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Old 05-12-2018, 09:06 AM   #181
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Thanks to all who offered their words of wisdom here. we actually got bogged down in the posts that piggybacked our original post so we forgot to post an update. We found our boat and have been more than pleased with our choice. Thanks to all!!
Congratulations!!! You may want to start a new thread instead piggybacking onto another. Your pictures and posts may get lost here.
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Old 05-12-2018, 11:09 AM   #182
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Thanks Larry M. No need to start a new thread...I can't figure out how to post pics so have not plans to do that. Really had not planned to post anything else but someone asked what we bought, so I just replied to their post. Sorry if we had piggybacked and needed to move.
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Old 05-13-2018, 03:38 PM   #183
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Thanks Larry M. No need to start a new thread...I can't figure out how to post pics so have not plans to do that. Really had not planned to post anything else but someone asked what we bought, so I just replied to their post. Sorry if we had piggybacked and needed to move.
Sure would love to see pics when you get time
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Old 05-26-2018, 06:54 AM   #184
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She must love me

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Excellent advice, Mr. RT. Easier said than done sometimes, but if you're not prepared to walk, you're setting yourself up to be a victim. My mantra during any large purchase is: Don't fall in love with a [insert house, car, boat or whatever]; it won't love you back.
Oh no RT. My boat def loves me. “ but I think it’s only for the money “
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Old 01-11-2019, 03:34 PM   #185
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i have been looking at boats for over two years , had one that i walked away from after the survey and a two others that i got beat to the punch on. having owned boats for years and trying to live on my 30ft sea ray alone for weeks at a time i decided to leave the world of 20 knot cruising for the slow pace of a trawler.
really like the grand banks and albins 36 ft aft cabins but could go for a galley down sundeck as well. i have narrowed my search down to just a couple types of boats and one type of power. i think a single diesel with a thruster is the way to go, ease of maintenence, docking on my own and best fuel economy. any thoughts about my decisions are appreciated
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Old 01-12-2019, 01:20 AM   #186
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"Boat Search 101" update

Why we bought a Pilgrim 40?...

My wife Lise and I had lived respectively a long and exciting careers. We wanted a new way of living in seeking a pleasure craft that could provide us the ultimate retirement adventure, an alternative home and a memorable summer residence as a reward to our hard-working and successful life.

Current retirement alternatives do not offer much to those who have achieved something in their life and are just ready to be put out to pasture.

We had a need for a boat that could put a sense of freedom into our retirement adventure.

There is a camaraderie in a boating community that is non-existant in a cement high-rise cities and or suburb.

Our need was also to become more involved the heartbeat of life as we are more aware of Mother Nature and her ever-changing moods something you lose with big cities.

We needed more that a summer cottage so we bought a condominium for Skiing during the snow season and we wanted to buy a kind of a Canal Barge like a Boataminium for the rest of the year.

As a Sea Cadet I have sailed since the age of 14 then became a Sailing Instructor at Cornwallis Base in N.S. during the summer as a Navy Reserve Second-Lieutenant.

Since then I chartered sailboats until 1995 and around 2001 I was tired with the handling of huge headsails, getting soaked wet in an open cockpit and living in a expensive submarine, all this at a 15 degree heel.

After a 3 year of research, we made that eccentric choice : Buy a Boat with Confidence in order to find a liveaboard for that ultimate retirement experience in order to escape the jungle of traffic, jammed bridges, construction, concrete and asphalt of big cities like Montreal, Quebec, Canada.

We wanted a Boat that fits our needs and this is why we are so grateful to Doug and Brenda Dawson for all their publications that educated us in finding the appropriate boat.

Doug, Brenda thank you for helping us to make the appropriate choice in order to realize our dream!

NOTE: We had to refer to First Mate 101 in order to resolve issues that could turn the Dream into Nightmare...

With those publications we have interpreted our Research into Reality.

