anchors (or the lack there-of)

[Peter B]

Marin and Peter B,
I made a survey today of all the anchors that were visible on J and K floats in LaConner. Seems there were 35 steel Danforths, And 22 Claws. Then there was One Fjord, 7 Deltas, 4 CQRs, 3 Fortress's and three Rocnas.
So I wouldn't be criticizing Art too heavily for not surrounding himself w all the groovy stuff.

Oh dear, Eric, you took me far too literally. Perhaps I should have put 'research' like that, in inverted commas..? Naturally I meant it in a general, not scientific, sense. And yes, what you said above supports what many of us have said in the past, yourself included, that most people go to a lot of trouble to avoid exposing themselves to demanding anchoring conditions, so often a large lump of anything would hold. However, many older anchor types, Danforth being one, are fairly bottom specific, and/or dogs to get to fit nicely on a bow roller/windlass arrangement.

Good come-back from Marin though, I thought.

My point in posting at all was just to raise the point there are now multi-bottom, quick-setting, good performing actors out there now. Let's call them all-rounders if you like - which may not have the ultimate holding power of some designed specifically with one bottom type in mind, but close enough, and which obviate the need for all that extra weight up front, (a concern you often raise), stowage space, and cost of carrying spares. Not to forget the not inconsequential difficulties than can be encountered if and when trying to change from an unsuitable anchor. Especially if in the dark and wet and rising wind, and often with cold, numb fingers. That's all...

 

[Marin]

Old fashioned anchors have been around forever. Hence word "old" used to describe them. There are far more "old fashioned" Chevys, Fords, VWs, etc on the road than Teslas. Despite the fact that Teslas are selling like hot cakes, at least in our area where even high school kids drive them, they are still few and far between simply because they're quite new to the market. So it is with rollbar anchors.

The vast majority of the anchors in our harbor are the old fashioned ones, which certainly stands to reason. But about once a month or two or three I notice another boat that's changed to a rollbar anchor. Presumably it's someone who anchors out a lot. boaters who don't, which is the majority of them, have no motivation to switch from whatever anchors are on their bows now.

 

[psneeld]

While I agree that walking around a harbor full of CRUISERS WHO ANCHOR might be useful...walking around a marina looking at anchors on boats that may anchor 1-5 times a year for the afternoon or POSSIBLY overnight is hardly worth mentioning as a comparison of "who's using what".


More likely a statement for what came with the boat or what the dealer put on the boat or what was on sale at West Marine.

 

[Nomad Willy]

Hi Peter and thanks for the response. However you make it sound like Dans set only one out of every four times whereas in reality they probably set in one out of 100. And once set the holding power of a Dan is good. Some new anchors are "scope specific" though. I'm anxious to see how my Supreme sets w/o it's roll bar. Would like to find an average bottom to do some "setting" .. does sound like work though.

Re the Dans fitting on bow rollers I saw a good bow roller that accommodated the Danforth anchor quite well. I'll take a pic of it today. Art and many others may want to know of it's existance.

Marin,
Old .... Yes old. The very thought is distainable. Nobody likes old but I bought a Dreadnought anchor partly because it looked old and was even older than that. But most people just really like "new" and "modern" and some like "next generation" stuff staying "ahead of the curve". But you're newer anchors ARE better at holding but not as good at some things considered very important to many. New is good only if it is good and often not as good in some to many ways. My new car gets unbelievable gas mileage and has great power but is hard to get out of and has really poor visibility. A very stiff ride too. So new is sort of a "not so worn out" thing to me. I have a 87 Nissan that is a wonderful little car but at 280K is quite worn out. But re anchors my Supreme is IMO practically w/o fault. Does everything well. But in really super slimy mud (that which I have not found) it seems lacking compared w the OLD Danforth.

Psneeld I really didn't have time to have a lifestyle evaluation w the people representing the boats in my "survey" so not being judgemental about that. The anchors were attached to the boats present.

 

[Marin]

}
Marin,
Old .... Yes old. The very thought is distainable. Nobody likes old but I bought a Dreadnought anchor partly because it looked old and was even older than that.

Nothing wrong with "old" stuff if one accepts the limitations that come with it.

The DC-3 is a wonderful plane. Reliable, good performance for its day, and so on. So sure, you could start an airline and use DC-3s, and they would be just great at doing what they do well.

Which isn't flying above the weather, flying non-stop with a full load of passengers and/or cargo across the US, flying people and stuff around at Mach 0.85, flying non-stop across oceans, flying non-stop between destinations people want to go these days to like Seattle-London (9 hours by jet) or Seattle-Dubai (16 hours by jet).

You get the picture. "Old" still works, but it only works as good as it did when it was "new."

