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Old 01-11-2019, 06:40 PM   #1
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buying a trawler & walked away from the deal

well we were on the last few weeks of a deal on a Nova38 europa needing a little work I had had a good look but thought better get a survey well two weeks to go & the survey arrived, to my shock it was not good the hull below the water line was good no problems with the glass but some of the fittings needed replacing I knew this, next was the water line upto the the gunwales, not bad needing tidy up few chips etc all ok so far, then came the deck this is where it started the last owner had removed the teak decking filled all the holes & glased over the top thats ok but the wood core in the middle is rotten so I would have to cut the top layer off to replace the wood & then replace the top not good then we found the cabin has sagged due to two bulkheads being rotten on the port side another major the front cabins would have to be striped out to replace the bulkheads & the floor needed to be lifted to repair the lower water tank once done all would need to go back in but you would have to jack the body up & brace it while doing this ,then came the flybridge the floor in this had gone the same way as the deck so would have to be cut open as well all sounded a bit daunting to me so I walked away from the deal its a major rebuild
round two start looking again
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Old 01-11-2019, 07:38 PM   #2
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Disappointing, I'm sure. But no doubt you made the right call.
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Old 01-11-2019, 07:54 PM   #3
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Good thing you got the survey.
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Old 01-11-2019, 08:14 PM   #4
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Did it myself three years ago. Seahorse 52. Spent 2-3 thousand on hull and engine surveys, travel and hotels etc.

Major survey issues, plus lots of mis-information from the broker during sea trial. Gave them an offer that we felt would cover what we knew after the survey, plus more for what we didn't. They refused.

It was hard to do, but we walked. Best decision ever. We paid a lot more for the next boat, but it was well worth it in retrospect.
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Old 01-11-2019, 09:01 PM   #5
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Smart move PH, impossible to tell what the final repair bill could be on something like that. A better deal is just waiting to be found
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Old 01-11-2019, 10:46 PM   #6
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I just couldn't resist.....
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Old 01-12-2019, 05:56 AM   #7
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"but the wood core in the middle is rotten so I would have to cut the top layer off to replace the wood & then replace the top not good"

This is one way to repair a rotten deck, there are others.

But all are a massive job .
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Old 01-12-2019, 08:13 AM   #8
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Good move. There are plenty of boats and some will be in great condition.
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Old 01-12-2019, 08:43 PM   #9
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I just couldn't resist.....
yes I know
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Old 01-28-2019, 01:21 PM   #10
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It is too bad there isn't a repository available for consumers, like car fax for automobiles, that is done for watercraft. Or at least watercraft over a certain dollar amount. Like yachts or ??? That past surveys or major events like insurance claims or wind events could be recorded for vessels.

In the case of menzies potential vessel purchase with the survey stated above I would assume the broker would go to market the same as before that survey. Requiring the next potential buyer to do the same. Wasting time, effort and a few dollars.
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Old 01-28-2019, 01:38 PM   #11
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I have purchased four larger vessels over the years - 32' to 41.' I had a survey done on three of the four. The surveys showed some things I was not aware of and missed some things I was aware of on one of the last vessels. This surveyor recommended that I not purchase the vessel. But I did using the survey to reduce the purchase price. I've owned the boat for almost two years now and still happy.

The one I bought without survey I purchased in a hurry for tax reasons re: $27K saving. There was no problem with the hull but there was a mechanical problem with not enough air flow through the engine room. No idea if it would have been picked up in a survey? Maybe a mechanical one? I should have picked it up myself if I had just spent more time in the engine room. Bottom line is I would never again buy a vessel without a good survey done including basic mechanical. A good surveyor is worth the money.
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Old 01-28-2019, 01:46 PM   #12
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It is too bad there isn't a repository available for consumers, like car fax for automobiles, that is done for watercraft. Or at least watercraft over a certain dollar amount. Like yachts or ??? That past surveys or major events like insurance claims or wind events could be recorded for vessels.

