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Old 11-01-2015, 02:10 PM   #1
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Another capsize, more bad news.

This is two tales in one.
Although it turned out (luckily) ok, it should never have happened and news people should be shot with balls of their own BS.

Why should it have never happened?
Tad Roberts can likely fill us in on the boat, but..

It's 0200 and though a near full moon, probably not great visibility.

We have an 8 knot (my guess) boat travelling in an area of narrow passages with converging currents. At 0200 on Oct 28, it would have been at, or near, full flood where the current can and often does, run to 8 knots. He would have been going with the flood.

You decide.

Why do I say bad news?
When a story like this is done after the fact, they rely on file footage and just make it up as they go along to create a sexy story.

I can see a couple of newsies, sitting in some studio in Vancouver. They're looking at a "map" where they see "Desolation Sound" (yeah, that's a name well known and familiar to viewers) and "Hole in the Wall" (oooooh, scary). This gives them something that helps ratings and makes advertisers happy.

So, if the vessel was travelling "between Sonora and Stuart Island," which makes sense, it is about 25 NM from Desolation Sound. If it is headed "to Vancouver," which again makes sense, it is nowhere near Hole in the Wall, much less "in Hole in the Wall Channel." If he floated past the "luxury resort" shown, that would have been Sonora Lodge which, like I said is not in Hole in the Wall or near Desolation Sound. Bad news.

The boat:
http://blog.tadroberts.ca/2013/03/the-oliver-clark-ii/

The News
Floating gas cans helped BC man survive whirlpools, night overboard


The news link is slow and if it doesn't work try this
https://www.google.ca/search?site=&s....0.2NPStlq-VTs


The real deal
https://youtu.be/MT6QhJ5RPiw
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Old 11-01-2015, 02:16 PM   #2
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The above, my friends, is why I rarely watch the news and when I do, I don't believe a G D word they say. This is what feeds cesspools like Facebook and makes everyone an expert. This is why, when it comes to the El Faro's, the Leviathan's, the Russian planes and aunt Jemima's underwear we should all just cool the rhetoric and speculation.
----There! Consider yourselves lectured.
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Old 11-01-2015, 03:16 PM   #3
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Another capsize, more bad news.

The BCTV news link isn't working...at least for me it isn't.


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Old 11-01-2015, 03:36 PM   #4
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Alex Thomson capsized Hugo Boss yesterday as well.
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Old 11-01-2015, 03:49 PM   #5
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I used to know nothing about anything. Then, about 34 years ago, I learned a trade. (I fly airplanes, big ones). Judging by the way the media reports on my industry I can reasonably infer that EVERYTHING you see on the news and read in print is 80% garbage, and I'm trying to be nice.
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Old 11-01-2015, 04:08 PM   #6
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Bad video link...
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Old 11-01-2015, 05:31 PM   #7
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Funny it worked fine for me on my iPad.
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Old 11-01-2015, 05:33 PM   #8
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Tim I consider that a bit extreme but I've been extreme on TF myself.

That's akin to putting one's head in the sand or closing your eyes. I question most everything and that's probably one of the reasons I've survived about 8 years here on TF. I'm curious like the cat but like picking things apart and not taking things at face value.

It is shocking when the media goes that far into lala land but the temptation must be great. Look at all the gullible people out there. Not one is here on TF of course. But w most media it exists to sell advertising .. not to inform people. Look at our recient political debate and notice the moderators questions were carefully designed to promote action .. as in raised voices and insults. Indeed more than one question was a terrible insult in itself.

Think of what it would be like w no media. What would we know? Almost nothing. That's a clue of how much control they have on our minds and beliefs and attitudes. But IMO the only defense is to think as rationally and objectively as possible to be as well informed as I can. If you took the media away for six months .. came back and presented the standard media news you'd likely shout "how absurd .. can't be true".
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Old 11-01-2015, 05:54 PM   #9
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None of the news stories are to be believed. Third-hand dock gossip is not much better. I was just told a completely different story about this event.

The man in the water was the deckhand on the boat. The boat did not capsize but did heel over in a whirlpool in the middle of the night. The deckhand fell overboard and did grab those gas cans. I was told Seymour Narrows but it could easily have been the Yuculta rapids. There was some problem with control after the heeling event and the boat hit the beach or a rock. It was towed to Campbell River. I was told the deckhand was picked up by a rescue helicopter, in the news video he says some locals in a boat picked him up.....

