Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 11-15-2010, 10:48 PM   #81
Scraping Paint
 
City: -
Country: -
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,748
Boating Straight

Quote:
reefdrifter wrote:

Do all trawlers require many turns from rudder stop to rudder stop?
Depends on the system. Our cable-chain steering system is three turns lock to lock.* We've manually steered the boat for the twelve years we've owned it and making course changes or corrections is generally a matter of an eighth of a turn or less.

Maneuvering is very easy and if an occaion arrises when we have to go full lock to full opposite lock it's just a matter of putting a finger on the king spoke and rotating the wheel three times--- there is hardly any resistance so it's easy to do with one finger.


-- Edited by Marin on Monday 15th of November 2010 11:49:26 PM
__________________
Advertisement

Marin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2010, 03:58 AM   #82
FF
Guru
 
FF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 16,534
RE: Boating Straight

On our Hyd system the engine supplies steering pressure, the wheel is just the control for a valve.

Its 40 inches in diameter , but easily could be 5 or 10.

2 turns lock to lock .

Steers just fine
__________________

FF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2010, 08:40 AM   #83
Veteran Member
 
carvendive's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 51
RE: Boating Straight

I have a twin screw FHB 38 1985. It wandered just like yours. I checked all the hydraulics and found no leaks. Then I checked and found that my fluid was low so I filled and purged the air. That made it a bit better. Then I turned the knob just below the wheel and got it even a little better at keeping course but it would still drop off.

We pulled the boat to have the fuel tanks cleaned and have some thru hulls replaced. While it was out of the water for some reason I went to the rudders and pushed on them. Bingo I could push one 15 deg off line from the other. (Our diver could have checked it in the water.) Once we dug into the problem I learned of several problems with my steering system.

First, the connector rod (at the rudder posts) had a ring on it that had elongated accounting for some of the play. I had a new one welded on.
The previous owner had (maybe) never greased the shaft bearings. Ive never seen bearings this bad. I replaced them.
The tower for the rudder post was a (sort of) upside down U shape with flat legs at the opening of the U that attached to the hull. Two of the attachments were broken and this allowed for some flex in the tower.

Now that the boat is back in the water it steers like a dream. When Im in an area with steady current (no swirls) I can let go of the wheel and let it run for periods of time without having to touch the wheel.

Anyway, my advice is to check each and every component in the system. Perhaps have your second mate open up the access to the rudder posts while underway and have a look-see for any component vibration or erratic movement.
-Dave
carvendive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2010, 09:16 AM   #84
Guru
 
Tom.B's Avatar
 
City: Cary, NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Skinny Dippin'
Vessel Model: Navigator 4200 Classic
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,154
RE: Boating Straight

Will do.

I actually grabbed the manual for the hydro steering when we were down this weekend. After reading it, it looks like there are a few things I can check. The fluid may indeed be low, but there is no bleeding procedure noted anywhere. Just to keep it the fluid full and the air will work itself to the top eventually. I will check the things you listed as well. I'd really like to solve the issue (if, in fact, there is one to be solved).

We are also on-the-hard for the next 10 days, so when I get down to paint the bottom before our trip to Carolina Beach, I'll run thru a few things with it and see what I can see.

I'll keep y'all posted. Thanks for all the help so far.
Tom.B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2010, 10:48 PM   #85
Guru
 
Tom.B's Avatar
 
City: Cary, NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Skinny Dippin'
Vessel Model: Navigator 4200 Classic
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,154
RE: Boating Straight

Just arrived at the boat yard at midnight tonight. Before I turn-in, I did a walk around and there appears to be a goodly amount of slop in my rudder. It's a clunky slop, so I'll check the connection to the cylinder tomorrow. We may be onto something. Will keep you posted.
Tom.B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2010, 03:24 PM   #86
Guru
 
Tom.B's Avatar
 
City: Cary, NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Skinny Dippin'
Vessel Model: Navigator 4200 Classic
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,154
RE: Boating Straight

Found a problem... is it THE problem... I don't know, BUT, the bolt that holds the hydraulic ram to the rudder had... WAIT FOR IT... fallen out. I replaced it for now, but will fix it with a castellated nut in the near future. That, plus the mount for the other end of the ram is not very stable. Which means that I will be better off than before just fixing those two items. So we'll see. I thin that not matter what, it will be WAY better than before.

