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Old 06-05-2014, 08:34 AM   #21
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Ahh Pete, do I detect a embryonic Kiwi stirring?

Typical, just in time for the Bledislo cup. ( for all those friends north of the 'line' look it up)
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Old 06-05-2014, 07:14 PM   #22
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If football was like that, the Seahawks would have an automatic bye to the next SuperBowl no matter what they do during the season. Or Spain is already in the World Cup Final, because they won it in 2010.

I thought the idea of the AMERICA's Cup was to pit the best of the last victorious COUNTRY against the best of the rest of the world. Maybe it has always been this way(?) but it seems an odd way to encourage competition.
Oracle is the best of the last victorious country. Unfortunately, they are also the "only". If enough zillionaires get interested, there will be defenders series again sometime in the future. Use to happen all the time, but not in recent times because of the costs.
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Old 06-05-2014, 07:37 PM   #23
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Wxx3 said,
"The coupe de grace was lowering the wind speed they could race at. That killed the what suspense was left."


That's about your only statement I agree with, I afraid - that and the introducing of an arbitrary maximum time limit in low winds Otherwise Team NZ would have been the winner hands down, having been way ahead in one race when the wind went ˝ a kn over the max allowed so called off. Then, in another was entering the final leg, way ahead, when it was abandoned because it exceeded the time limit…interesting that..and they all were NZers - might have been one non-Kiwi..? Can't remember now.
There was nothing arbitrary about the 40 minute time limit at all. It was done for TV purposes. They had 2 hours - enough for two 40 minute races, a 32 minute interval between races, a short pre-game show, and maybe a little left over for a re-cap.

The actual problem was not having set a low-end wind speed limit to begin with. It should have been set at least to 10 knots and this never would have happened. But, don't feel sorry for the Kiwi team as everybody knew the rules, except the TVNZ announcers, Martin Tasker and Peter Lester. Feel sorry for the Kiwi fans watching on TV. They thought the race was won and when the counter started at about the 38 minute mark, the announcers had no idea what it meant. Gary Jobson of the U.S. broadcast brought it up within 2 minutes of the start and kept mentioning it throughout the race. Now, the Kiwi's listening on the radio were fine, as the announcer there, P.J. Montgomery, was also very aware of what was about to happen.

No, not all Kiwi's on the Kiwi boat. Glenn Ashby and Adam Beashel are Australians.
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Old 06-05-2014, 08:04 PM   #24
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The whole nationality sub plot doesn't play well in the United States perhaps as we are a country of immigrants. Frankly I fail to see the relevance of it myself.

I'll admit my ignorance but do football and rugby have any nationality restrictions?

If they do I've not noticed it but admit to being only a casual fan of the All Blacks from afar. My wife's a bit more rabid though
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Old 06-05-2014, 08:31 PM   #25
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Didn`t the Cup start from a race run by the Royal Yacht Squadron around the Isle of Wight in England, which in 1851 was won by a boat called "America"?
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Old 06-06-2014, 06:25 AM   #26
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MY problem with the racing cats is they dare not sail up to the edge.

Most ecert other boat can be sailed yp to near disaster and perhaps , with skill, beyond.

When a cat capsizes the repairs (new wing mast) are so immense that it is frequently out of the race for the season.

Far more fun when the sailing master is willing to take a chance at over pressing the vessel than when he dares not.

J boats !!!! SO bigger more interesting races can be done , and they get to the race on their own bottom, not in a cradle.
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Old 06-06-2014, 08:03 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BruceK View Post
Didn`t the Cup start from a race run by the Royal Yacht Squadron around the Isle of Wight in England, which in 1851 was won by a boat called "America"?
Yes Bruce, correct…and it stayed in New York Yacht Club for 134 yrs (the longest any sporting trophy has ever been held by the same holder), until Alan Bond's Australia II took it to Fremantle.
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Old 06-06-2014, 08:07 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by CPseudonym View Post
The whole nationality sub plot doesn't play well in the United States perhaps as we are a country of immigrants. Frankly I fail to see the relevance of it myself.

I'll admit my ignorance but do football and rugby have any nationality restrictions?

If they do I've not noticed it but admit to being only a casual fan of the All Blacks from afar. My wife's a bit more rabid though
Yes, National Football (most or all codes) teams have to be citizens of the country at least, even if not born there. This is true of the Football (soccer) world cup and similarly for Rugby and most other sports, fielding national teams. Of course in the 'World Series" baseball, all the teams are in the US I believe, so that's kinda different.
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Old 06-06-2014, 08:14 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nsail View Post
There was nothing arbitrary about the 40 minute time limit at all. It was done for TV purposes. They had 2 hours - enough for two 40 minute races, a 32 minute interval between races, a short pre-game show, and maybe a little left over for a re-cap.

No, not all Kiwi's on the Kiwi boat. Glenn Ashby and Adam Beashel are Australians.
I guess when I said arbitrary, that's what I meant. Made to fit into TV scheduling. Rather weird right. I mean, can you see them stopping Superbowl a few minutes before the end because they had had too many time-outs and the set TV time was over - I think not - or maybe they might..?