The "old" anchors are good at some things. Danforths are great in sand and mud, for example, But the "new" anchors do more things well than the "old" anchors do. If one wants to load their bow up with a Danforth for sand and mud and a CQR for whatever it's good at, and a Spade for weedy bottoms or whatever, great.

Or...... one can go buy a rollbar anchor and do all that stuff real well. Certainly as good as the "old" anchors in whatever their specialty is, but they do a lot more. Sort of a 777 vs DC-3 for a bordering-on-the-ridiculous analogy.

The only exception I've seen to date is in super-mushy mud like they had in that Chesapeake Bay anchor test. With slop like that, the rollbar anchor can't work as it's designed to do. But in everything else, it's great. So if one is going to be anchoring in super-sloppy, mushy mud, then that person should carry an anchor that has more of a chance of working halfway decently in the stuff.

But for everything else, the rollbar seems to do the job just fine based on the testimonials from all over the world as well as our own and people we know's experiences.

So we carry one anchor on the bow and an "old fashioned" mushy mud anchor on the stern that's sized to be the main anchor of the boat should we need to use it that way.

All the rest of the "old" anchors, including the new interpretations of old anchors (Vulcan, etc.), are of no interest to us anymore because they don't offer us anything in the way of performance and holding reliability that we don't already have.

 

[kelbylinn]

Main anchor is rocha 65lbs with 120' chain. In the lazzarette is a 30 lb danforth with only 20' chain on another 150' of rode. We're primarily gulf coast cruisers from Houston to key west and home port dauphin island, Alabama. In our travels to key west this past winter we used only rocha and never dragged nor did we have to try more than twice to set the anchor in unknown bottoms. I'm kind of a "kiss" fan for the waters encountered so far.

 

[markpierce]

The highest tech roll-bar anchor at our dock:

 

[Nomad Willy]

I'll bet that Bugel anchor is very good except in slimy mud. I see very few. Looks like it could be a good setter and penetrate deep enough to hold well in a small size. Spade just introduced a new updated version of this anchor .. economically priced too.

Looks like that one's been around for awhile or had an inexpensive galvanizing job as there's considerable rust. Do you talk to him Mark? If so what does he say?

 

[markpierce]

Looks like that one's been around for awhile or had an inexpensive galvanizing job as there's considerable rust. Do you talk to him Mark? If so what does he say?

Never saw the owner or the boat being used.

 

[eyschulman]

I carry a good general purpose anchor on bow with fair amount of chain and rode and only use my second aluminum anchor with short chain and mainly rode about 1/15th of the time. The second light high holding power anchor kept below is usually set from my dinghy for it is easier to place it where I want it with no danger of running over a rode. When I place the second anchor it is not always because it is essential but more an insurance issue allowing for better sleep or in a anchorage where a shift of wind over night would put me to close to where I don't want to be. I don't have an opinion as to which is the best functional anchor but I do believe my anchor is the most artistic and well made piece of bling I could hang on the bow.

 

[Peter B]

Hi Peter and thanks for the response. However you make it sound like Dans set only one out of every four times whereas in reality they probably set in one out of 100. And once set the holding power of a Dan is good. Some new anchors are "scope specific" though. I'm anxious to see how my Supreme sets w/o it's roll bar. Would like to find an average bottom to do some "setting" .. does sound like work though.

Eric, small but important point of order…but I made no remark about the set percentage of the Danforth, but did you really mean it only sets about once in a 100 tries..? That sounds a bit harsh, even for a Danforth. I had one on my yacht, and it did better than that, but did not do well when a fluke tip picked up a shell, plastic bag, tin can, or other rubbish on the bottom.

Also, I too am very interested to hear how your bar-less Manson Supreme sets sans roll bar.

 

[AusCan]

An anchor survey of TF members local marina would be interesting. I did quick survey a while back, but don't have the exact numbers with me.

From memory, the Marsh stockless anchor (what I use) was about equal in popularity with admiralty anchors (each about 25%). After that Rocna's were 3rd most popular at about 20%.

A local survey may indicate a local trend for no particular good reason, but it may say something about the local bottom and the anchor required for that environment.

 

[windmill29130]

An anchor survey of TF members local marina would be interesting. I did quick survey a while back, but don't have the exact numbers with me.

From memory, the Marsh stockless anchor (what I use) was about equal in popularity with admiralty anchors (each about 25%). After that Rocna's were 3rd most popular at about 20%.

A local survey may indicate a local trend for no particular good reason, but it may say something about the local bottom and the anchor required for that environment.

You'll also find out how many anchors never get wet. In the grand scheme of boating, there is a very small percentage of boaters that actually anchor out overnite.