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Old 05-17-2016, 04:06 PM   #461
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At some point I plan to expand on this strategy which has allowed an average Joe (OK, John) like myself to have enjoyed the number boats we have owned over the years without going broke.

John T.
Really, really enjoying this thread. Would love to hear your observations on this topic when you have time. We are on our fourth boat (not counting dinghies and canoes) and are also probably closer to average than not. Oh, and also contemplating the next boat, something a little larger. The big issue we are dealing with now is do we get the boat that will likely be the last of our big boats now (at least 15 years to retirement) and finance a significant portion, or do we wait (will add that we are doing great with retirement savings, and a bigger boat now won't change our savings rate). I'm leaning toward now, as who knows what will happen in the future.
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Old 05-17-2016, 04:22 PM   #462
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John: Great posts. A favor though. On the pictures, could you post them individually or at a higher resolution. Thanks in advance.
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Old 05-18-2016, 10:25 PM   #463
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Progress Report

The past few days have been focused on administrative tasks (financials, LLC, Insurance) required and need to be lined up before the boat arrives. Starting these too early will usually ends up having to resubmit or provide updated paperwork while waiting too long can really cause some stress. We found the six week window prior the boat arriving to be a good time to get started.

We discovered Merkel Boat Insurance to again offer the best rates (by far) and will likely start out with them. I questioned again why the coverage doesn't include "haul out" at the boat yard and was told "its a San Diego thing" (welcome to California - Hollywood, home the pretty people as some say). Since most of the yards in SD offer minimal insurance as part of their costs, insurance companies will not include this coverage in their policies for San Diego based boats. The catch here is the coverage provided by yards is only around $25K which doesn't come close to true replacement costs. We will just have to deal with this like we did before.

As far as the schedule goes it appears the boat will not ship until the end of June and hopefully arrive by mid July. The floors should be done this week then work can start on the custom interior. We expect to see the final blue prints any day and will turn them around quickly. I told Scott that while we are anxious to receive the boat ASAP we know it is best to just relax and let the yard wok their magic. Funny thing about excitement and anticipation that goes along with most new things in life, after some time you forget about all that stuff and focus more on the thing and how it is living up to your expectation. For this reason it is best not rush things in life but rather do all you can to insure they turn out right. Still wont sleep well until the boat arrives (I guess I'm still a kid at heart).

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Old 05-18-2016, 10:49 PM   #464
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Decisions

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Really, really enjoying this thread. Would love to hear your observations on this topic when you have time. We are on our fourth boat (not counting dinghies and canoes) and are also probably closer to average than not. Oh, and also contemplating the next boat, something a little larger. The big issue we are dealing with now is do we get the boat that will likely be the last of our big boats now (at least 15 years to retirement) and finance a significant portion, or do we wait (will add that we are doing great with retirement savings, and a bigger boat now won't change our savings rate). I'm leaning toward now, as who knows what will happen in the future.
Thank you for your post. We found ourselves (OK, I did) in your situation about ten years ago when we decided to build our retirement boat a little early in life. It turned out to be our first Nordhavn. Our rational was and still is "life is too unpredictable and short to wait for the perfect time". We knew we were spending some of our future retirement funds but decided it was worth it. Looking back today we both agree we made the right decision. We are not wealthy (far from it) but doing ok and try to balance the best we can living life today and still saving for the future. If we get close to getting this right we will be able to look back 20 years from today and watch the sunset from the transom of some boat, somewhere and be able to say "looks like we got it right".

No one can or should advise you on what is best for you and your family. Making a large financial purchase for most people requires serious consideration and research that is best done by the people impacted. My only advise would be for you to take your time, do your research including serious sole searching before making the best decision for both you and your family. Remember to use the 90% rule I wrote about on earlier posts and you should do fine.

