Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 04-09-2013, 08:55 PM   #21
Senior Member
 
ocean's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 105
SRy I meant half of SC
__________________
Advertisement

ocean is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2013, 06:45 AM   #22
Ben
Guru
 
Ben's Avatar
 
City: Wilmington, NC
Country: US
Vessel Name: Sand Castle
Vessel Model: 1986 MT Sundeck 35.5
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 693
Quote:
Originally Posted by psneeld View Post
Daddyo may have some more accurate info...but usually the coastal currents aren't very strong (negligible) except for the Gulf Stream and unless you are willing to run pretty far offshore
So... By that logic, you could run offshore in a southerly direction inside the stream without a counter current. That's encouraging. Assuming decent weather, of course. I've been to the stream in fishing charters, not so sure I'd want to in my single screw trawler... The "what if" is a bit of a concern unless boat, engine, and fuel were perfect, which mine is not yet.

Been following Daddyo's trip with considerable interest lately. He's been very kind and helpful with the photos and accounts.
__________________

__________________
..................................
Ben

MV Sand Castle
Wilmington, NC
Ben is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2013, 08:04 AM   #23
Guru
 
Tom.B's Avatar
 
City: Cary, NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Skinny Dippin'
Vessel Model: Navigator 4200 Classic
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,152
I think there is some perspective we need to understand, Ben. I don't know that our little 35' 80's trawlers are meant for outside journeys like these. It's one thing for guys with 48' Defevers or 53' Hatteras and even small sailboats (not picking on you guys specifically) to say what an easy hop it is from Jacksonville to Savanna or Charleston, however, at six knots, a journey like that will take days in our boats. I am not saying that, given the right conditions, we couldn't make the trip, but in my opinion, it's a big risk. Our boats are not fast enough or stable enough to survive out there if something (like the weather) turns on us suddenly.

Perhaps I am being TOO cautious. Perhaps I am underestimating what sea conditions our boats can handle, but the endless hours staring at a horizontal line between the sky and water doesn't sound like much fun to me. It sounds boring.

I guess this is the voice of inexperienced paranoia talking. I want to see everything the ICW has to offer and I want to soak it all in.

Tom-
__________________
2000 Navigator 4200 Classic
(NOT a trawler)
Tom.B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2013, 08:41 AM   #24
Ben
Guru
 
Ben's Avatar
 
City: Wilmington, NC
Country: US
Vessel Name: Sand Castle
Vessel Model: 1986 MT Sundeck 35.5
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 693
Tom -

I'm not talking about 80 miles offshore to the Gulf stream. More like 3 miles to avoid shallow spots and switchbacks in bad ICW conditions.

Our PO regularly took our boat deep into the Bahamas and spent summers in Martha's Vineyard. The very same boat pictured above. Truly, there are safe times and good reasons to go offshore in prudent ways.

The Pamlico Sound is good prep for offshore - even more so because you lose sight of land for a short period.

Cheers
__________________
..................................
Ben

MV Sand Castle
Wilmington, NC
Ben is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2013, 09:39 AM   #25
Guru
 
Moonstruck's Avatar
 
City: Hailing Port: Charleston, SC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Moonstruck
Vessel Model: Sabre 42 Hardtop Express
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 7,848
Going offshore in a coastal cruiser is a little like going up in an airplane. You will eventually have to land it. It this case it will be negotiating an inlet. While conditions offshore may be tolerable, the conditions in an inlet may be intolerable. Just be sure that you know how to handle the boat and time the tides for the inlet. East coast inlets can be very bad. Negotiating a breaking inlet with a slow boat has a huge pucker factor.
__________________
Don on Moonstruck
Sabre 42 Hardtop Express & Blackfin 25 CC
When cruising life is simpler, but on a grander scale (author unknown)
http://moonstruckblog.wordpress.com/
Moonstruck is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2013, 10:00 AM   #26
Guru
 
Tom.B's Avatar
 
City: Cary, NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Skinny Dippin'
Vessel Model: Navigator 4200 Classic
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonstruck View Post
While conditions offshore may be tolerable, the conditions in an inlet may be intolerable.
This is exactly why I haven't tried it yet. Whenever I have thought I wanted to plan a jump from Beaufort to Masonboro to see if we could do it, I would leave one end at slack or flood, but then estimate having ebbing or the wrong wind at the other.

Be aware, too, Ben, that while the boat might handle it, the conversation you, me, and your wife had this weekend proves that her tolerance is equally as limited as Bess'. Is any outside passage worth it if you spend hours in fear for your life or just uncomfortably tired of trying to stay standing in rough seas? Moreover, if you find yourself waiting out weather for several days, what time have you saved?

