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Old 11-21-2015, 07:24 PM   #41
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Nice writing Hawg,

Just a few more details cause I'm picky about history....

Starting in the 1930's diesel yarders replaced the steam donkey, and there were still lots of those machines busy into the 1970's. By the 80's they had been replaced by steelspars and grapel-yarders, which are in prolific use today. There are still lots of places that aren't a plantation for the feller-buncher to cruise through......

Early Skagit yarder

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Steel Spars in use today

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Old 11-21-2015, 07:53 PM   #42
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These are fairly recent .. about 3 years ago.
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Old 11-21-2015, 09:18 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marin
Actually, skidder is a function not a definition of a type of machine.
Well we are both right and into semantics now.
In actuality, donkeys were yarders or loaders with yes, various functions and methods.

Skidding was a (cable) function of sky line logging which was employed on steep rugged terrain with high cables and trolleys to get the trees/logs well up off the ground.

Cortes, where you found that thing in the bush; was one of the lowest shows on the coast and because the cuts would be small and terrain low, it is almost certain to have been a high lead operation, meaning no skidding lines. As an aside, some of my school mates probably set summertime chokers on that beast.

"Skidder" followed over to that particular piece of equipment I showed, because it did the same function as a skidding yarder (donkey).

Loaders, yarders, sky lines, high leads, highlines, lowlines, haulbacks. A frames, heel booms, MacLean booms, donkeys, skidders, grapples, cherry pickers. Like Cee Bee and Sea Bee; high hoe and excavator pup and pony, out drive and leg; all depends where and when we heard it and or used it.

I won't get into duelling links and look ups because anyone can get back up to anything with that. But...since most of our donkeys were built by you guys and barged up, I'll cede a bonus point for that.

Good discussion, Marin and while I was composing this I noticed Eric has jumped in and, knowing what a stickler he is, I have to go see if he's made a liar our of both of us.
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Old 11-21-2015, 09:30 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by Tad Roberts View Post
Nice writing Hawg,
Just a few more details cause I'm picky about history....

Starting in the 1930's diesel yarders replaced the steam donkey, and there were still lots of those machines busy into the 1970's. By the 80's they had been replaced by steelspars and grapel-yarders, which are in prolific use today. There are still lots of places that aren't a plantation for the feller-buncher to cruise through......
Thanks Tad.
Right on with your comments and good for your pickiness.
I missed the whole helicopter logging and feller-buncher chapters.

It certainly takes more than my slushy brain pan to pull it all together. So much history we have and such a shame it is just falling in the drink.
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Old 11-21-2015, 09:33 PM   #45
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Eric spent a lot of time on POW Island where some of the more interesting shipping methods for today's Alaska logging industry were developed. When moving cordage to Asia packing the lumber and cuts has become quite an art, much of it developed in Thorne Bay.

A favorite pastime of mine for a day or two a year has become spending time in Chemainus where so much of the logging industry for construction purposes was perfected. And still practiced in the surrounding area.


Some trivia - A few years ago I did a bit of work with the Meadow Lake Tribal Council. They have several economically viable and modern commercial lumber operations in Saskatchewan as part of their First Nations corporation. This company is quite impressive and has taken a very forward thinking approach to resource development.
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Old 11-21-2015, 10:15 PM   #46
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I'm lucky on BC's north coast because things have only been logged once and have reseeded naturally (See photo #1 below). This makes for a more natural looking landscape, and not a uniform sized monoculture like a tree planted area or one that's been logged for the third time.

What looks like virgin forest up here to the untrained eye has probably been logged in the past. The easiest way to tell is to look along ridge lines, or far up the slopes, where there are fully mature cedar snags and well spaced trees draped with long ribbons of old mans beard lichen (see photo #2) Walking in the forest reveals massive stumps with notches cut in them for springboards, which were planks fallers used to stand on to get them above the flaring base of the tree...important when falling with hand saws or axes.

Helped my brother on a logging show for a short time several decades ago. Very steep, with a saddle in the middle. My brother was running the tower and I was the chokerman. A choker fell off so the guy I was working with blew stop & slack off the lines on the Talky-Tooter. I scrambled down into the saddle where my brother couldn't see me, reset the choker, and as I was running back to the safe spot the guy I was working with blew the go ahead. A chunk was picked up and thrown at me, hit me square in the lower back, threw me uphill, and I woke up later in a heap under a bunch of logs in a world of pain.

Some time later...the paramedics decided a helicopter was the best bet for getting me off the hillside. You don't know pain until you're strapped to a backboard with a back injury and feeling every vibration of a helicopter. Something like icepicks applied by sledgehammer. I welcomed it, and while biting down on a piece of blanket actually asked for more because the pain meant I wasn't paralyzed.

Apologize for Marin-esque long windedness but all this logging talk sparked some pretty vivid memories.
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Old 11-21-2015, 11:08 PM   #47
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Won't argue with you on your first point, but beg to differ on the last.
By my earlier comments, I meant the Tsimshian and the Lukes get it. Many of us don't.

