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Old 11-17-2015, 08:48 PM   #61
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Am familiar with the anticipation! And the imagined horrors of the long-distance transport.

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Old 11-18-2015, 11:13 AM   #62
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John;
I am enjoying reading your posts that share your thoughts and decision making for your new boat. Oddly enough much of what you share is exactly what I went through in making my choice to purchase my Helmsman 38, "Knot2Fast". Since my boat is moored at Waterline Boats I'm sure you have had a chance to be on her several times and of course are welcome to look at her whenever you are in Seattle.
I can tell you that I fell in love with the boat several years ago but am also someone who does a fair amount of research ahead of a purchase and since I was skipping 2footitis and going directly from a 24' SeaSport to a 38PH you can imagine I had a fair amount of trepidation. The point is that Scott and his team at Waterline has followed up on every single promise they made to me both in purchasing and the commissioning of the boat!
These boats are both very seaworthy and comfortable and no matter what dock I have tied up to, people stop by to look and talk about her.
Since I'm not much of a blogger, poster or tweeter feel free to ask me anything you think might be helpful for you to know since I have a new boat but do have a few hours on her now.
Jamie McPherson
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Old 11-18-2015, 12:53 PM   #63
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John - You have my vote! I really like reading your thread/posts. You two went about choosing a boat in very similar way me and mine do also. Lots o' persons are not too impressed with our choice of boat... and, that's OK with us. Each to their own! But, I do like reading everyone's opinions; keeps me refreshed in different perspectives.

If any boat owners' have such thin skin that they become offended by your choice/desire/needs/impressions/admissions stated in a post... well then... IMO they should not be on a boating forum! That's a whole other discussion!


John,

Thank you for involving us in your thinking process. I'm sure there are a lot of newbies and oldbies out there who appreciate your process and the pros and cons.

Listening to pros with no cons is simply a waste of everyone's time
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Old 11-18-2015, 02:13 PM   #64
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John,

I would just another "me too". This is a valuable thread so please keep it going. While everyone here has different ideas or preferences, whether slight or large differences, it's the process that is important. Explaining your thought process is valuable to me.

And I can't see why anyone would feel offended by another boater wanting a faster boat or in their minds a different look appeals to them more. I personally like the look of the N's, especially the "shippier" looking ones. Not offended by those folks that don't. Just feel they are wrong! Haha just kidding...

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Old 11-18-2015, 02:59 PM   #65
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Process. As Marcus Lemonis says "People, Process and Product." But when it comes to decision making or selection, I always emphasize process as I did in business. If people do go through the process as you did, they'll stand a much better chance of making the right choice for themselves. You thought and worked it all through. I hope newcomers especially who are asking what boat to buy read your comments not to lead them to select the same boat you did, but to go through the complete process with no short cuts.

If someone goes through all the steps, I'll never question their end decision even if it's something I would have never chosen. But if someone just jumps in and buys without those steps then I'm always concerned, even if they're buying my favorite boat.

Our choices may be lousy for most people here, but the way we make them, much like how you made yours, will get most to the right answer for themselves. Here, you had a knowledgeable boat owner who went into it with a preference in his mind but by doing his research and going through the process selected something different and better for his situation.

I applaud the way you did it and am appreciative of you sharing.
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Old 11-18-2015, 08:08 PM   #66
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John;
I am enjoying reading your posts that share your thoughts and decision making for your new boat. Oddly enough much of what you share is exactly what I went through in making my choice to purchase my Helmsman 38, "Knot2Fast". Since my boat is moored at Waterline Boats I'm sure you have had a chance to be on her several times and of course are welcome to look at her whenever you are in Seattle.
I can tell you that I fell in love with the boat several years ago but am also someone who does a fair amount of research ahead of a purchase and since I was skipping 2footitis and going directly from a 24' SeaSport to a 38PH you can imagine I had a fair amount of trepidation. The point is that Scott and his team at Waterline has followed up on every single promise they made to me both in purchasing and the commissioning of the boat!
These boats are both very seaworthy and comfortable and no matter what dock I have tied up to, people stop by to look and talk about her.
Since I'm not much of a blogger, poster or tweeter feel free to ask me anything you think might be helpful for you to know since I have a new boat but do have a few hours on her now.
Jamie McPherson
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Knot2 - Photos - in and out! Maybe you did already and I missed em??
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Old 11-18-2015, 08:30 PM   #67
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Interesting thread. I looked at the Helmsman 38 at the most recent Boats Afloat show and was impressed (except I hit my head going from the pilothouse to the salon). I'll be curious to see how you've customized the boat.

The salon and pilothouse feel bigger compared to the Nordic Tug 37/39/40 and American Tug 395. Having a settee in the pilothouse is really nice and I like the loose chair in the salon. The tradeoff is no (small) second cabin—probably a good tradeoff for many cruising couples, especially if they host more happy hours than overnight guests.

