Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 07-13-2011, 01:41 PM   #21
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 24
Bitten!

Baker, thanks for the reality check. Here's the boat I'm sort of using as a "standard" http://www.trawlerforum.com/t4254644...r-located-nor/

I'm here to learn, express some of my own experiences in hopes that someone may point something out to me that I don't know. So far, the later has panned out quite well. It's really funny that you should say this..." IOW, the beautiful blond with the big boobies is not always the right choice....might be fun for awhile but then reality will rear it's ugly head....and there you are..." Been there, done that...nearly, and very litterally killed me. Not just figuratively in boat-speak, but also in reality. My ex is hell on wheels. The Admiral nearly fits the same physical description, but she is an angel sent from heaven to save me from myself. I digress...

I have looked at many of the types of boats you suggested. No offense, but it sounds like you want to keep me (a newbie) out of the club. Don't take that the wrong way. There are many reasons why we both have drifted towards trawlers. One is the amount of boat for the money. Another is the creature comforts and berthing space for company. Not the least of our reasons is fuel economy and reliability. I know of plenty of people who fish from blow boats, so as far as fishing is concerned, I don't intend to take out charters or enter competitions with something like a trawler. We've had lots of fun anchoring out at the island on the weekends with about 100 of our neighbors. We're in the middle of the Norhtern Gulf coast with ICW in both directions. We've got tons of artificial reefs and some natural bottom to fish within 10nm of the beach, so I don't anticipate serious offshore fishing. We've been going out in a 20'er and 30'er. We still pick our days. As a professional pilot flying in the Gulf, I'm about as close as you can get to being an expert in the meteorlogical and sea conditions out here. I've seen it all. Been out here a WHILE. I know what to run from and what to sit and wait out. I also know how soon I need to run and which direction provides the safest escape. The most open water I would consider crossing, for now would be the little cut from Aplachacola to Cedar Key. Those other boats you suggested, by comparrison are hugely over-priced, wildly inefficient, and many are not put together very well. I love classic boats. I first fell in love with wooden run-abouts when I was a kid growing up near Louisville. Those convertibles and sedans all seem a little "white" to me. I like teak and mahogany throughout the living space. Its warm, inviting and classically nautical. The others are fishing boats first, with a little place to get out of the weather or get an okay night's sleep. I want a floating condo that I can take anywhere inexpensively and still have a dedicated area to pull supper from the briney depths. I'm a catch and fillet kinda guy, (Ssshhhh)! We want to sleep comfortably and maybe even sleep in a little later than sunrise! Try that in a cuddy and you'll baste in your own juices.

I have every reasonable expectation that a sound vessel with well maintained mechanical, plubing, climate and electrical systems should last a while...well into the period of our "dreams". There are pletnty of 30+ year old boats out there to prove my point. I also have every reasonable expectation that the boat will get used a minimum of every other weekend. Now, you mentioned it being a "major production" to launch. Haven't you had a shore boat before? Geez! Hook up, drag it to the ramp, wait in line to launch, find a parking space for the boat, find a parking space for the truck and trailer, blast off, come back and repeat. Load up, tilt up, tie down, lower aerial equipment, go home, back in, pick up the trash can, straighten, back up, unhook, flush, wash, cover...its wearing me out just typing it all! Isn't it far less of a production to pay the harbor master each month, wheel the cooler down the dock, mount up, power up, disconnect shore power, cast the lines and ease out of the marina?

Your advice is well received with no salt added. I'm still looking and it maybe entirely possible that something in another class and category fulfills our desires. I was formerly unfamilliar with trawlers. Having done some investigating on the subject, it just seems to be the best choice at this moment. We would really like a bigger boat than we last had. That one was about as big as I am comfortable trailering, so whatever happens next, it will be slipped anyway.

David, in addition to the above comments, speed isn't important to me...not at all. In fact, I recall many times hearing "SLOW DOWN!!" in 4'ers. What she didn't realize is you can either be dry and beat up, or soaked to the bone and queazy. Guess what speed found the compromise! Yup, 7-10kt. I'm all out of that game. There isn't anyone I need to keep up with or out-run. Serious fishing is a helluva lot of work. If I'm not getting paid, I'm not spending my liesure time doing any sort of serious work...for fun. Talk about a contradiction in terms! I'd rather be anchored up enjoying some music, maybe a beverage, splashing about and then saying, "Hey, who wants to go fishin' for a little while?" Yeah...we can do that. Maybe cruise the ICW to Pt St Joe and* do a little scalloping. Maybe keep going down the ICW and suck down some fresh oysters. Maybe cruise the other way and dock in Destin for the weekend, chill out at by Crab Island and take the dingy to the bar-boat. These days, I'd rather be on the water for the whole weekend and maybe just fish for a couple of hours. By a dedicated fishing area on the boat, all I require is a SAFE area for such an activity that isn't a story or two above the water. I don't use down riggers, out riggers, kites or other fancy accoutrements.

