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Old 09-15-2018, 10:48 PM   #1
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Davis 42 Light Refit / Rehab

Here is the refit thread I promised after announcing we are trawler owners. To recap, the boat is a 1980 Davis Vashon 42 trawler that is a Defever design or copy. It was built by the Sei Yen Enterprise yard in the east of Taipei (I think) near Keelung. The boat is 42 x 14 with 4'3" draft and displaces approximately 30,000 lbs. it is documented and has been for most or all of its life. I believe we are the fourth owners. The first was the owner of Crow Roofing in Seattle - the only record I have of his ownership is his name on the engine warranty cards I have. I have surveys, receipts, and other documentation from the other two owners. The boat has had a lot of professional yard and marine service work over the years. Many systems have been upgraded, some have not. The engines, transmissions, and genset are from when the boat was built. Some systems, like most of the domestic water lines, are original (copper!) Others, like the heads, have been replaced with newer (they are freshwater electric flush going into the factory fiberglass tank that is integral with the hull and stringers aft of the engine room.

Our price range / financial means and my skills put us in a position of buying a well used boat with some necessary projects. We set aside a full third of our available funds for repair, refit and upgrades and then factored in what those costs might be for each boat we looked at to find one that made sense.

(My spreadsheet to track all of the myriad details went from column A to AT, and was basically a color coded checklist of features, price, design, maintenance needs, hidden risks, and what upgrades the boat would need to match our desires.)

So we bought the boat, knowing the following repairs and maintenance would be needed - since we'd set aside the cash for it they are happening now and quick. We want to turn the boat around and begin enjoying it next cruising season (or even this winter!)

Initial Major/Priority projects for boat preservation/usability

1 - Exhaust elbows - non-standard, causing likely salt water drip back to end of exhaust manifold.

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2 - Batteries - House batteries, while high quality, are at end of life

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3 - Windows - show signs of past leak activity. Appears PO had put some sealant on exterior without disassembling and truly rebedding.

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4 - Aft house deck - shows signs of weakening. Surveyor was not too concerned except for one area with some high moisture, but deck is misshapen and has some flex to it when a bulky individual (me) steps or bounces on it too heavily. We bought boat anticipating a complete aft house deck recore job. As we anticipate having the tender on the aft deck while in the marina (we are right at the tipping point from one dock size to another, and long term keeping it on the aft house top will keep our costs down.)

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5 - Teak trim around base of house at deck coming loose in spots, needs to be removed, rebedded, refinished.

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There are a myriad of smaller projects, but these are some of the first big ones to tackle. Our work list between survey findings and our own findings and upgrades is about 175 items.

The above are our initial major projects.

Battery Bank
The house batteries were very nice Northstar batteries, but at 10 years old and always running a decently large fridge/freezer they could not keep up with the boat aH requirements. The house bank consisted of two of these batteries. My computations of the boat's equipment and our own needs put our minimum USABLE bank at 200-210 aH per day, which with good AGM batteries would require at least 300-350 aH for some longer life, and with lead-acid at lest 500 aH. Cost wise I just couldn't do $1,800 to do AGMs and instead have gone with paired GC-2 lead acid. My 630 aH bank will end up costing about $650 with tax, plus another few hundred for cabling and tools to make said cabling (our 2,000 amp Magnum inverter/charger has us at 2/0 cable for the house.) My projected use of the bank has us using approximately 1/3 per day, which with proper water topping off should give us good life. The bank is in battery boxes in between the engine stringers and under false floor panels for (relatively) easy access. I made sure all the cables for pairing and paralleling the pairs are out of the way of refilling water. This project is 75% complete. I still need to buy and install two more batteries. I already have the cables made, and have to do the install. My apologies for not having photos of this, but we went ahead with the bank install our third day on the boat as the old batteries couldn't make it through the night with our fridge and my CPAP!