The price tag is impressive, too. Base price looks to be about $170k below the American Tug and $215k below the Nordic. Not sure how closely these represent what buyers are actually paying.

Have fun with the new build and keep us posted.
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Old 11-18-2015, 08:40 PM   #68
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This is Allan whose Helmsman 38PH is now on board a ship making its way to Seattle for delivery to me. The "apparent" larger salon is real mostly because the salon is full-beam without side decks. This was a huge selling point for us since we tend to do more living inside the boat than on the side decks. We do not foresee any problem with the lack of side decks in terms of docking since we have always had the made step on shore with the stern line and I hand her the bow line from the helm. Real stairs up to the upper deck are so much easier and nicer to use than an ladder as well.

The prices you see are really quite close to what you pay for the boat. The only additions are, of course, the electronics and maybe a tv and/or stereo. We just plan to put a Bose CD Wave Radio on board for our music and have had the boat wired for tv and antenna. Throw on the dink and we are really ready to go. Well, we have to fill the fridge to with some libations.

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Old 11-19-2015, 08:29 PM   #69
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Congratulations John and Maria. It was just about a year ago that I ordered my 43 foot Helmsman Pilot House. What a great process you are heading into. I look forward to learning about my boat through your expert reporting on your boat!
I have 300 hours on my boat now and the whole experience has been great thanks largely to Scott and Lisa's professionalism.
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Old 11-20-2015, 11:41 AM   #70
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I hope the OP will post another installment soon!
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Old 11-20-2015, 04:13 PM   #71
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Really enjoying the thread! When you have a chance, let us know where we can locate your blog. I've only seen your posts here and on the Norhavn Dreamers emails. Thanks again for sharing.
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Old 11-20-2015, 08:57 PM   #72
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How long is the Helmsman build process? Order to delivery?
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Old 11-21-2015, 07:58 PM   #73
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Build time, which would include shipping time as well, is hard for me to tell since my boat already had some work done when I ordered it about 3 months ago My guess would be to figure about six months but you could call Scott Helker at Waterline Boats for a better estimate. It's worth the wait.
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Old 11-21-2015, 09:44 PM   #74
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Difficulty Uploading Files

Hello all, we are having major issues uploading files or even copying an excel spreadsheet and chart. WE keep getting invalid files when we try to upload excel or Powerpoint. Copy and paste is not working. In deep here and looing for help. thanks

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Old 11-21-2015, 11:19 PM   #75
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Build time, which would include shipping time as well, is hard for me to tell since my boat already had some work done when I ordered it about 3 months ago My guess would be to figure about six months but you could call Scott Helker at Waterline Boats for a better estimate. It's worth the wait.
I can advise that six months is in the ball park for a standard boat. We started out at six months but with the extra level of customization we are looking at seven months. Just for reference a new N40 would be about one year due mostly in part to the larger number of boats built at that yard compared to the Helmsman yard. Another lesson learned a long time ago is to remain flexible when it comes time to commissioning after the boat arrives. We will discuss this in greater detail in our future posts.

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Old 11-21-2015, 11:46 PM   #76
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Displacement or Weight

Since we are struggling uploading attachments for our next post, I thought a quick post on a boats displacement may be of interest. For those wondering why displacement or the weight of a boat is important all I can say is that when things start to get rough the heavier the boat the better the ride will become. While greater displacement in a Full Displacement hull is easier to design and build (your not going any faster then displacement speed so you don't have to worry about horsepower) things become more interesting in a semi-displacement hull where you are searching for the best of both worlds (speed and performance).

Many people will argue that with semi-displacement hull boats you can never get it right. While there may be some level of merit with this argument we knew we still wanted a semi-displacement boat this time around for a little extra speed (7-9 knots) while at the same time not giving up a heavier well built boat. We were less concerned with top end speed which requires either lighter weight or extremely greater horsepower and fuel consumption. Just look around at the displacement of comparable semi-displacement boats with the same waterline or LOA and you will see another reason that our selection lead us to the Helmsman 38PH.

You can take this process one step further and look at larger semi-displacement boats like Flemming or the new Nordhavn Coastal Yachts and compare their weights to other boats in that range and start to see which boats are designed for serious cruising versus day boating.

It is important to note that I did not mention hull strength since todays materials allow for greater strength without extra weight. I'm focused on comfort in this post which is more likely achieved with displacement and slighter greater speeds but remaining below 10 knots. All this adds up to just another characteristic to look at when you are shopping for your next boat.