Marin, right on. I wish I had done that with my previous boats. Whatever I get, I'm keeping a logbook.


-- Edited by nehringer on Wednesday 13th of July 2011 01:55:48 PM
__________________
Advertisement

nehringer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 02:11 PM   #22
Senior Member
 
Dswizzler's Avatar
 
City: LaPaz ,Mexico and the Sea of Cortez
Vessel Name: Delta Swizzler
Vessel Model: 1988 58' Vantare
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 215
RE: Bitten!

Congrats on being bitten, it reading your posting you seem detmined* to buy a diesel trawler and there are many in the the market within your price range. Something you may want to think about is your normal cruising distance. I have thousands of boats around me in the SF Bay and Delta, and most boats are 80% more boat then the owner will ever use. Not trying to talk you out of anything , but be realistic while you are looking. If your typical cruise is going to be 20 miles or less 90% of the time, gas is something to consider, even on a 30-45 ft boat.* The worst thing you can do with a diesel is to under use it. These engines are designed to be run longer and worked harder then most boaters push their engines.

*

Plus buying a gas boat will be cheaper to start with, fill at the pump and in many cases repair. This allows you to buy newer or larger, focusing on other areas of concern. Just some food for thought. I actaully moved to a marina farther away, knowing that the V6/92's needed the work and driving then a hour and shutting them down, was about the worst thing I could do for them.

*

Lot's of decisions, but now is the time to drink in all the free information you can get and process what is important.

*

Good luck with your shopping,

*
__________________

Dswizzler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 03:15 PM   #23
Scraping Paint
 
City: -
Country: -
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,748
RE: Bitten!

Quote:
nehringer wrote:
There are many reasons why we both have drifted towards trawlers.
*Neil--- I am going to send you a Private Message containing some of a long post I wrote quite awhile ago to another person new to trawler-type boats.* It has to do with what I feel is the best way to approach the purchase of one of these boats.* I'm going to PM you because most people here have already*read this stuff from me ad nauseum so I'm not going to post it again.* But you may find some value in it.
Marin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 03:18 PM   #24
TF Site Team
 
Baker's Avatar
 
City: League City, Tx
Country: Texas
Vessel Model: Carver 356
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 5,633
Bitten!

First off, I have said it before and I will say it again. There are more important things to consider than fuel mileage and reliability when it comes to the gas versus diesel argument....IMO. The two that jump right out at me are the explosion hazard you have with gasoline and the carbon monoxide hazard. I can tell you right now, there is no way I would sleep well(maybe too well) on a gas boat with a generator running while sleeping. NO chance whatsoever. Just thought I would point that out.

And ringer, I hear ya loud and clear. But just to clarify, I was not talking about a small boat with a cuddy cabin. A convertible sportfish has just as much space as an equally sized sedan trawler. And there are some out there that do have nice lines and some classic style. They are usually fitted out with the same type of teak fit and finish as any trawler. And most are engineered and built in the USA which means systems and wiring and overall build quality will be better. And I certainly get your idea about "white". Anyway, not trying to change your mind but just saying. And the Californian you posted is a nice boat. I am a fan. Not of that particular model but they are well built boats built right here in the good ole USA. And just for comparison, they also build a convertible sportfish at 42ft as well and it is fitted out every bit as nice as the one you posted with the same engines(albeit boosted) and 7years newer and $10k cheaper...(http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1987.../United-States)....just sayin'...;-)

*

Anyway, here is a yachtworld link to the boat I believe you are look at:

http://www.yachtworld.com/core/listi..._id=77729&url=



And you are more than welcome to join our group. *I was just saying that there are options out there that might fit your desires more than a trawler...I honestly did not know but I was just throwing it out there for you or for whoever else that may be reading this. *I think about this stuff a lot. *And ultimately I think I am pretty close on why boats sit at the marina and go unused...expectations just don't meet reality. *It is THAT simple. *And your reply to me was very emotionally charged...complete with "walks on the beach and nice sunsets". *All sounds GREAT!!! *Buy just trying to keep ya honest...;-). *You also have to make sure your wife and kids don't fizzle out on you. *What if they do? *Are you still "in"? *They need to be very "key" in your search if you want them to remain on board.