To me, outside passages are for big(er) and more capable boats than mine. Do I *want* to be able to? Yes. Am I heartbroken that I live in too much fear to do it? Also, yes. But do I care? Not even a little. There is lots of time to increase our seamanship in rough seas. With just four years behind us, we are still stone-cold n00bz at this.
__________________
2000 Navigator 4200 Classic
(NOT a trawler)
Tom.B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2013, 10:43 AM   #27
Guru
 
Codger2's Avatar
 
City: San Diego
Country: US
Vessel Name: "Sandpiper"
Vessel Model: 2006 42' Ocean Alexander Sedan
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 5,420
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom.B View Post
I don't know that our little 35' 80's trawlers are meant for outside journeys like these.....They're not!

however, at six knots, a journey like that will take days in our boats....

Our boats are not fast enough or stable enough to survive out there if something (like the weather) turns on us suddenly....You are correct!

Perhaps I am being TOO cautious. (You're not!) Perhaps I am underestimating what sea conditions our boats can handle, (Again, you are not!) but the endless hours staring at a horizontal line between the sky and water doesn't sound like much fun to me. It sounds boring. (It is!)
This post is indicative of a skipper who is aware of what SA is. (Situation Awareness) You are not afraid to take on outside open water cruises. You're SA has kicked in and you are very aware what the trip could result in. Most skippers know all the things that could happen but few have the "guts" to admit that neither their equipment (nor themselves) are up to what might happen. I'll take Don Moon (Moonstruck) as an example. I'll bet that few sailors on this forum have his open water experience. Is Don not cognizant of what could happen on one of his crossings and blindly casts off on another roll of the dice? His SA is very acute and his equipment and experience are an excellent match as to what he might encounter. His boat is a quality built 42 footer and fast! He pays attention to the best source of weather info he can find and last but not least, he knows when to stay inside or at anchor! Don's SA and what's needed to mitigate it are excellent and my hat's off to him.
__________________
Codger2

My passion for improving my boat(s) exceeds my desire to constantly cruise them.
Codger2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2013, 11:01 AM   #28
Guru
 
City: somewhere
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,356
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonstruck View Post
Going offshore in a coastal cruiser is a little like going up in an airplane. You will eventually have to land it. It this case it will be negotiating an inlet. While conditions offshore may be tolerable, the conditions in an inlet may be intolerable. Just be sure that you know how to handle the boat and time the tides for the inlet. East coast inlets can be very bad. Negotiating a breaking inlet with a slow boat has a huge pucker factor.
The speed of the boat is one of the main reasons we now have a flybridge under contract with twin fuely 7.4 versus a small diesel trawler.

The idea of being caught offshore in a squall or while crossing the Gulf Stream here in Florida is not on my favored list.

We decided to forgo fuel economy for peace of mind and safety.
__________________
Life is a Beach
beachbum29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2013, 11:28 AM   #29
Ben
Guru
 
Ben's Avatar
 
City: Wilmington, NC
Country: US
Vessel Name: Sand Castle
Vessel Model: 1986 MT Sundeck 35.5
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 693
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom.B View Post
Be aware, too, Ben, that while the boat might handle it, the conversation you, me, and your wife had this weekend proves that her tolerance is equally as limited as Bess'. Is any outside passage worth it if you spend hours in fear for your life or just uncomfortably tired of trying to stay standing in rough seas?
Tom -
1. Your argument assumes that I am actively seeking hazards. This is not the case whatsoever. In any way. At all.
2. Deb was relating a single event where we had a rough weather day. You're using a private conversation to leverage a public argument. C'mon, Man.
3. We go out of Beaufort inlet continuously during the summer to make Cape Lookout as well as the Pamlico crossing to Ocracoke. When it's rough, we don't go.
4. There are inlets I would never go in my power configuration or serious weather. At all. Period. But I've been through a few that are well engineered in decent weather and manageable currents, even when they've gone against me. 3.5 knots not ideal, but not fatal either.

As a Steelers fan, you should appreciate the words of the great(?) Terry Bradshaw. "I may be dumb, but I'm not stupid!"

Common sense always prevails.
__________________
..................................
Ben

MV Sand Castle
Wilmington, NC
Ben is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2013, 11:14 PM   #30
Guru
 
motion30's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 740
In my 34 marine trader I could run from Ft lauderdale to the very top of the chesapeake in 180hr running time 15 to 18 days singlehanded sun up to sun down anchoring every night I find when I stay in marinas I am slower to get under way My best day in 4 trips was 120 miles
motion30 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 06:16 AM   #31
FF
Guru
 
FF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 16,515
"The idea of being caught offshore in a squall or while crossing the Gulf Stream here in Florida is not on my favored list."