We then established all the criteria for safety, economy, character, comfort, style and why not grace. We were attracted by a classic look Motor Yacht that did not look like a Clorox bottle or Wedding cake type of Motor Yacht (No offence to anyone who choose Low maintenance and Bigger budget Yacht).

We did not want high performance as we have worn out the thrill of rattling our kidneys and our dishes.
We wanted to save our pocketbook in keeping our fuel tanks filled so we would spend it visiting area to discover.

Comfort was a personal choice. We wanted to equate comfort with pleasure and enjoyment. This is one of the area's that occupied most our our research and study. We don't enjoy weathering through a storm although we did encounter some bad weather and put up with Mother Nature during our trip from Fort Pierce to Lake Champlain and we were quite satisfied and impressed with her handling and performance during a tunderstorm.

Our Boat was to be our passport to civilized adventure in the nautical living environment. We did not want a boat to win races or cross the ocean, we just wanted to enjoy ourselves on the water as is it our belief that pleasure boating is for pleasure.

This Boat was to be our escape from the pressures of day-to-day existence. as a new, exiting alternative lifestyle for we wanted to taste more of life. We needed a chage of tempo as we needed to refresh our spririts like to put a smile on our face and in our heart. We are from the '' Stop and Smell the Roses'' School of Boating Generation!

We finally bought it from Jim and Joan Elliott, formaly named CHRISTINE. Thank you Jim and Joan, for using, keeping-up, maintaining and up-grading the boat instead of letting it dry up in a yard!

« REAL MOUNTIE » is a Canadian icon for a Canadian made 1986 Pilgrim 40 Hull #28 (a.k.a. as P-40) that was developed by Ted Gozzard a talented designer, tool-maker and shipwright.

The first production boat of the Pilgrim 40 Project started in January 1983. The P-40 was designed by an Artist, Ted Gozzard who expressed his natural talent and made the proof of concept (without using a computer), envisioned it three-dimensionally, drafted it, made a model, tooled and builded it to the finest carpentry detail that would be cost prohibitived today. As inflation gained over during the late 80's, Ted did mentionned that he lost $50,000.00 Cdn when he sold his last Pilgrim 40 in 1989, he said : '' It is like tearing 10,000
CANADIAN five dollars bills...''

One may understand that you need the valuable input of a market specialist to provide practical business to a passionate Artist with Boat-Creating Talents.

Having a recurrent IRS 8840 form filling issues in cruising less than 183 days in US waters as I did not want to be taxed on world income including Canada and also in reporting for cruising licences every time we dock and anchor when we leave Beautiful Lake Champlain, I wanted to sell her. At the same time, I truly love cruising the vessel in our latest trip to the Coast and to the Abacos in 2018...

So for health reasons, being concerned to be depressed of my 9 years boating season with a great trawler, I chocked and renounce to sell to two searious buyers or rent to a potential buyer who had real estate assets.

After 9 years of ranting, I finally decided to temporary import my vessel to CANADA at Gosselin Marina who would issue a Bond for my temporary storage and work on the vessel VALID until 30th of JUNE 2019 (no extension possible) as the vessel MUST RETURN in USA or REQUIRED TO PAY the goods and services tax (GST), which is calculated at a rate of 5% on the Pilgrim 40 Fair Market Value selling price; and. the Québec sales tax (QST), which is calculated at a rate of 9.975% on the selling price excluding the GST. The officials of Customs use the BUC as the standard pratice to calculate the fair market value.

UC's USED BOAT PRICE GUIDES, a.k.a. "The BUC Book", have been the used boat pricing "Bible" for the boating industry since 1961. please refer to: http://www.buc.com/

Here is an example, on January 15 1987, in Annapolis, MD a Pilgrim 40 was sold for a delivery in May 1987, at that time one US dollar was $1.3615 CDN.

The standard cost of a Pilgrim 40 in 1986 was $187,575.00 USD and additionnal equipment was $33,820.00 USD for a grand total of $221,395 USD.