And we aren't discussing whether a boat will last for 30 years. *We all know that they will. *The question is if the boat that you want NOW will still satisfy all of your criteria when you enter the "dream" stage of your life... *And I will make a generalization and fo out on a very short limb and say the answer is very likely...NO! *I am not retired and living aboard right now. *I will be retired and hopefully living aboard in 20 years(hopefully LIVING...hahaha). *My needs NOW are very different from what I will want/need in 20 years. *That is all I was saying...







-- Edited by Baker on Wednesday 13th of July 2011 04:02:20 PM
Baker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 04:04 PM   #25
TF Site Team
 
Baker's Avatar
 
City: League City, Tx
Country: Texas
Vessel Model: Carver 356
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 5,633
RE: Bitten!

And as I type this my wife texts me about a boat that I have been lusting for going on sale for a song.......talk about bitten!!!!!!!!!!!
Baker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 04:22 PM   #26
Scraping Paint
 
City: -
Country: -
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,748
Bitten!

Neil--- WIth regards to determining if a trawler-type boat is what will meet your needs, an idea that has worked for a number of people, including us, is to charter one for a week or whatever. There is no better way I can think of to find out if this type of boat will provide what you need and want to do than trying one on for size. Visit some places typical of where you'd like to go in your own boat, do some fishing, and so on. Sure, it's not cheap but it's a lot cheaper than buying a boat and then finding out it's not really suited for what you want to do.

We chartered a GB36 to see if we liked the whole "big boat" sort of thing and after awhile decided we liked it so much we bought one (a MUCH older one) for ourselves and have not regretted the purchase once in the last thirteen years. But thanks to the charter experience we knew pretty much exactly what the boat would do for us, and what we could do with it before we paid a penny for our own boat.

And, as it's turned out, the GB36 has proven ideal for what we do with it even though it is not our preferred boat design.* Not too big, not too small, and well suited for the coastal inside*waters we boat in Washington, BC, and (eventually) SE Alaska.* So the money we spent on chartering was well worth it.

*PS--- The boat we ended up buying is a tri-cabin, which is the same configuation as we'd chartered.* However we did not buy this boat with the intention of ever having guests on board-- we bought the boat to get away from people, not drag them along with us :-)** So the forward cabin became a great storeroom and project shop.*

But a year ago people I used to work with in Hawaii moved to the area, plus good friends from France started talking about cruising with us.* So we've ended up having guests on the boat and the tri-cabin layout has proved ideal for this.* With each couple in their own cabin separated by the main cabin, people can get up, make coffee, whatever, without disturbing anyone else.* And each cabin has its own head and sink so nobody gets disturbed during the night.*

In our climate we believe a Europa-style boat is more user-friendly than a tri-cabin IF... there there are only two people on the boat.* We would still prefer this configuation over the tri-cabin even though in a 36' boat a Europa generally only has one stateroom.* This means a*second couple will have to sleep in a berth made up in the main cabin.* But if you intend to carry guests or other family members on a regular basis, a tri-cabin is a great setup for that.


-- Edited by Marin on Wednesday 13th of July 2011 08:55:53 PM
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	05-toward vondonop 1.jpg
Views:	37
Size:	58.7 KB
ID:	6678   Click image for larger version

Name:	03-toward refuge cove.jpg
Views:	39
Size:	93.8 KB
ID:	6679   Click image for larger version

Name:	15-enroute.jpg
Views:	39
Size:	132.4 KB
ID:	6680  
Marin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 07:38 PM   #27
Guru
 
JohnP's Avatar
 
City: Toms River
Country: USA
Vessel Name: D U E T T E
Vessel Model: 1996 36' Island Gypsy
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,109
RE: Bitten!

This thread has been an interesting read!

Nice to read Marins posts again.

I got into trawlers because I like their Classic Salty Looks.

Not really a good reason but I still like em a lot.** Most are quite slow and me being an ex sailor can easily handle the slow steady pace.

With that said, Baker makes a lot of good points for the convertible sport fishermen.

They also look classy and can get up and go when you want to move out.

Your kids will love it.* And you can cruise* farther during a weekend than you could in a week on a true trawler.

And for fishing--Well thats what they were designed for.

20 years from now if you still what a trawler you can buy one that will be newer than getting an old one now and keeping it.

Besides the big sportfishers have awesome living arrangements, nice salon and muliple staterooms.