For a while any marine problem will become a "capsize disaster"
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Old 11-01-2015, 08:51 PM   #10
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None of the news stories are to be believed. Third-hand dock gossip is not much better. I was just told a completely different story about this event.

The man in the water was the deckhand on the boat. The boat did not capsize but did heel over in a whirlpool in the middle of the night. The deckhand fell overboard and did grab those gas cans. I was told Seymour Narrows but it could easily have been the Yuculta rapids. There was some problem with control after the heeling event and the boat hit the beach or a rock. It was towed to Campbell River. I was told the deckhand was picked up by a rescue helicopter, in the news video he says some locals in a boat picked him up.....

For a while any marine problem will become a "capsize disaster"
Tad, what you "heard" certainly makes more sense than the news footage, which was all over the map, literally. They mentioned Campbell River, Desolation Sound, Hole in the Wall and showed Sonora. Can't believe much of it. Even the first hand account of the man overboard was puzzling, if not questionable.
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Old 11-02-2015, 05:47 AM   #11
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Why was he going at 2 am, alone in a dangerous passage? Can't wait for the final report on this one.
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Old 11-02-2015, 06:58 AM   #12
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Think of what it would be like w no media. What would we know? Almost nothing. That's a clue of how much control they have on our minds and beliefs and attitudes. But IMO the only defense is to think as rationally and objectively as possible to be as well informed as I can. If you took the media away for six months .. came back and presented the standard media news you'd likely shout "how absurd .. can't be true".
(Eric, the following is not directed at you; just some musings on the most misunderstood profession on the planet.)

People talk about "the media" like it's a monolithic system that conspires to misdirect us and that "news" comes to us from some pristine source, like clay tablets, that any one of us would recognize instantly as "the truth." Neither is accurate.

"The media" is made up of individual human beings with every possible shade of ability, competence, integrity and objectivity. Some are great at what they do and some are disasters. Some are extremely gifted at reporting "the news" but we don't like the message--so we discount it and blame "the media" for telling us things we don't want to hear. Sadly, TV reporters are often the least competent because they tend to hire young, inexperienced beautiful people as "reporters" and tend to be more focused on packaging than content. But certainly not always.

"News" should not be confused with "truth." "News" is made up of stories and accounts created by people who are actually in the business of gathering and presenting news. It is not a social service or absolute reality or a burning bush; it's a BUSINESS and people are in it to make a living while providing an essential service to which they are more or less committed. To attract an audience, the stories need to be both informative and attention-getting. There is no excuse for getting the facts of a story wrong, but the weight that one reporter gives to a fact or set of facts will vary just as <spoiler alert> facts receive different emphasis by various posters on the Trawler Forum. Try and write a story sometime that is balanced, fair, factual, on-deadline and that satisfies the entire reading or viewing public. My guess is that people will accuse you of missing facts, being in the pockets of big business or being a pinko.

I've worked in or with the news media for 45 years and I know reporters who would rather lose a limb than get the facts wrong. They are dedicated, professional news gatherers and perform an indispensable service to society. I've also known reporters who are just so lazy, vain or ambitious they don't let facts get in their way. One of the worst things, IMHO, to happen to the media is the 24-hour news cycle, that compels media outlets to publish "news" that no one 20 years ago would have spent 10 seconds reading.

If I don't like the superficiality or accuracy of a news outlet, I go elsewhere, but I try not to change just because I don't agree with the story that I'm reading. That, to me, is the definition of putting my head in the sand. Finally, if anyone thinks we'd be better off without a free and unfettered media, spend some time where it's state-controlled. It's the first thing that tyrants take over and suppress.
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Old 11-02-2015, 09:11 AM   #13
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Well put, Angus99.
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Old 11-02-2015, 10:12 AM   #14
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Well put, Angus99.


The 24 hours news cycle was bad enough, but social media has really ramped up the pressure to get a story out as fast as possible to an even higher degree.

A very few people will read or watch a news story, then do a bit of follow up research of their own or check out the story from several sources. Back in the day, my parents used to get newspapers and news magazines from around the world because they didn't want to get their information on world events solely from a North American perspective.

These days the evolution of news has given us reports on TV as events are occurring, either from the scene, or from a reporter (usually standing outside) at the nearest location to the event. The goal is to hook the viewer into that station, to make the viewer feel that if they went to another channel they would miss some important new development.