If you TRY an inflation calculator on today's internet, calculate for 2017 in USD the retail cost of a 1987 Pilgrim 40 @ $221,395 : http://www.westegg.com/inflation/

What cost $221395 in 1987 would cost $484631.06 in 2017. Also, if you were to buy exactly the same products in 2017 and 1987, they would cost you $221395 and $99773.57 respectively.

At the same time,Ted Gozzard primary design evolvement was Bayfield Sailboats. This alternative concept was more successful in marketing as he produced over 1,000 boats raging from 25' to 40' in the 80's.

What a great feeling for us to see the smiles on people who tell us : What a beautiful boat you have!

Every day, people make us realize that her striking looks is the centre of attention at our Marina or when we pull in to a harbour or an anchoring bay.

The covered screened after deck (veranda deck) is to be the best comfort place to sit and relax or have our meals. We have in addition two comfy chairs and we can accommodate half-dozen people for happy hour.

« REAL MOUNTIE » gives Lise and I, pleasure and pride of ownership in showing her classic, proven full displacement hull, with her plumb bow, fantail stern, gently arched windows, varnished mahogany trim, her sheer line, cosmetic details all combined to create an dream impression about herself and about her owners living their dreams that only one's own eyes and not our words can explain... Take your time and find a boat the was maintained with log books and that has keep servicable over the years as if it was in the hand of the original owner! I hope this help ... Kind regards and Good luck!

PS: If you want lots of boat for market price and can refit to original shape, used Pilgrim 40 are a good investement as to rebuild on band new is cost prohibitive.... Here is one interesting project for sale: https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/198...arine-3252628/ CAVEAT EMPTOR: It is not a marine trader and verify all specs and Hull Identification number: XBV409M84G
Attached Thumbnails
BUC VALUE 1986 PILGRIM 40 A1.jpg   BUC VALUE 1986 PILGRIM 40.jpg  
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Old 01-12-2019, 07:25 AM   #187
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WOW; quite the post! - Glad you two have had and are still having FUN!
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Old 01-12-2019, 12:23 PM   #188
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2016 TrawlerFest at Kent Island helped me a bunch! Steve Zimmerman taught two classes I attended, and one of them had two charts about fitting the boat to your cruising plans and intentions. Key issues were matching the distances from the coast to the type of hull, and the number of people aboard/time aboard/size of boat. I recommend contacting Steve at Zimmerman Marine to see if he will share those. Better yet, attend the next Trawlerfest near you and talk to him. He was gracious with chat after the sessions, too. (I ended up with a Camano 31, perfect for Trawler Heaven, which is coastal North Carolina - so many protected waters, large water, beautiful colonial small towns to visit, and soooooo much more.) Talking to others in attendance helped a lot, too, finding out what they liked and didn't like about their boats. Plus, there were boats from small Rangers up to a Fleming 55. Fun! 10+ years of subscribing to PassageMaker while I had other types of boats also helped, and sailing experience including cruising a little under sail makes any trawler look spacious! I have no original thoughts to add, but I sure learned a lot from so many kind boaters along the way!

Best wishes, and enjoy the process!
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Old 01-15-2019, 10:10 AM   #189
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Buy one that does not have lots of Kitsch like anchors and lighthouses and palm trees on the bedspread and curtains...………….and door mats...………...
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Old 03-09-2019, 06:22 PM   #190
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hi folks
i just got a 1986 chien hwa 35 foot senator under contract, wondering if anyone can tell me the actual dimensions of this boat. specifically the height from the very bottom of the keel to the top of the flybridge( minus the sprayshield, bimini, mast etc.
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Old 03-09-2019, 09:07 PM   #191
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Originally Posted by tn6437 View Post
hi folks
i just got a 1986 chien hwa 35 foot senator under contract, wondering if anyone can tell me the actual dimensions of this boat. specifically the height from the very bottom of the keel to the top of the flybridge( minus the sprayshield, bimini, mast etc.
If you can locate mfg's specification of draft in water. Then tape measure from top point you want to use as upper most portion to the water. By adding those together you should be within a couple inches of exact measurement. For trailering purposes on hwy's I'd error to the upper side measurement rather than the lower.
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Old 03-10-2019, 12:53 AM   #192
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Great Advice!
well said.
Nice
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Old 06-26-2019, 08:09 PM   #193
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Boat Information