Also I am skeptical if there are enough Lukes and Tsimshian to turn things around. Oct 19 was a good start for them, I hope it works.

I also hope Marin doesn't mind you and I having our own little pot latch here.
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Old 11-21-2015, 11:18 PM   #48
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Talky-Tooter.
That's hilarious, I had forgotten that one.

What sets my latter parts afire is the nice tall, green curtain they leave in front of a lot of the cuts. Driving or boating by you don't see the moonscape.
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Old 11-21-2015, 11:41 PM   #49
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That's hilarious, I had forgotten that one.

What sets my latter parts afire is the nice tall, green curtain they leave in front of a lot of the cuts. Driving or boating by you don't see the moonscape.
Sad, isn't it? They do that to keep the area from being "visually impaired"

What I do approve of though is the way clear cuts are smaller, are not squares or rectangles anymore, and how when they do green up again it does look somewhat 'natural'.

I worked as a compassman (in the bad old days) for a company that had an annual in office competition to see who could get the largest clear cut approved. Glad those days are gone.
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Old 11-22-2015, 12:16 AM   #50
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Here's a photo of an old logged area in Coghlan Anchorage, near Hartley Bay. You can tell it's been logged because the trees higher on the slope are older, and the trees lower down are packed closer together and 'greener' than the older trees.
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Old 11-22-2015, 06:42 AM   #51
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After reading the above, I will stop and check the both out. The old picture of the cannery w/ the lake above looks like a good hike, although I have to see it now. Thanks for sharing guys.
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Old 11-22-2015, 10:30 PM   #52
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Murray,

The blood running from my mouth is from my biting the tongue.

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Old 11-22-2015, 10:44 PM   #53
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In 1978 I spent four or five days riding in a log truck on the Olympic Penninsula with a driver from Forks who, I found out years later from a co-worker at Boeing who was also from Forks, was considered the best log truck driver on the peninsula. I rode back and forth with him from the side being logged deep in the mountains to the sort yard near Pt. Angeles. He taught me an amazing amount about logging in general and log truck driving in particular, even "teaching" me how to drive his truck to the point where I got to drive in the Forks 4th of July logging show in the log truck "roadeo." (No surprise, I came in dead last.)

One of the things he pointed out was wherever the logging companies clear-cut up to a public road like Highway 101 they always left a dense strip of trees between the road and the logged area. This was done under orders from the state to minimize complaints from tourists about the "wanton stripping of the land" by the lumber industry.
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Old 11-22-2015, 11:22 PM   #54
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On the subject of donkey engines, loaders, skidders, yarders, etc., I've got about 25 feet of bookshelf in my office at home that is end-to-end books on the history of logging and logging railroads. One of my favorite books is a large format volume of photos by Darius Kinsey, one of if not the best photographer of the logging scene in the Pacific Northwest from 1890 to about 1940. He lugged his 8 x 10 view cameras and special tripods designed to elevate the cameras above the undergrowth deep into the woods to record every aspect of PNW logging.

Two of my favorite photos in this book are of crews moving donkey engines under their own power through the woods to new locations. One is steam powered, the other gasoline powered. It was a challenging way of life to say the least.
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Old 11-22-2015, 11:30 PM   #55
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Murray,

The blood running from my mouth is from my biting the tongue.

Al-Ketchikan
It would be a shame to have this thread end up in the deep end, eh?
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Old 11-22-2015, 11:43 PM   #56
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Like Cee Bee and Sea Bee....all depends where and when we heard it and or used it.

No, it depends on what's right. This Republic Aviation ad for their Seabee amphibious airplane should end the confusion over that particular issue.
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Old 11-22-2015, 11:52 PM   #57
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Quote:
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Lou Simoneau (not sure I have that spelling correct) was the caretaker for many years.
Hi Sam...Profile: Lou Simoneau - Waggoner Cruising Guide
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Old 11-23-2015, 12:02 AM   #58
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It would be a shame to have this thread end up in the deep end, eh?
Here then...
https://quoddysrun.wordpress.com/201...edale-cannery/
And two for you...
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Old 11-23-2015, 04:42 AM   #59
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Well played Hawgwash, well played!!

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Old 11-16-2016, 04:53 PM   #60
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Just like Retriever above, I spoke with the current owner of Butedale a couple months ago, 8/16. We were tied up at Shearwater on the way down from AK and the subject of Butedale came up in conversation, him saying that he owned it. I don't recall his name but he was in a 32' Blackfin, sort of a Bertram Moppie design. Anyway, it sounds like big plans are in the works to revive the place. I've often thought about tying up at Butedale but I've seen pictures of the docks.....not good, dangerous-looking actually. Cruise ships, ferries and other heavy traffic go by there with no protection for the docks, so it must be rolly as hell in there. Pity since there are few places to overnight in that part of Princess Royal Channel. We usually anchor close-by in Khutze inlet, which isn't the greatest either.
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