John T
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Old 05-20-2016, 11:40 AM   #465
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Great advice, John. We are also interested in hearing more about how you were able to avoid large depreciation losses on your past boats. I think every boat we've owned, we ended up selling for what we paid or a bit more, but they were all used, bought at a good price, and had a lot of work/upgrades done by us. While we didn't loose money on the purchase prices, there was a cost for the time, work, and parts that went into them. That said, it was all worth it as this is a lifestyle choice for us such that we are happy to put disposable income towards (as opposed to a large home, fancy cars, etc.).
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Old 05-20-2016, 01:16 PM   #466
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Great advice, John. We are also interested in hearing more about how you were able to avoid large depreciation losses on your past boats. I think every boat we've owned, we ended up selling for what we paid or a bit more, but they were all used, bought at a good price, and had a lot of work/upgrades done by us. While we didn't loose money on the purchase prices, there was a cost for the time, work, and parts that went into them. That said, it was all worth it as this is a lifestyle choice for us such that we are happy to put disposable income towards (as opposed to a large home, fancy cars, etc.).
I'm with you. I make money in business. I lose money on personal purchases. I know why. I don't think of making or losing money on them, just what they cost and if it's worth it to me. I never think of selling at the time of purchase. Of course I do keep everything a long time.
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Old 05-20-2016, 08:08 PM   #467
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Progress Report

Yesterday received updated blueprints from the yard and after a comprehensive review I concluded "these guys are good". They picked up every change including the small 3" extension to the galley granite top we noted on the corner of one page. This small change had a domino effect on the two cabinets forward and to port which they adjusted accordingly. The new smaller window dimension were added as were changes to cabinet above the washer/dryer. We advised Scott that night "we are good to go".

We hope to see more photos early next week showing all the floors are complete and work starting on the salon / galley as well as pilothouse. Things appear to be coming together nicely.

A few hours ago we spoke with the marina dock master who just returned from a long trip from Cabo in poor weather (ouch). He informed me the slips we looked at last weekend were not available. He only has one 45' slip available and we may have to just take it to get the boat in then move. He assured us again not to worry, that he will get us a slip when the boat arrives.

This weekend we will work on the LLC paperwork and submit it Monday.

Yesterday we received a call from the promoters of the San Diego Boat Show asking if we were still able to present. They had gone radio silent in part due to the show being sold to another company and they appear to be playing catchup. I told them if they can schedule us over the weekend we could still pull together a presentation and support. I'm leaning towards a presentation based on our TF posts focused the process related to researching and building a new trailer. Our previous presentations were based on Living Aboard a Trawler.

That's about it for today. Have a great weekend on your boats!

John
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Old 05-20-2016, 08:22 PM   #468
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Photo's

I thought this photo of the galley / salon floor being installed was impressive and showcases just how large the area is. For those who have not followed our journey from the beginning one our top priorities with this boat was to maximize the salon / galley area, provide a feeling of openness and uncluttered floor space. While the blueprints depict we are heading in the right direction, this photo starts to confirm our plan. Next step will be the installation of the sofa and galley followed by future soft goods (Mary's task after the boat arrives).

Only one photo this time!

John
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Old 05-23-2016, 07:23 PM   #469
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Boat Slip

Well so much for reserving our slip a little early. Today we learned the slips we looked at just a week ago are not available. The marina is 95% filled up and with our boat not arriving for anther 6 weeks (+/-) the manager doesn't want to guarantee us anything in the 40' - 45' range at this time. While we are not excited with not knowing where we will end up we did receive reassurance that we have a slip even if it is a 50' - 60' just to get us in. At this point we have to trust these folks and honestly we don't have any reason not to since we have stayed here with our previous three boats and most marina's like to make room for shinny new boats (it does add a nice touch to the neighborhood).

While the above sounds good I am quietly working our back-up plan not very far away.

This weekend we took advantage of the sales at West Marine and purchased a nice size Bar-B-Q that was 30% off regular price. The inventory of boating stuff in the garage is starting grow. All we need now is a boat to store in on.