Next post with photos, will be about the engine exhaust elbows...
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Old 09-16-2018, 12:00 AM   #2
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Exhaust Elbow Subproject

Since we signed the acceptance paperwork I've been working on plans to revise the exhaust. I didn't like the looks of it, neither did the surveyor. Interestingly enough, the mechanic liked the design, which makes me wonder if he or his company originally installed it! He was critical enough of anything else he found at issue on the engines, so I SOMEHWHAT trust him...

Here's a photo of the whole setup as it looks on the port engine. Its a massive piece of iron. Yes, I know the hanger is broken - its coming off anyway and we'll install whatever is needed after the new stuff is added.

Attachment 80950

My research on Lehman (and any) exhaust system is you don't want saltwater making it back into the exhaust manifold. My first view of the boat showed that appears to be in fact happening, as there is substantial corrosion around the the adapter that allows the non-standard exhaust to bolt to the Lehman exhaust manifold, and even what looked like dried up salt.

In this closeup of the stbd engine you can see all the corrosion, the adapter, and there is even rust drips down from the mating surface of the manifold and adapter onto the heat exchanger.

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My initial thoughts were to (obviously) put the correct exhaust mixing elbows that were designed for the engine, and then redesign (as needed) the rest of the exhaust system from there. The rest of the exhaust as I found it is 3.5" hose straight back down the sides and out the transom, to include 1 1/2 - 2' extensions past the transom, likely to keep soot off the dinghy. Nothing to prevent any siphon. The boat is a little loud, as you would expect from unmuffled straight pipes.

I have seen and heard some Lehman powered boats that have water-lift mufflers and noted they do moderate the sound somewhat. I decided to add these to the boat, and have chosen Vetus NLP (HD) 90 waterlock. The HD versions are made out of a special material and have a maximum sustained temperature rating of 482F. The model 90 is sized to accept my 3.5" exhaust hose and rated for up to 120 HP. Just to be sure we aren't going to fry anything, I also ordered an engine alarm kit that watches engine temp, raw water flow, oil pressure as well as bilge water level and has a fire sensor. (I chose the one with raw water flow rather than exhaust gas temp as I figured a loss of flow would indicate trouble a few seconds quicker. I hope that is a valid thought.) I'll put the raw water flow right before the mixing elbow injection point, to try to capture flow up to the last possible measuring point.

After the boat was in a dry storage yard (we are there until a spot opens at our chosen marina, probably late this year) I carefully measured our exhaust relative to the boat waterline. As it turns out the bottom of the exhaust is only about 3 inches above the WL, less than what is safe. SO I added an anti-siphon loop in the design to go right at the elbow.

We've started taking the exhaust apart, and found that it is a swivel design with an o-ring seal in the middle. Additionally it looks like the cooling water passages are compromised and its probably time for new anyway. I don't know how you would get all the passages clear on that massive piece of iron anyway.

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When I checked the part numbers, I found the entire assembly is a Barr creation for a gas Chrysler V-8. AND found that they are designed for a smaller exhaust hose, so there is a short piece of another hose inside the 3.5" hose acting as another adapter!

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Needless to say, we are prepping for putting it all together and hope for a long lasting decent solution to the problem. (I found where Bob Smith from American Diesel recommended regal red for these engines, and since I painted my workbenches that color in 2001, I thought that's what I'll do! Here is 5 or 6 coats, Josh lost count!

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More of the parts will be arriving Monday, and over the next week or two we'll work on dry fitting everything. We'll have to build a platform to sit immediately out from the outboard engine stringer to mount the waterlock on, epoxy that into place and paint it. We won't do the final install until we have some fuel tank work done (install clean outs, clean, polish fuel) so we can have better access to the aft end of the tanks.) As we proceed I'll update you all on how it goes.