Yes, you were right, there were a couple of Aussie Bros in there…so were there actually any US citizens in Oracle at all..? I know they roped in a Brit as navigator when the US guy seemed to be out of his depth a bit. Dammit - he was good.
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Old 06-06-2014, 08:39 AM   #30
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Of course in the 'World Series" baseball, all the teams are in the US I believe, so that's kinda different.

There's still one team hanging on in Canada. The other moved to DC a few years ago.
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Old 06-06-2014, 03:55 PM   #31
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Yes, National Football (most or all codes) teams have to be citizens of the country at least, even if not born there. This is true of the Football (soccer) world cup and similarly for Rugby and most other sports, fielding national teams. Of course in the 'World Series" baseball, all the teams are in the US I believe, so that's kinda different.
Interesting, thanks for that. I wonder how common immigration to a new country is when large money contracts are on the line?
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Old 06-06-2014, 04:33 PM   #32
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I enjoyed the Americas cup for the first time last year

If anybody doesn't think these boats were being pushed the limit, they just weren't there. I raced cats and planning dingy's for better than 25 years and I have a feel for what those boats were like. The acceleration was hard to believe. These boats were on the edge anytime the wind was up. The tv coverage made it interesting for nonsailors and sailors alike. The races were explained and people on the shore could actually see who was leading. For once the boats actually looked fast. This was racing that you didn't have to be a monohull racing snob to understand. Imagine pitch polling at 40knts and being throw into the air from 40 plus ft. Maybe smaller boats will bring in more contenders and more competition. If you weren't there to see these boats you have no concept as to how fast these boats were. What I would like to see is the format change from match racing to fleet racing.
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Old 06-06-2014, 05:48 PM   #33
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AC62 Class Rule was announced. One design wing, crew of 8 vs 11 in the 72's and estimates are costs should 1/2 as much as the 72's. We will see.

Latitude 38 - 'Lectronic Latitude

http://www.cupinfo.com/downloads/ac6...1p0-060514.pdf
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Old 06-06-2014, 07:13 PM   #34
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I guess when I said arbitrary, that's what I meant. Made to fit into TV scheduling. Rather weird right. I mean, can you see them stopping Superbowl a few minutes before the end because they had had too many time-outs and the set TV time was over - I think not - or maybe they might..?

Yes, you were right, there were a couple of Aussie Bros in there…so were there actually any US citizens in Oracle at all..? I know they roped in a Brit as navigator when the US guy seemed to be out of his depth a bit. Dammit - he was good.

Yes, there were 2 US crew for the 1st five races, until Kostecki was replaced, and obviously only 1 after that. The rest were from -

Australia - 4
New Zealand - 2
Italy - 1
The Netherlands - 1
Great Britian - 1
Antigua - 1
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Old 06-06-2014, 07:18 PM   #35
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If anybody doesn't think these boats were being pushed the limit, they just weren't there. I raced cats and planning dingy's for better than 25 years and I have a feel for what those boats were like. The acceleration was hard to believe. These boats were on the edge anytime the wind was up. The tv coverage made it interesting for nonsailors and sailors alike. The races were explained and people on the shore could actually see who was leading. For once the boats actually looked fast. This was racing that you didn't have to be a monohull racing snob to understand. Imagine pitch polling at 40knts and being throw into the air from 40 plus ft. Maybe smaller boats will bring in more contenders and more competition. If you weren't there to see these boats you have no concept as to how fast these boats were. What I would like to see is the format change from match racing to fleet racing.
Agree to everything except the fleet racing. While I love fleet racing, for the AC I don't think it would be near as good. A slower boat is surely going to get in the way of faster boats at some point and screw it all up (just watch the 45's and you'll see). This is the ultimate for this sport, and one on one for all the marbles is the only way to go, IMHO
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Old 07-18-2014, 11:41 PM   #36
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Looks like Australia has withdrawn. What a huge loss! Sounds to me like the ridiculous requirements and vague future plans set up by Russell Couts and OTUSA are backfiring.

Will England step in as challenger with BAR?

Update on teams for the 35th America?s Cup - 35th America's Cup
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Old 07-18-2014, 11:45 PM   #37
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Some people seem to be so competitive they can't make friendly with the opposition.
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Old 07-19-2014, 01:10 AM   #38
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That's disappointing news Al. Also, news which we here in Australia have not yet been advised of, suggesting they are not proud of what they have done. Dammit. I was thinking with a team in it, we would get more involved here. I have also not heard if NZ is going to have another go either. You would probably know about that as well..?
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Old 07-19-2014, 02:58 AM   #39
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An Australian withdrawal has not had publicity here. Knew something was up, I`ve not had a call about crewing.
Oatley Wines were the sponsor? I think they are doing ok, the annual Hamilton Isl. Race Week is being publicised, so the cause is probably not $ related.
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Old 07-19-2014, 03:17 AM   #40
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I detect gamesmanship and 11th hour negotiations. A lot can happen between now and Aug 8.

It's not money and the lack of Australian news coverage is deafening.
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