What more could you want?*** JohnP
JohnP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 08:23 PM   #28
Guru
 
Codger2's Avatar
 
City: San Diego
Country: US
Vessel Name: "Sandpiper"
Vessel Model: 2006 42' Ocean Alexander Sedan
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 5,421
RE: Bitten!

Quote:
JohnP wrote:
With that said, Baker makes a lot of good points for the convertible sport fishermen.

They also look classy and can get up and go when you want to move out.

__________________________________________________ ______________

Couldn't agree more! I've had two sport fishers (in my younger days) and had a ball with them. With two kids that are in 11th grade, it may be the way to go. As John said, when you're ready to retire, get a trawler.
Codger2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 08:38 PM   #29
Guru
 
Moonstruck's Avatar
 
City: Hailing Port: Charleston, SC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Moonstruck
Vessel Model: Sabre 42 Hardtop Express
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 7,853
RE: Bitten!

By not having a trawler I stayed out of this one until I saw Baker had broached the subject of possibly a sportsfisherman.* There is nothing like one busting out through the inlet in a head sea.* The guys up on the bridge riding it like a chariot.* I love'em.

That being said, there are plenty of boats that can be a compromise between that and a trawler.* A 38' Chris-Craft with aft cockpit comes to mind.* Plenty of accomodations and a small cockpit for fishing.* there are plenty of others that could fill the bill.* A two stateroom express or sedan style could d it.* I am past retirement age, but not retired.* We love the trawler life style, but don't have the time for long slow trips.* Our boat fishes quite well (without the dinghy carried on the stern), but that can be a problem on any style boat.*

From '81 to '87 I had a trawler.* Loved it, but found why they may not be the boat for working people.* Of course, they can be right for you, but if you want to cover distance in a short time they are not the one.* It was my choice to keep working, but I still like cruising to many locations.* At 25-27 knots it is possible.* However, when we get there we cruise much like the trawler crowd.* We anchor and putter around.* By the way, a good dink is almost as important as the choice of boat, but that is another subject.

20 years is a long time.* In the last twenty years I have had 3 boats.* They all had their good points.* In that time we have moved from primarily fishing to primarily cruising.*
Moonstruck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2011, 09:18 PM   #30
Guru
 
Edelweiss's Avatar
 
City: PNW
Country: USA
Vessel Model: 1976 Californian Tricabin LRC
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 1,834
RE: Bitten!

Nehringer

Wow!! A lot of different opinions here. *

But it's fun to read what everybody likes in a boat and why. *While I don't agree with all of them, I respect their opinions. *After all it's your style and what you appreciate that counts. *You know what they say, "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder."

Those two 42 Cal's powered by Cats are quite the buy, each for different reasons. *I would be happy with either one.

It's a big step, but I think you've thought this out and whatever boat you choose will be the right one for you.

Good Luck

Larry B
Edelweiss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2011, 04:59 AM   #31
TF Site Team
 
Peter B's Avatar
 
City: Brisbane
Country: Australia
Vessel Name: Lotus
Vessel Model: Clipper (CHB) 34 Sedan/Europa style
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 6,670
Send a message via Skype™ to Peter B
RE: Bitten!

Nehringer, I think I know where you are coming from. For most of our boating life, when our kids were young we had trailer yachts, our last being a 'maxi'. It was fun, and they had the advantage of being able to be taken to interesting places quickly, but accommodation was pinched, privacy minimal.* Not an issue when kids are kids, but once they are teenagers or more, and one is not as flexible as before, then ROOM becomes more important - better still, ROOMS plural. We also found when we moved to a warmer climate from NZ, (Queensland, Australia), that being able to get out of the sun, but still be 'outside' was what one wanted to be able to do, but harder in a yacht, even quite a large one. And boy can I relate to your following comments...

"Geez! Hook up, drag it to the ramp, wait in line to launch, find a parking space for the boat, find a parking space for the truck and trailer, blast off, come back and repeat. Load up, tilt up, tie down, lower aerial equipment, go home, back in, pick up the trash can, straighten, back up, unhook, flush, wash, cover...its wearing me out just typing it all! Isn't it far less of a production to pay the harbor master each month, wheel the cooler down the dock, mount up, power up, disconnect shore power, cast the lines and ease out of the marina?"

And yes, I love the sentiment in the last sentence...and if someone offered me a trailer boat now, I would say, "thanks, but no thanks - been there, done that."