Is there a website for trawlers that is the equivalent of sailboatdata.com?
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Old 07-15-2019, 11:25 PM   #194
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My input is to look at the total cost of ownernship, the cost to purchase is just the beginning. There's a compromise between purchase price, size, and cost to maintain the boat. The larger the boat the more it costs to maintain, and it isn't linear, it increases sharply with size. This isn't a problem as long as you anticipate it. For me I'd make sure I had 20-30K in reserve for upgrades and unexpected repairs on an older boat. No matter how careful the survey there will be things that need fixing.
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Old 07-16-2019, 01:33 AM   #195
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My input is to look at the total cost of ownernship, the cost to purchase is just the beginning. There's a compromise between purchase price, size, and cost to maintain the boat. The larger the boat the more it costs to maintain, and it isn't linear, it increases sharply with size. This isn't a problem as long as you anticipate it. For me I'd make sure I had 20-30K in reserve for upgrades and unexpected repairs on an older boat. No matter how careful the survey there will be things that need fixing.
There is the old adage "buy the smallest boat you are comfortable on"...
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Old 07-16-2019, 06:56 AM   #196
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There is the old adage "buy the smallest boat you are comfortable on"...
Or... Buy the largest boat you are comfortable owning!

Of course, to reach either decision correctly one needs to already know at least a fair amount about boating before choosing an applicable boat.
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Old 07-17-2019, 09:50 AM   #197
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I would look not just at the boat, but at her actual layout. There isn't much you can do about the layout without serious money. So even if your boat isn't ideal, if the layout works over time you can make her better.

First though, live with what is there. There is a reason why the PO (Previous Owner) did things one way. Though it may not seem apparent at first, and indeed you may want to change things, being sure the change is necessary is one important way to save money.

Things like bilge pumps don't count. Upgrade them (usually there are not enough)
Don Casey's "This Old Boat" is a good one to help new owners prioritize. Also buy Calder's newest edition of Boatowner's -- don't worry about understanding it. When something is broken or needs fixing, with Calder's you may be able to do your own troubleshooting and repairs.

Every cruiser I know has Calder's aboard their boat.

I opted for smallest possible. That makes a big difference in costs, both up front and in upgrades.

Good luck. Etc.
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Old 07-28-2019, 11:33 AM   #198
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In searching for a boat, I see lots of references to Yatchworld. I've heard that some of the best boats sell by word of mouth at the marina or local area. Once it gets to Yatchworld, it is usually because it is overpriced or needs work, or both. Love Yatchworld as it makes great reading but thoughts from those who have more insight on my thinking. Thx.
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Old 07-28-2019, 11:56 AM   #199
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In searching for a boat, I see lots of references to Yatchworld. I've heard that some of the best boats sell by word of mouth at the marina or local area. Once it gets to Yatchworld, it is usually because it is overpriced or needs work, or both. Love Yatchworld as it makes great reading but thoughts from those who have more insight on my thinking. Thx.
Works the same way for jobs. Most are found/offered by word of mouth, not recruitment ads.
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Old 07-28-2019, 02:37 PM   #200
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In searching for a boat, I see lots of references to Yatchworld. I've heard that some of the best boats sell by word of mouth at the marina or local area. Once it gets to Yatchworld, it is usually because it is overpriced or needs work, or both. Love Yatchworld as it makes great reading but thoughts from those who have more insight on my thinking. Thx.
Yachtworld is one of many sources to find boats - no more or less valuable than others dependent upon your location and boat search specs.
I am sure some of the worst boats sell by word of mouth as well....
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