luck
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Old 11-12-2013, 04:16 PM   #5
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Your insurance will be different from mine but there is no 'chartering' allowed in mine. That becomes commercial for me, complicates things in a bunch of ways and becomes a different policy. If people 'cheat' and there is a problem insurance can become a nightmare so for most of us unless trying to actually run a business of it, it's out of the question. There are those that do but it is a business.
Never mind that I would not charter my boat and it isn't some fancy doodad but it is MY, well OUR, boat..

Ask around. You might find someone who can but i think it will be a hard slog.

Just because the exact same type of boat you are thinking of isn't in a charter fleet doesn't mean the experience will be of no value. There is a lot more to owning a boat than just the amenities aboard.

PILOTING, Boat handling, line handling, personal gear, electronics use, galley up vs down, anchoring, amongst other things.
Even twins vs singles.

You will learn something from a charter that will be of use in your choices plus you should be able to enjoy yourselves while at it.

Of course, what are you looking at? Are the charter possibilites all too small or too big? How far afield have you looked.? Maybe in another area you will get close.

Sorry I can't be more help but I have been asked this before by friends and it will always be no, I don't want to make a business of it.
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Old 11-12-2013, 11:33 PM   #6
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HMMMM
Take a look at what was in the classified section
Trawler for Short Term Rent in Socal...?


Bite my tongue. Maybe some or no help but tak e a look.
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