I think the coloquial term 'trawler' is understood, but a bit of a mis-nomer, as others have mentioned.* They are really 'coastal cruisers', with the top end ones being true long range, ocean-going versions.* I think this is the concept which has bitten you, and for good reason.* Stick to the plan, but take on board all the great advice you have had, and you won't go far wrong.* If I was to put here the pluses and minuses of my boat now after owning her 10 years, all I would change is for her to be a bit newer, with less timber in her construction, and a tad bigger, just enough to accommodate a double walkaround bed instead of Vee berths in the stateroom, otherwise I wouldn't change a thing, and we just love the sedan/Europa type layout.* If you want to fish as well, that's almost a must, for what it's worth.
Peter B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2011, 09:56 AM   #32
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 24
RE: Bitten!

Thanks all, and thank you Baker for posting that link. That is a beautiful boat. You're all actually giving me exactly what I asked for in my original post; options! Peter makes an excellent point in that it may not necessarily be a "trawler" but rather the whole idea of coastal cruising that appeals more so than the actual vessel. Of course after having narrowed my gaze ever so slightly, trawlers are all that I have been looking at and I have a really good idea now of the specific uses, features and style that we want. Its very true that another class may offer us the same and I will expand my horizons accordingly...maybe even take a look at a Californian up in Georgia! Still, and I don't care if it's powered by Cats of Hemi's, all I see when I push the knobs forward are dollar bills pouring out of the thru-hull exhaust ports. Pushing 12,000+ pounds of glass, wood, meat and gas at speeds of 20kts into a head sea sounds to me like a very expensive weekend. Boy, could you imagine a Hemi powered boat? I just threw that in there for effect, but egads! I think I would name the boat "Slurpie"; 1. because she'd be slurping down gas, and 2. a Slurpie would be all you could afford at the fuel dock!

We shall see. I'd really hate to put a magnificent fishing machine like that into service and spend the bulk of our time on her inside the rocks as opposed to using her for what she is really designed for. As far as living space, that specimen is quite spacious. However I sort of see it as a class C motorhome compared to the class A represented by slower trawlers and other types of cruisers. I definitely dig it, but I'll have to see what the Admiral thinks. I really don't think she wants to experience that whole crashing into the head sea at 20kts kinda thing anymore. I don't blame her. I'm ashamed to admit it, but due to the nature of my work I don't have any buddies here at home. I spend my working week immersed in a testosterone rich environment. That's where my pals are. Once or twice a year, I can get one of my buddies to travel from Louisiana to Florida for a little fishing, but that is more of a couples weekend. I don't EVER see loading the boat up full of my dude-bro's and spending the whole weekend slaying blue marlin in the canyon. Ain't gonna happen. My dad always told me never to use a tool for anything other than its intended use. I think I was driving a nail with a big crescent wrench at the time or something. To me a sportfish is a tool with a specific intended use. Sure, you can do the whole fam-camp thing on it. I'd feel pretty guilty if I thought that I "stole" a boat like that from the used market and thus kept a charter captain out of business. Then again...chartering the boat myself to a captain could possibly get me a boat for free at some point. Yes, I read other threads too!

My database of information is continuing to grow and this is probably one of the most fair and informative message board threads I have ever participated on. That by itself speaks volumes about the sort of people I am likely to encounter cruising on a trawler, compared to the ilk that normally runs sport-fishers. You can find many of those fellas over on Thehulltruth.com. After spending some time on that board, I can honestly say that I have finally found a collection of grown-ups with whom to share boating insights. Just mosey on over to that sight an read some posts in the boating thread, if you haven't before. Its terrifying to realize that some of those fools posting there are actually out on the same water as you are. Thanks again!
nehringer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2011, 10:34 AM   #33
Guru
 
Woodsong's Avatar
 
City: Atlanta
Country: USA
Vessel Model: Bayliner 4550 Pilothouse
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,630
Bitten!

All good posts thus far. *

My answers to the original questions:

1) No, it's probably not cost effective to own a boat for many years before cruising full time, however, it sure is heck is FUN to own a boat that you can cruise locally and spend the night on! *

2) Should you look for the "end all- be all boat" or what meets your needs now....I'd go for what meets your needs now and the near future. *

*

Trawlers definitely have their plusses and minuses. *We are slightly younger than you perhaps and younger kids (late 30's for us, 7 and 8 year old kids). *We find our trawler a great platform for time on the water. *We've owned faster express cruisers and a bigger gas powered sport sedan, all of them less than a few years old when we bought them. *As you said, if you are going fast, you're paying to play and paying a LOT to do that. *You are going to be potentially limited in cruising range by going for a slow trawler but you will save a ton of money. *Trips I have taken on our trawler cost me up to $1,000 less in fuel than I would have spent in my previous 38' gas powered sedan. *It is a trade off but there is a lot of happiness to be had in knowing your boating is costing you virtually nothing. *Hahaha- nothing- well, not quite if I actually factor in all the costs, but hey, fuel is among my lowest expense. *And while most folks on our dock with the faster boats sit at the dock due to their fuel costs, we are anchored out every weekend having fun with the kids. *Reality is that most folks cruise their larger/faster boats at hull speed so 90% of the time they are traveling the same pace I am. *Difference is they may be burning 10 gallons per hour and I am burning less than 2.