A question I have is do similar build trawlers put goosenecks at the stern to keep water from coming up the exhaust pipes? In reading and researching, I see they are a common recommendation on a proper exhaust system, mainly to keep (I believe) seawater from coming in the back way. Do any of you have these?
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Old 09-16-2018, 12:59 AM   #3
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Good move restoring the exhaust angle to OEM. You probably discovered they come in 2 diameter sizes.
No preventers on our exhausts, no issues in 8 years. Our mufflers are fiberglass replacements locally made (by Foreshore Marine in South Sydney, for Aussie locals). Of interest, a marina neighbour has right angle exhaust extensions at the waterline, so that water hitting the stern hits pipe not open exhaust. That boat is used for game fishing and would be regularly backing down while hooking up.
Don`t stress about the Lehmans too much, they are rugged beasts.
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Old 09-16-2018, 05:20 AM   #4
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Typically you would put the muffler discharge line as far up as available space allows then slope it downward towards the overboard discharge. Photo is from a Great Harbour N37. Also, if you go with this type installation you will need to add a vented loop since the raw-water will now be dumping into the exhaust below the waterline. That element is also visible in the photo on the bulkhead.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fractalphreak View Post
Since we signed the acceptance paperwork I've been working on plans to revise the exhaust. I didn't like the looks of it, neither did the surveyor. Interestingly enough, the mechanic liked the design, which makes me wonder if he or his company originally installed it! He was critical enough of anything else he found at issue on the engines, so I SOMEHWHAT trust him...

Here's a photo of the whole setup as it looks on the port engine. Its a massive piece of iron. Yes, I know the hanger is broken - its coming off anyway and we'll install whatever is needed after the new stuff is added.

Attachment 80950

My research on Lehman (and any) exhaust system is you don't want saltwater making it back into the exhaust manifold. My first view of the boat showed that appears to be in fact happening, as there is substantial corrosion around the the adapter that allows the non-standard exhaust to bolt to the Lehman exhaust manifold, and even what looked like dried up salt.

In this closeup of the stbd engine you can see all the corrosion, the adapter, and there is even rust drips down from the mating surface of the manifold and adapter onto the heat exchanger.

Attachment 80944

My initial thoughts were to (obviously) put the correct exhaust mixing elbows that were designed for the engine, and then redesign (as needed) the rest of the exhaust system from there. The rest of the exhaust as I found it is 3.5" hose straight back down the sides and out the transom, to include 1 1/2 - 2' extensions past the transom, likely to keep soot off the dinghy. Nothing to prevent any siphon. The boat is a little loud, as you would expect from unmuffled straight pipes.

I have seen and heard some Lehman powered boats that have water-lift mufflers and noted they do moderate the sound somewhat. I decided to add these to the boat, and have chosen Vetus NLP (HD) 90 waterlock. The HD versions are made out of a special material and have a maximum sustained temperature rating of 482F. The model 90 is sized to accept my 3.5" exhaust hose and rated for up to 120 HP. Just to be sure we aren't going to fry anything, I also ordered an engine alarm kit that watches engine temp, raw water flow, oil pressure as well as bilge water level and has a fire sensor. (I chose the one with raw water flow rather than exhaust gas temp as I figured a loss of flow would indicate trouble a few seconds quicker. I hope that is a valid thought.) I'll put the raw water flow right before the mixing elbow injection point, to try to capture flow up to the last possible measuring point.

After the boat was in a dry storage yard (we are there until a spot opens at our chosen marina, probably late this year) I carefully measured our exhaust relative to the boat waterline. As it turns out the bottom of the exhaust is only about 3 inches above the WL, less than what is safe. SO I added an anti-siphon loop in the design to go right at the elbow.

We've started taking the exhaust apart, and found that it is a swivel design with an o-ring seal in the middle. Additionally it looks like the cooling water passages are compromised and its probably time for new anyway. I don't know how you would get all the passages clear on that massive piece of iron anyway.

Attachment 80945

When I checked the part numbers, I found the entire assembly is a Barr creation for a gas Chrysler V-8. AND found that they are designed for a smaller exhaust hose, so there is a short piece of another hose inside the 3.5" hose acting as another adapter!

Attachment 80946

Needless to say, we are prepping for putting it all together and hope for a long lasting decent solution to the problem. (I found where Bob Smith from American Diesel recommended regal red for these engines, and since I painted my workbenches that color in 2001, I thought that's what I'll do! Here is 5 or 6 coats, Josh lost count!