Trawlers run at 6-7K , most powerboats with gassers wont top 25 mph(20K)

Squalls move at 25K to 40K, outrun how?
FF is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 07:22 AM   #32
Guru
 
City: somewhere
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,356
Quote:
Originally Posted by FF View Post
"The idea of being caught offshore in a squall or while crossing the Gulf Stream here in Florida is not on my favored list."

Trawlers run at 6-7K , most powerboats with gassers wont top 25 mph(20K)

Squalls move at 25K to 40K, outrun how?
Most squalls are very small in diameter, so a lateral move, if caught early enough, can be successful.
__________________
Life is a Beach
beachbum29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 08:46 AM   #33
Ben
Guru
 
Ben's Avatar
 
City: Wilmington, NC
Country: US
Vessel Name: Sand Castle
Vessel Model: 1986 MT Sundeck 35.5
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 693
Quote:
Originally Posted by beachbum29 View Post

Most squalls are very small in diameter, so a lateral move, if caught early enough, can be successful.
True, true. I have dodged squalls crossing NC's Pamlico Sound with weather animation charts and course plotting. Even when they hit, they are short-lived. Oriental to Ocracoke is a 50-mile run, similar to the Florida passage, but with vastly different depths and current conditions.

I run about 7 knots. 8 with a tail wind
__________________
..................................
Ben

MV Sand Castle
Wilmington, NC
Ben is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 08:50 AM   #34
Ben
Guru
 
Ben's Avatar
 
City: Wilmington, NC
Country: US
Vessel Name: Sand Castle
Vessel Model: 1986 MT Sundeck 35.5
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 693
Quote:
Originally Posted by FF View Post
Trawlers run at 6-7K , most powerboats with gassers wont top 25 mph(20K)

Squalls move at 25K to 40K, outrun how?
Perpendicular course, targeting the least of the effects.

You'll get wet and blown, just how much is what you can influence.

:-|
__________________
..................................
Ben

MV Sand Castle
Wilmington, NC
Ben is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 01:41 PM   #35
Guru
 
City: somewhere
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,356
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben View Post

True, true. I have dodged squalls crossing NC's Pamlico Sound with weather animation charts and course plotting. Even when they hit, they are short-lived. Oriental to Ocracoke is a 50-mile run, similar to the Florida passage, but with vastly different depths and current conditions.

I run about 7 knots. 8 with a tail wind
This cruiser I have under contract is supposed to top out at 37-39 knots.
__________________
Life is a Beach
beachbum29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 03:58 PM   #36
Ben
Guru
 
Ben's Avatar
 
City: Wilmington, NC
Country: US
Vessel Name: Sand Castle
Vessel Model: 1986 MT Sundeck 35.5
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 693
Quote:
Originally Posted by beachbum29 View Post

This cruiser I have under contract is supposed to top out at 37-39 knots.
Fountain? Wellcraft? That sounds like a slow Fountain or fast Hatteras. Larson made a stepped hull that would go pretty fast.

Now I'm curious.
__________________
..................................
Ben

MV Sand Castle
Wilmington, NC
Ben is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 05:25 PM   #37
Guru
 
City: somewhere
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,356
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben View Post

Fountain? Wellcraft? That sounds like a slow Fountain or fast Hatteras. Larson made a stepped hull that would go pretty fast.

Now I'm curious.
Cruisers 3580 flybridge

The one pictured in my avatar
__________________
Life is a Beach
beachbum29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 05:50 PM   #38
Ben
Guru
 
Ben's Avatar
 
City: Wilmington, NC
Country: US
Vessel Name: Sand Castle
Vessel Model: 1986 MT Sundeck 35.5
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 693
Quote:
Originally Posted by beachbum29 View Post

Cruisers 3580 flybridge

The one pictured in my avatar
Nice. Well done. No worries getting from A to B in that baby.
__________________
..................................
Ben

MV Sand Castle
Wilmington, NC
Ben is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 05:58 PM   #39
Guru
 
City: somewhere
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,356
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben View Post

Nice. Well done. No worries getting from A to B in that baby.
Survey is Monday
__________________
Life is a Beach
beachbum29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2013, 06:05 AM   #40
FF
Guru
 
FF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 16,515
No worries getting from A to B in that baby.

Till the 4 ft chop.
__________________

FF is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:40 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012