Personally, we also love the salty looks and warm, classic interior...it calls to us MUCH more than any of our previous boats ever did. *Our boat was a project boat of sorts that we have done a full refit on and learned a ton about her systems as we rebuilt stuff. *In the end, old boats have their issues and require work, but at the same time, a trawler can be a very cost effective way to get your family on the water and never have to worry about the expense of boating or rising fuel prices. *Our family loves being on our trawler and working on her has been a fabulous bonding experience for my son and I especially (not that we weren't close to begin with).

And I am with Baker, I don't care what the cost savings is of a larger gas powered boat, I'll personally never own another one!! *They are underpowered, handle terribly, and are a bomb waiting to explode and E10 fuel is causing tons of problems.

*

P.S. I know that Californian sportfish Baker linked to in Cumming, GA on Lake Lanier. *She was kept on the dock across from us for years when we were there with our previous boat and I've walked around it on the docks as I have sold several boats on the dock she is on. *he fires the engines up once a year and they smoke like crazy but probably kills all the spiders on the dock! * *I can give you more info if you are interested in that particular boat. *I don't think she's left the dock in years.


-- Edited by Woodsong on Thursday 14th of July 2011 10:36:41 AM
Woodsong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2011, 12:27 PM   #34
Scraping Paint
 
City: -
Country: -
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,748
RE: Bitten!

Quote:


Isn't it far less of a production to pay the harbor master each month, wheel the cooler down the dock, mount up, power up, disconnect shore power, cast the lines and ease out of the marina?"
*Mmmm.... not necessarily :-)* If you get into this type of boat you will find that there can be a fair amount that needs to be done before getting underway.* We have a checklist we use before getting going and anther one for before we leave the boat after a trip.* Engine room checks, opening or closeing certain seacocks, opening and closing propane bottles, getting the navigation equipment programmed, and so on.

Before we go home we always leave the boat ready to go for the next trip.* And no matter how much we try to streamline the process it always seems to take about two hours.* What with vacuuming, washing things down, flushing the dinghy motor, stowing things where they belong, and so on.* Our first boat, which we still have, is a 17' trailer fishing boat and if I discount the time driving to and from the boat launch I would guess that we spend at least the same amount of time, if not more, getting the GB ready to go or ready to leave as we do launching, retrieving, and cleaning up the trailer boat.

That said we also know people with cruising boats who come down, get on, toss stuff up forward, start up, and go.* And when they come back the tie up, shut down, lock up, and leave.* But their boats are in what I would call a permanent state of disaray and dirt.* So it all depends on what state you like to keep your boat :-)
Marin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2011, 06:56 PM   #35
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 24
RE: Bitten!

Yeah, I'm sure I over-simplified it to a degree. BUT, side by side...c'mon man...you have to admit that a slipped boat is less of an ordeal than a shore boat. I'm still going to have a little shore boat, but it will be child's play compared to the behemoth on wheels we just got rid of, or even a direct replacement for it. I mean child's play in the literal sense as I will be trusting my first mate to tow, launch, operate and recover it himself. We're close enough to the marina that we could spend Friday night on the boat and prepare it for a weekend outing.

After looking at some of the other boats that have been suggested, I'm starting to look at all of the Californians. I know you said that the brand wasn't of particular importance, but the Californian line seems to stand out with most of the features we are looking for. Any particular gouge on that brand? I'm very familiar with the construction of shore boats and I know what deficiencies to look for in a used one. With larger boats, what should I be aware of in terms of construction? I'm talking about structural components such as stringers, transoms, bulkheads, etc. Blisters are basically impossible to see until the boat is hauled and old bottom paint removed, but is that a serious area of concern too? I get the sense that fiberglass trawlers, cruisers, etc. are built with a little more attention to detail as opposed to the mass production techniques of shore boats. Am I on point here? I know that a good survey will identify most deficiencies, but I would be looking at the boat first, before I have it surveyed. I need to know what to eliminate before I spend money on a surveyor.
nehringer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2011, 07:59 PM   #36
Scraping Paint
 
City: -
Country: -
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,748
Bitten!