Attachment 80947

More of the parts will be arriving Monday, and over the next week or two we'll work on dry fitting everything. We'll have to build a platform to sit immediately out from the outboard engine stringer to mount the waterlock on, epoxy that into place and paint it. We won't do the final install until we have some fuel tank work done (install clean outs, clean, polish fuel) so we can have better access to the aft end of the tanks.) As we proceed I'll update you all on how it goes.

A question I have is do similar build trawlers put goosenecks at the stern to keep water from coming up the exhaust pipes? In reading and researching, I see they are a common recommendation on a proper exhaust system, mainly to keep (I believe) seawater from coming in the back way. Do any of you have these?
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Old 09-16-2018, 08:21 AM   #5
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If the exhaust run is long enough and high enough, no gooseneck is needed. If anything, the high spot should be at the waterlift muffler and have a long, downhill run out the transom.
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Old 09-16-2018, 10:41 AM   #6
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From your picture (#1 in post #1) it looks like the water attachment is to a proper elbow that is mounted upside down, so there is no opportunity for the water to simply run down the exhaust pipe, should there be any leakage while there is no exhaust pressure driving it into the pipe. If this location is less than 12" above the WL, you should think about putting a vertical riser on before the mixing elbow. That would give you a downhill run after the mixing elbow, to the water lift muffler, which will then have another downhill run to the exit.
Your avatar picture shows a design similar to my own, so I expect about the same elevations in the ER and at the locations of the exhaust elbow and muffler. Mine tilts downwards from the engine attachment (no need for any vertical riser) and the muffler sits at the height of the stringers to which the engine mounts are attached.
In mine, the WL is only a few inches above those stringers, so I get about 24" above the WL to the top of available space in the ER. The injection point is at least 14" above WL. If you have any thru hull fittings that you can see on the outside, that will give you an accurate measure of the WL for inside registration.

I am presently replacing the sliding window in my aft head, as I leaned against the glass with my knee this summer and cracked the glass.
I had a cracked front window that I replaced in June, so I am familiar with the way those were built. I have done a few of the sliders already, but that was many years ago and I couldn't quite recall the difference from the construction of the fixed windows. Many Taiwan Trawlers have had problems with leaks from the sliding windows, so your complaint is not unusual. The method of construction is to blame. In mine, the frame around the upper 3 sides is bullet proof. On the fixed windows that is true of all 4 sides, as they are the same. On the sliders, not so much. The sill is designed to fail. The sill is made of a 1/4" x 1 1/2" strip of teak laid on top of the plywood that lines the inside of the Deckhouse Fibreglass wall. A little 5200 sealant may have been under the track originally, but after many years there is little trace. No drain holes were drilled in the track to allow rainwater to exit to the outside. There are rain channels in the teak moulding that frames the window on the outside, but those may have been added by a PO, as the saw marks are still visible. In my other repairs of slider leaks, I have made a fully water tight sill, using a thick bed of 5200, which has stood the test of up to 20 years. This time I may try a piece of "Blueskin" window installation membrane under the track.
Below the leak, naturally, the plywood has been wet for years, so whether rot has set in or not, I will be replacing some of it. Trouble is that it is bonded to the outer FG, so the wet part will have to be ground off, then a mix of epoxy and thickener troweled back on to fill. Then a new interior finish will have to be attached. In my head, that is white Formica, so will look the same as before.

Good luck with your projects. Keep the pictures coming.
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Old 09-16-2018, 11:18 AM   #7
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sounds like you have a solid plan for your boat. you might want to check Seaboard Marine-sbmar.com. tony has some very good info on diesel exhaust systems with many repowers under his belt. good luck


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Old 09-16-2018, 11:35 AM   #8
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As madoc1 mentioned read Tony at Seaboard Marine articles on marine exhaust design, you will learn a lot. Then call these guys, they're local and know what they're doing.
National Marine Exhaust, Inc.
3710-B 136th Street NE
Marysville, WA 98271
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Old 09-17-2018, 10:59 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by psneeld View Post
If the exhaust run is long enough and high enough, no gooseneck is needed. If anything, the high spot should be at the waterlift muffler and have a long, downhill run out the transom.
(and bglad) you both make a great point. I'm looking at how high I can get that pipe before it heads aft. I haven't measured it, but I'm guessing the exhaust from from the aft engine room bulkhead is 14 feet or so.