More to come.
Tom.B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-21-2010, 03:25 AM   #87
TF Site Team
 
Peter B's Avatar
 
City: Brisbane
Country: Australia
Vessel Name: Lotus
Vessel Model: Clipper (CHB) 34 Sedan/Europa style
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 6,671
Send a message via Skype™ to Peter B
RE: Boating Straight

What was connecting it then? How come you had any steering at all? I think you have indeed found something important all right.
Peter B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-21-2010, 06:28 AM   #88
Guru
 
Tom.B's Avatar
 
City: Cary, NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Skinny Dippin'
Vessel Model: Navigator 4200 Classic
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,154
RE: Boating Straight

Sorry... I wasn't clear enough about that. The bolt was still there, but the nut had fallen off the underside. It is a lock nut (with the nylon insert), but the material the bolt and nut had to hold together (the piston and rudder) was too thick for the nut to get seated on the bolt. So it fell off. I have replaced it with a longer bolt and new locking nut until I can get a permanent fix for it. (castellated nut and pin)

I'll have pics up later today, I think.
Tom.B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-21-2010, 02:13 PM   #89
FF
Guru
 
FF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 16,534
RE: Boating Straight

I can get a permanent fix for it. (castellated nut and pin)

Agree , far better than any ny-lock nut for steering.
FF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-21-2010, 04:35 PM   #90
Veteran Member
 
reefdrifter's Avatar
 
City: Port Charlotte, Florida
Country: United States Of America
Vessel Name: Reef Drifter
Vessel Model: 1983, 34 ft., Marine Trader
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 99
Boating Straight

Here is another steering situation the I have run across today that may help others.
Last Thursday I topped off my steering hydraulic fluid at the upper helm. We went out for several hours and the steering seemed to improve from the typical wandering of before the top off. Today I again added some hydraulic fluid at the upper helm and then checked the lower helm and it seemed full. A couple of hours later I noticed a leak at the lower helm. It looks like it is coming out at the seal of the steering shaft. I had not turned the wheel to create any pressure and I am thinking it is the steering shaft seal just behind the wheel. This is a 1983 Marine Trader so I think the steering mechanisim must be fairly standard. Does anyone know what these shaft seals look like and how to remove and replace them? Where would you buy new ones? If they are just a "O" ring then if I am able to get the old one out maybe I could get one at an auto parts store or maybe Ace Hdwr. Any ideas?

-- Edited by reefdrifter on Monday 22nd of November 2010 07:29:38 AM
reefdrifter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2010, 04:55 AM   #91
FF
Guru
 
FF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 16,534
RE: Boating Straight

If you take it out , most Hyd repair shops have huge inventories of seals , O rings and compairted to boat yards their work is almost FREE!

If you see bulldozers on trailers , garbage trucks , and a few fork lifts ,in their yard, you are in the right place.
FF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2010, 02:06 PM   #92
Guru
 
Tom.B's Avatar
 
City: Cary, NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Skinny Dippin'
Vessel Model: Navigator 4200 Classic
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,154
RE: Boating Straight

Over the past two days, we taken Skinny Dippin' from Oriental to basically Surf City. The newly fixed steering is like a night and day difference. Sure, she still likes to zig a little and zag a little, but she is WAY easier to set the helm on a straight course and only make minor adjustments based on wind and current changes. We are happy with where we are at this point. There is one other minor issue that, once we either get to Carolina Beach or back home, I'll bring up with you guys.

For sure, however, you guys have been nothing short of a tremendous help in tracking down the problem and not jumping to any more conclusions, thus, cutting off the rudder extensions and ending up worse off than I was before. For that, I give you all a sincere "Thank You".

Tom-
__________________

Tom.B is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Boating in the UAE Marin Cruising and Events - The Rest of the World 16 06-16-2012 01:26 PM
Yachting? or Boating? Moonstruck General Discussion 21 04-08-2011 01:31 PM
Getting Your Partner to Like Boating marinetrader General Discussion 33 12-17-2010 03:07 AM
More NW boating Carey Cruising and Events - West Coast 1 06-05-2008 11:50 PM




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:09 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012