Quote:
nehringer wrote:
I know you said that the brand wasn't of particular importance, but the Californian line seems to stand out with most of the features we are looking for. Any particular gouge on that brand?

I know that a good survey will identify most deficiencies, but I would be looking at the boat first, before I have it surveyed. I need to know what to eliminate before I spend money on a surveyor.
When I said brand wasn't important I meant when you first start making decisions about what sort of boat to get.* Thoroughly defining all your requirements--- and I mean ALL--- will narrow your search down to a particular type and configuration of boat.* Trawler, sportfisherman,*tri-cabin, pilothouse, planing, semi-planing, displacement, single engine, twin,*or whatever.* But when you're ready to begin your search for*the particular type of boat that you've decided best fits your requirements,*brand becomes extremely important.

I know virtually nothing about the Californian brand.* I've never been on one, I don't know anyone personally who has one.* I don't much care for the aesthetics of their designs*so I*would never consider buying one.* Consequently I've spent no time learning anything about them. *But like music,*this is a totally subjective opinion and has no bearing whatsoever*on what you or anyone else likes.* So the only suggestion I can offer is hunt up people in your area*who have them, preferably similar models and ages as the*Californians you're interested in, and ask them everything you can think of about the boat.* This will help you learn what specific things to look for and be aware of.*

If there is an on-line owners group for Californians, join it and start asking questions.* We frequently get people unfamiliar with Grand Banks on the GB owners group asking questions about the boats, either as new owners or potential owners.* There is proabably no better source for detailed information about a specific brand and model than an owners group.

When we went to inspect, sea trial, and have surveyed the Grand Banks we eventually bought my wife and I knew next to nothing about these boats other than what we'd learned in the course of chartering one.* So in the days prior to our going to California to inspect the boat*we drew up a list of everything*we could think of that we should check out.* I mean everything, from whether or not the clock worked to what the engine exhaust looked like on startup.* We put down every piece of equipment, switch, mechanical device, water faucet, upholstery,*you name it, that we figured would be on a boat like this.*

When*we we got to the boat we went through our list item by item.* We'd put a few things on the list that*weren't on the boat, and the boat had a few things that weren't on our list.* But it was a great aid in helping us*conduct a systematic inspection and check-out of the boat.* The list started at the bow and worked its way to the stern.

But the real proof of the pudding is in the professional engine and hull/system surveys you have done.* This generally requires two surveyors since most of them specialize in either engines or hulls/systems.* We hired what were supposed to be among the best engine and hull surveyors in the SFO Bay area and had them thoroughly check out the boat, the engines, and the generator.* Survey results are, in my opinion, the most valuable aids you will have in making your purchase decision.* Good surveys by professional surveyors familiar with the*type and brand of boat*you're*considering and the kind of engine(s) in it*aren't cheap.* But they are far cheaper than buying a bad boat.

If you find a boat you think is a real candidate but--* like us at the time--*you're not all that familiar with this kind of boat and you're not*sure what problems or potential problems to be on the lookout for, you*might want to do what we did and take a friend or acquaintance along who is very familiar with this kind of boat.*

The friend we took with us to California in 1998 to help us check out the boat we'd made an offer on had a 30-year and counting career in the marine engineering*industry and was totally familiar with the type of boat we were looking at.* But the real value to us was that*he was totally objective.* Unlike our and the*seller's brokers who were both there, too, he had nothing to gain or lose in the sale of*the boat*and he didn't care if we bought* it or not.* So he had no emotional involvement in the process.* I don't know if you know anyone like this but if you do they could be a real asset in your corner as you look for the boat that's right for you.*

The cost of our friend's airfare, lodging, and meals for the two days we were in Alameda I consider to be some of the best money we've ever spent.* His presence and advice took a lot of pressure off of us and*served as a credibility check on what the surveyors were telling us.* This made us much more confident throughout the whole inspection, sea trial, and survey process, and ultimately, it gave us confidence in our decision.* It also made the whole experience a lot of fun.

*


-- Edited by Marin on Thursday 14th of July 2011 08:22:19 PM
Marin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2011, 08:17 PM   #37
Guru
 
Edelweiss's Avatar
 
City: PNW
Country: USA
Vessel Model: 1976 Californian Tricabin LRC
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 1,834
RE: Bitten!