I have to climb in there and measure the height, but it looks like I should be able to get 10-12 inches higher than the run. In this pic you can see my space constraints. I need to get in there and figure all of the geometry, but for perspective the waterlock will be just out of the shot below the pile of absorbent pads, and most likely 1/2 way between the aft fuel tank wall and aft engine room bulkhead. (For perspective this pic is at the after end of the starboard engine, looking to the starboard hull at the chine. The through hull with the clear tube you see is about 7 1/2 inches above the waterline. I haven't transferred the mark inside yet but will be doing that this weekend when I'm back out at the boat.)

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Old 09-17-2018, 11:21 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sean9c View Post
As madoc1 mentioned read Tony at Seaboard Marine articles on marine exhaust design, you will learn a lot. Then call these guys, they're local and know what they're doing.
National Marine Exhaust, Inc.
3710-B 136th Street NE
Marysville, WA 98271
Thank you both. I've read what Tony has on exhaust design. I must admit I do have some problem accepting uncooled (but shielded) exhaust pipes under my wood salon floor. I'm going to spent some quality time with some straight edges, tape measures and the like to document all the geometry and see how it all lines up with what Tony recommends and stop by National.
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Old 09-17-2018, 11:51 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by koliver View Post
From your picture (#1 in post #1) it looks like the water attachment is to a proper elbow that is mounted upside down, so there is no opportunity for the water to simply run down the exhaust pipe, should there be any leakage while there is no exhaust pressure driving it into the pipe. If this location is less than 12" above the WL, you should think about putting a vertical riser on before the mixing elbow. That would give you a downhill run after the mixing elbow, to the water lift muffler, which will then have another downhill run to the exit.
Your avatar picture shows a design similar to my own, so I expect about the same elevations in the ER and at the locations of the exhaust elbow and muffler. Mine tilts downwards from the engine attachment (no need for any vertical riser) and the muffler sits at the height of the stringers to which the engine mounts are attached.
In mine, the WL is only a few inches above those stringers, so I get about 24" above the WL to the top of available space in the ER. The injection point is at least 14" above WL. If you have any thru hull fittings that you can see on the outside, that will give you an accurate measure of the WL for inside registration.
.

I'm pretty sure these elbows >have< failed in some way - the corrosion and drips from what should be a dry area of the exhaust manifold say so. We got distracted with some other punch list items this weekend (our insurance company concerned about resolving some "safety" items that were lower on my priority list than theirs...turns out we found several other projects along the way!) so I didn't get the elbows pulled yet. Hopefully this weekend...


Also this coming weekend I'll spend some quality time with a straightedge, level, and tape. But I'm pretty sure my "factory" injection point is less than 6 inches over the waterline. In this pic, I eyeballed what was level across the top of the aft end of the exhaust manifold, and it lines up pretty close to the bottom of the aft head sink drain through hull...

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...which is about 7 1/2 inches vertical above the waterline..... That through hull is on the right in this pic, in the white area of the hull. This pic is looking at the starboard side just under the aft salon window. The bull bootstripe extends above the waterline. The aforementioned white through hull is the aft head sink drain, which is aft (left) of this group of through hulls. The large one furthest aft in this pic is the galley sink drain, which is 3-4 ft forward (right). Go figure.


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Old 09-18-2018, 05:33 AM   #12
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You mention your space restraints. Might you consider a dry riser with proper lagging at the exhaust manifold then an inline muffler somewhere aft where there may be more space? Would avoid cramming your engine room with more things where space is at such a premium.
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Old 09-18-2018, 07:46 PM   #13
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in your first pic, shouldn't the water be injected in the top of of the upper elbow? it looks like there is is a tap for it there. a pic of the side of that would be helpful. i.e. rotated 90 degrees.