Problem is, TV is the same medium conquered by the likes of Aaron Spelling's Three's Company and The Love Boat, where he who slakes the thirst of the lowest common denominator wins the numbers game.

Best to wait and form a strong opinion about a story once it has had time to settle out...having said that...prognosticating early on in a story can be fun for viewers, it's just something reporters shouldn't do.
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Old 11-02-2015, 12:14 PM   #15
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I liked Three's Company.
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Old 11-02-2015, 01:42 PM   #16
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The 24 hours news cycle was bad enough, but social media has really ramped up the pressure to get a story out as fast as possible to an even higher degree.
Agree, Murray. Social media and the availability of free "news" on the internet are two of the biggest pressures quality journalism faces. A lot of great newspapers and broadcast newsrooms have gone under because they can't find the magic bullet to make news gathering pay when someone's giving it away--or because people are saturated with information. Social media, 24-hour news channels and bloggers all have their pluses and minuses. The biggest minus, to me, is that the more we rely for information on "140 characters," "news readers" and "news aggregators" vs. experienced journalists, the more the profession of news gathering and reporting will waste away. When that happens we can all welcome back 1984.
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Old 11-02-2015, 03:02 PM   #17
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Based on history...the news only has itself to blame.

Sorry but after a lifetime of relaying I found to the reporters and seeing e enough the most simple, handouts incorrectly transcripted....well it is easy to distrust people who try to relate factually to something they have no background in and fumble to connect dots they cant.

People complain about weather forecasts..heck they get it right more than the reporters who are there AFTER the deed is done...at least the weather guys are right 50/50 looking into the future.
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Old 11-02-2015, 03:13 PM   #18
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Based on history...the news only has itself to blame.

Sorry but after a lifetime of relaying I found to the reporters and seeing e enough the most simple, handouts incorrectly transcripted....well it is easy to distrust people who try to relate factually to something they have no background in and fumble to connect dots they cant.

People complain about weather forecasts..heck they get it right more than the reporters who are there AFTER the deed is done...at least the weather guys are right 50/50 looking into the future.
Have to agree. Having been involved in various incidents over the years, and seeing the news reports, I often wondered if the reporters were talking about the same situation.

It does make one wonder how accurate our view of history is.
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Old 11-02-2015, 03:15 PM   #19
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I liked Three's Company.
Well...Mrs Roper was some kinda hottie who single handedly put the Hubba-Hubba back into Moo-Moo's, I'll give you that!
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Old 11-02-2015, 04:24 PM   #20
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Based on history...the news only has itself to blame.

Sorry but after a lifetime of relaying I found to the reporters and seeing e enough the most simple, handouts incorrectly transcripted....well it is easy to distrust people who try to relate factually to something they have no background in and fumble to connect dots they cant.

People complain about weather forecasts..heck they get it right more than the reporters who are there AFTER the deed is done...at least the weather guys are right 50/50 looking into the future.
Well, we've led very different lives.

It would be great if the media worked as simplistically as many think they do. What I have found in a lifetime of working with the media is that accuracy often depends on how effective the people are who work directly with reporters. Stonewall them, feed them a lot of pablum or expect them to take everything they tell you at face value and you're likely to be very disappointed with the outcome.

As I said, the quality of reporting varies and is deteriorating in many places for the reasons I noted. Your experience may have been with lightweights or newcomers or maybe just some inept reporters. But tarring the entire media with one brush based on your limited experience is unfair.

Keep in mind that reporters are not there most of the time when news happens. They're reconstructing events based on accounts given to them by multiple sources. They are usually not eyewitnesses and don't have the luxury, as you often insist on, of waiting until all the facts are in to write a story or render an opinion. Their job is to gather the news--both facts and context--and report it immediately -- or they lose their job. They also cannot accept "official" versions as the only version of what happened. There is always more than one side to a story and their job is to get them all and keep them in balance.

Try this: get 3 buddies in a room and watch a movie--any movie. Tell them their livelihood and careers depend on them writing a story about what they just saw, capturing all of the key points, times, dates, places and events. It must be accurate, well-written, grab the readers' attention, include all major points of view -- oh and they have one hour to get it done before it will be broadcast to the world. I doubt you'd find two stories that read the same.

It's easy to bitch about how reporters get it wrong, but most of the people that savage the media would curl up in the fetal position under that kind of pressure.
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