As a long time Californian owner, mine is a 37' tricabin 1976 model, (about the same as a 38", just not enough deck space for a storage hatch in the rear deck) I can tell you they are built like a brick s--t house.* Heavy construction, with solid glassed in wood stringers and they will take a lot of rough water abuse!!* The glass is well laid up and plenty heavy, never had a problem.* Never had any blisters or separations, voids or delaminations. My two friends, a 38' and a 42' tricabins, would tell you the same thing.
They are very roomy boats and easy to handle.* Californians were pretty much all twin diesels 34' and up.* Now somebody surprise me and tell me they have a single.* They made many different variants.* I ran across a Californian commercial gillnet fishing boat once.* You would recognize it in a minute with the distinctive house and flybridge, way to weird!!
*
I have seen mostly Perkins fours and sixs, 85's, 130 hp - 185 hp either turbo'd or na's.* The na's seemed to hold up better though.* Later they began to use 3208 cats, na's and turbo's, and with 375 hp each they could get up and haul tail, at some expense of course.* I guess it wasn't so expensive then as red diesel was around .50 per gallon in those days.* I remember filling mine up in Lake Union, Seattle when I picked her up from the dealer, it was .42 cents per gallon for No 2 in 1977.
The one weakness I have found is in the windows.* The windows are not just wood trimmed, they are wood window frames with the glass sealed into them.* The diesel vibration and effects of time eventually loosens the sealant and they will leak.* You have to remove the trim every couple of years scrape out the old sealant and reseal them. The 10' long aft cabin windows are the worst and are best replaced with aluminum frames and new glass, which is less than a thousand to do them both.*
They have always been a great buy and other than that, love the boat.
Edelweiss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2011, 09:27 PM   #38
Guru
 
Egregious's Avatar
 
City: Sunset Beach, NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Polly P.
Vessel Model: Monk 36
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 554
Bitten!

Quote:
nehringer wrote:
Hello all. I've recently been bitten with the trawler bug. I've been boating all my life and I have been through a pair of offshore fishing boats in the last two years. My last was a big Pro Line, twin OB walk-around. After carefully examining our intended usage of the next boat, it seems that something a little less utilitarian is what we really want. We still want to fish, but I think camping and cruising are going to be higher priorities.
[snip]
Sir,

I am "40 something" and by no means retired or semi-retired or independently wealthy.*

However, I have watched my finances carefully, and I am debt free.* I paid cash for my trawler because I consider it a toy and not an investment. I did, however raid my home equity line for part of the cost, but the rate is currently 1.75% so that is basically free after the tax break.

The time my wife and I have spent on our boat so far are worth every penny we paid for it, and afterwards that is gravy.*

If your finances are correct then buy a boat that won't bust your retirement.


-- Edited by Egregious on Thursday 14th of July 2011 09:28:10 PM
Egregious is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2011, 08:59 AM   #39
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 24
RE: Bitten!

That's awesome, Woody. I'm not far behind you. My finances have seen both sides of the storm and will be correct within about 20 months or so. Two divorces within 10 years is financially crippling, I don't care how much one makes. I'm on the downhill run. so to speak, from the last one and I can finally see light at the end of the tunnel. It's now a matter of firm discipline and doing without some things until my house is completely in order. That is why I am conducting such extensive research now; I've got time.

Edelweiss, I understand that you have had that boat since it was new...wow...fantastic! Thank you for the information. I'm quite sure that any longtime owner of about any brand would make similar comments about theirs, but that is all good stuff to hear. Unlike Marin, I am actually drawn by the Californian aesthetics. In addition to the 42' tri-cabin, I like the 38' sport fish, lrc tri-cabin and even the 34' lrc. I don't know exactly what it is, but they are all representative of all of the things we like. Not that another brand is incapable of impressing me, but so far, two dimensionally I'm diggin the Cali's. Once this process reaches the "tire-kicking stage" I will be able to make a more subjective inspection of my aesthetic likes and dislikes of all of the others.

Marin, this site is an awesome networking resource and I have no doubt that at some point I will have someone locally who can assist me with the selection process.
nehringer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2011, 11:29 AM   #40
Boat Bum
 
Alfton's Avatar
 
City: Kemah, Texas
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Traveling Star
Vessel Model: Pilgrim 40
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 164
RE: Bitten!

Quote:
Baker wrote:
And as I type this my wife texts me about a boat that I have been lusting for going on sale for a song.......talk about bitten!!!!!!!!!!!
*What boat do you lust for baker?
__________________

Alfton is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:45 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012