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Old 09-18-2018, 11:58 PM   #14
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Worked on a side project tonight - during the week I don't have enough time to get out to the boat and get anything done.

The bridge shifter was way too stiff and needed some work, almost needing two hands for one side. Before we left the boat this past weekend Josh took off that shifter. We also took apart the lower helm shifter to try to make sure what was causing the stiffness. He could move the two upper helm shift control cables by hand, although one is a tad stiffer than the other. But both shifters were sticky, and the lower helm shifter actually felt like it was grinding a little. We brought them home to work on this week.

Here is the upper helm shifter. I believe I've identified it as a Morse Type S Dual Control. I was able to find the installation manual with exploded parts diagram on the internet at SeaStarSolutions.com.

Here is the FB shifter after disassembly:

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It was a little cruddy inside (gummed up lubricant) and a little crusty on the outside (light corrosion.) I initially thought Brasso would do it, but the corrosion was a little more than it could handle. I switched to a 3" buffing wheel on my little 90 deg air grinder and some white rouge. It shinned up okay. Here it is still disassembled:

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And put back together:

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We'll make sure to take good care of the surface; I wasn't able to get all of the pitting out of the surface - there's still a little there, and it started to look like I was wearing through the chrome near one of the large bore holes for the shafts. We'll monitor it, but eventually it will probably be a rechrome. I'm sure I'll come up with a thing or two to go along with it!

Also got the lower helm shifter disassembled. Close inspection shows the shift detent plates are worn - both have a rough groove in them. They aren't reversible, it looks like there is a light stamp on the back at the top of the curve to get them to match the shape of the shifter.

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With the manual I found, I had the part number for the shift detent kits, and they are still available. (It looks like SeaStar still sells the same control. I'd half expected it to be obsolete.) I have two detent kits on the way that will be here this weekend. Tomorrow I'll get the lower helm shifter put back together and next time we're at the boat I hope to see that we've taken enough friction out of the system that the FB shifter will work like it should.


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Old 09-19-2018, 12:10 AM   #15
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A lot of the time when a shifter or throttle is stiff it is due to the cable. Sometimes you can lube the cable and sometimes they need to be replaced.
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Old 09-19-2018, 12:21 AM   #16
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City: La Conner, WA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madoc1 View Post
in your first pic, shouldn't the water be injected in the top of of the upper elbow? it looks like there is is a tap for it there. a pic of the side of that would be helpful. i.e. rotated 90 degrees.


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That very well could be. If I were looking at this setup knowing what I know now, I would think it should go there. Better yet there should be an injection port on the downhill side of that upper elbow, but there isn't one there.

Here's a pic of the one we have taken off. The lower left portion of the photo shows the portion of this upper elbow that connected to the lower elbow on the exhaust manifold. (The portion in this photo off to the right is where the exhaust hose attached.)

There are three ports, one on the top and two on the side. I'm assuming they are injection ports, but I'm not sure about the two on the side, they must be somehow connected to the water passages. With the scaling and corrosion in these particular pieces they aren't going back on, and I'm still not keen on trying to replace them and make them work. The simple fact an adapter (that I have yet to find a replacement available) is needed to switch from Ford to Chrysler is a red flag for me...I can find the swivel and lower elbow from a number of sources, total cost is about $350 or so per engine. But the swivel goes together with an o-ring seal, and I don't know that I want to experiment with trying a new set with the raw water plumbed to the upper injection point, and that o-ring joint not getting cooled...

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Old 09-19-2018, 11:26 PM   #17
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Now I'm second guessing myself. I started looking through engine room photos of all the boats we've looked at (or looked online at) and found this, which looks like my same setup but using that top injection port. This is on a 40 ft PT Trawler for sale in La Conner.

Has anyone else ever seen these swivel exhaust elbows on FL engines?

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