John
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Old 11-23-2015, 12:36 PM   #77
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Hi John & Marie,
Just found this post for the first time,,, (we've been kinda hanging low for the past few weeks after Harley's passing). -- anyway, CONGRATULATIONS! Finally pulled the trigger eh? Well done,,, some wonderful & exciting times ahead for the both of you!

Is this the main thread for your newbuild?
What machinery do have you specc'ed for the man cave? (I understand you want a simpler boat this time)
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Old 11-23-2015, 02:12 PM   #78
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Machinery

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Hi John & Marie,
Just found this post for the first time,,, (we've been kinda hanging low for the past few weeks after Harley's passing). -- anyway, CONGRATULATIONS! Finally pulled the trigger eh? Well done,,, some wonderful & exciting times ahead for the both of you!

Is this the main thread for your newbuild?
What machinery do have you specc'ed for the man cave? (I understand you want a simpler boat this time)
Andy, great to hear you found us. Yes, this will be the thread for the new boat until we figure out how to build a web-site. Amazing the issues I'm having (I need a little kid around the house who can tackle this for me).

Regarding the machinery we decided to go with Cummons diesel since many current owners have reported positive feedback. I tested two boats with the larger 380hp (same engine we optioned for instead of the standard 250hp) and I felt it was a good match. I really like the digital display with all the information. I noticed that PAE is also going with Cummons on their new 59 Coastal Pilot as well as other well known builders.

Since we are trying something different this time around and looking for a simpler boat we decided to hold off on the Northern Lights generator until we move the boat to the east coast in five years. We found in southern California we just never used the generators enough to keep them in good running condition. The new boat will be plumbed and wired for the future. We did select two reverse cycle A/C & heaters for occasional use while at the docks. We decided to hold off on stabilizers and plan to use hull design and speed to compensate as much as possible while watching the weather forecasts a little closer. This approach worked well for five years with our 22' Mako Center Console (we were a little younger then) and hope it holds true this time around. We took a hard look the SeaKeeper Gyro system but struggling to get my head around the concept, time for system to come on line (45 minutes) need to run the generator (possible to run off the inverter but would have limited run time using batteries thus you really need the generator running full time) and the space required in the engine room. If we really thought we needed stabilization we would lean towards Trac Active Fins but this boat is a little small (my opinion).

I'm working with Alcom Marine in Costa Mesa, CA on the electronics package and will likely go with the proven Furuno System,Simrad AP and Satellite TV.

It is a struggle (but fun) to build a simpler boat while still demanding the best and playing the balancing game of comfort versus system complexity versus safety. I spent a lot of time comparing N4050 (a relatively basic equipped Nordhavn) against N4061 (fully loaded) and concluded we didn't need or use many items on N4061 but we still paid for and needed to maintain them. Time will tell how this all will work out but so far we are very pleased and confident with our decision process.

When do you cast off for New Zealand?

John
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Old 11-25-2015, 12:18 PM   #79
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Build Schedule - Week 3

Hello again, one aspect of a new build we enjoy is tracking progress and receiving photos from the yard. We plan to post (week by week) progress on our web-site (still under construction) for others to reference in case they decide to build a new boat and curious why it can take so long.
Its been 3 weeks (and one day) since we signed our contract and just received photos of the first few "construction" steps. With any new boat the builder will clean the molds then apply the outer barrier or Gelcoat. A nice clean white finish followed by the first few layers of fiberglass (there goes the nice white color). As with most boats the fiberglass is applied by hand in different directions for strength. We are still working with Scott at Waterline to obtain better pictures and will post them on the site soon. To be honest except to know the boat has started the pictures will not get most people excited. The real fun starts when you start to see the interior being built but we are long way from there.

We are hoping to see a Catia model or print soon of the salon layout with the new galley we designed using a simple Excel spreadsheet. This will be fun as we coordinate our design with yard and do our best to make it just perfect without having to fly over to China. If we were performing even more changes a trip to the yard would be required.

A few other items we have been working this week include identifying a boat yard in Long Beach, CA we can commission the boat once it arrives from China. While we would prefer to have to boat arrive in San Diego (our home port) sometimes you need to be flexible. As large as Long Beach port is (largest commercial port on the west) there is only one boat yard that supports pleasure boat commissioning. We may decide to move the boat 20 miles south to Newport Beach Harbor (largest pleasure boat harbor in California) and have electronics installed there.

That's about all for today.

John
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Old 11-25-2015, 01:51 PM   #80
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John:


When I kept my boat in Long Beach several years ago I had a bottom job done at Marina Shipyard there. They used a funky railway lifting platform for hauling/launching but seemed like a full service yard that could do anything.

Wilmington should have yards that can do commissioning, maybe San Pedro as well. Also Sunset Aquatic in Huntington Harbor has a yard just behind them that looks like they could do commissioning.

But Newport Beach is nice, although it must be expensive. I know, I used to live there.

David
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