In the case of menzies potential vessel purchase with the survey stated above I would assume the broker would go to market the same as before that survey. Requiring the next potential buyer to do the same. Wasting time, effort and a few dollars.
i also went through the same process, thought i found the right boat but survey revealed rot on flybridge deck as well as aft cabin.i walked after seller wouldn't reduce the price enough.
still looking....
why not have a section in the trawler forum where surveys on bad boats could be shared to save others from wasting time and considerable dollars on a boat we probably won't buy.....
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Old 01-28-2019, 02:11 PM   #13
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GREAT IDEA ! I presume one has rights to a survey once one pays for it. Would that not make posting such a survey perfectly legal? Could be basis for an app or simply an extension of this forum.
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Old 01-28-2019, 02:40 PM   #14
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If I order and pay for a survey, I too, think it is mine to do with what ever I choose. I would hope I could offer it to another forum user with out any legal issues.
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Old 01-28-2019, 02:40 PM   #15
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Some of the best deals I ever made were the ones I walked away from. Aircraft, boats, cars, property you name it. Smart move!
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Old 01-28-2019, 03:34 PM   #16
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If I order and pay for a survey, I too, think it is mine to do with what ever I choose. I would hope I could offer it to another forum user with out any legal issues.
The only survey I've ever purchased had specific language prohibiting anything like that.
"The survey purchasers specifically agree not to release nor reveal the survey report, nor any part thereof, to any party who may rely on the content. (Surveyor) agrees to furnish copies, as required, to financial and insurance concerns for the exclusive purposes of lending decisions and insurance underwriting. The survey purchasers agree not to reproduce, photocopy, nor quote the survey report, nor any part thereof."
The contract and the survey document are locked such that you cannot copy anything from them. Obviously you could take screen prints, but doing anything with them would be in violation of the contract.

Not sure if this is common language. Again, it's the only survey I've bought and I didn't see the need to share the results with anyone.

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Old 01-28-2019, 04:31 PM   #17
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I work in the Real Estate industry, specifically lending (read mortgages) and the verbiage is similar in an appraisal report. The buyer paid for the appraisal report because we the lender required the report to make the loan. However the report is the property of the lender that placed the order. Not the buyer (or borrower) that paid for the report. The lender is free to give the report to anyone they want. Which also means they could withhold the report. Which almost never happens in the current state of lending.

I understand a marine surveyor protecting their work. After all it is their livelihood. And from month to month the condition of a vessel could and can change. Making a smart move on the buyer's part to order a survey no matter what the past is like.

But then there is the "used car" marine sales person. Who may be focused on one thing. And how many surveys from years ago has one seen posted on a listing for a vessel. Or how many current surveys have been done where something was missed. Just seems like taking some of the mystery out of buying process would serve the industry. The auto industry has made at least attempts at creating that comfort level for used cars. (Certified used cars, car service/claims history based on VIN tied to a national reporting system, national used car dealerships ....)

I realize marine vessel sales is not to the volume of car and light truck sales, however it seems like a business opportunity. If not available as a private service based on volunteering reports.
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Old 01-28-2019, 04:43 PM   #18
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I walked away from two boats after spending a good bit on surveys, travel, etc. it see it as money well spent. We ended with a good one and feel well ahead moneywise.
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Old 01-28-2019, 05:09 PM   #19
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Ownership of a Survey

Several years ago I had a survey performed on a boat that I had under contract. Ultimately I decided not to complete the purchase.

A subsequent buyer requested a copy of the survey. The surveyor told me that I owned the survey and I could do anything I wanted with it.

I sold the survey to the next buyer for half of the amount that I had paid for it.
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Old 01-28-2019, 05:15 PM   #20
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it may well be that putting the entire survey on the forum would be illegal, however, i can't see where i would be prohibited from posting a link to the ad describing the boat and what i was told by the surveyor as well as my personal opinions of the boat. it is afterall information i learned from my experience with a particular boat that i am sharing.
any lawyers on here ?
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