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Old 05-23-2016, 08:41 PM   #470
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Moorage was really tight up here when I bought my sailboat in 2010. I ended up paying for a slip for 2 months so we would be sure to have it when our boat got trucked up to Tacoma. Eventually, we ended up buying a slip there so we always have a slip to use provided our LOA doesn't go over 50'
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Old 05-23-2016, 08:49 PM   #471
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Moorage was really tight up here when I bought my sailboat in 2010. I ended up paying for a slip for 2 months so we would be sure to have it when our boat got trucked up to Tacoma. Eventually, we ended up buying a slip there so we always have a slip to use provided our LOA doesn't go over 50'
We got tired of wondering where we would end up year to year and purchased a slip here in RI 8 years ago...
Not sure it was the best financial decision we ever made (like most things boating...) but it has been a pleasure to know where we will be!
I'm sure we'd do it again!
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Old 05-23-2016, 08:58 PM   #472
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We got tired of wondering where we would end up year to year and purchased a slip here in RI 8 years ago...
Not sure it was the best financial decision we ever made (like most things boating...) but it has been a pleasure to know where we will be!
I'm sure we'd do it again!
Bruce
We were lucky. Bank had foreclosed on a slip owned by a widow who had the misfortune to marry a man with more $$$ than sense. Not only was he way over extended in his real estate and toys, but he then fell off his big boat and drowned. His widow went from being married to a high earner with lots of debt, to just having lots of debt.

The slip had been sitting unsold for a long time. We made an all cash offer that was about 60% of what the slip had sold for a couple years prior and 70% of what they were asking. To my surprise, the bank actually took the offer. Of course, I then had absolutely NO cash. Not a comfortable feeling.
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Old 05-23-2016, 09:09 PM   #473
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>...Of course, I then had absolutely NO cash. Not a comfortable feeling.
That made me laugh my inlaws have always named their boats Vide'Poches...roughly translated "Empty Pockets"
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Old 05-26-2016, 10:13 PM   #474
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Weekly Progress Report

Well, unfortunately I don't have much to report this week as we wait for photos from the yard and a progress report. We did receive paperwork related to offshore funding and forwarded some paperwork to Scott. We provided information to our attorney related to he LLC and got a slip! I received a call from the marina advising they found us a 45' slip very close to were we last stayed with the N35, in fact it may be same slip. We plan to head south tomorrow and spend the night in SD as a little get away. We will take a look at the slip and likely return to West Marine and spend a little more money.

One unfortunate surprise was how much slip fees have gone up. We definitely over $900 / month (ouch). This monthly bill is enough to make us think about buying a smaller boat (OK maybe not yet). As we have all discussed before if you are going to commit to boating you shouldn't complain about the costs.

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Old 05-28-2016, 08:29 PM   #475
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Back From SD

We just returned home after spending a night in San Diego and checking on the slip I mentioned in our previous post. What are the chances that after leaving a marina two years ago and that is now 98% filled, the slip that becomes available is the one you last stayed in? We are talking about roughly 1 in a thousand slips and sure enough we were given that one slip. While we are pleased to have a slip, we were a little disappointed it was this one since a former tenant close by was lets just say "a little loud" was still there which had us thinking twice. As soon as we mentioned our concerns to the dock manager he said "say no more we understand" and with that we were reassured we would be placed on another dock.

With this behind us we took off to enjoy the rest of day and evening which included dinner at one of our favorite dinning places in SD. The restaurant is called Coasterria and within walking distance from the marina. It is a new, open air, high end Mexican cuisine restaurant on the water overlooking the bay and downtown SD. SD is one of those places where you can always eat outside regardless what month it is, the weather is usually around 68 degrees with no humidity. Last night was no exception and the food was great.

The following day we stop in at another marina to touch base with the manager whom we have known for years and confirmed he can get us in if we needed a slip. One thing about brining in a new boat is that the marina's will find you a place. What better marketing for any marina than to show off new boats. We learned this back in 2005 with our first new trawler.

I spoke with Scott this morning and discussed a few items. He expects photos from the yard which he will forward and we will post. Needless to say we are anxious to see the progress made the past two weeks. That's all for this weekend.

Happy Memorial Day
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Old 05-30-2016, 04:01 PM   #476
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Electronics Revisited

One of the interesting aspects of building a new boat and selecting many of the components and accessories is the never ending learning experience. Awhile back I posted that we had decided to stay with Furuno electronics for their solid reputation and reliability which in part would allow us to feel comfortable with a single suite to keep things simple and even save a few dollars. No sooner had I made this post I receive word of issues with their new displays and system integration (ouch). The problem reportedly only rises its ugly head after the system has been running consistently for days which fortunately for us should not be an issue. Still not feeling good about all this I called Furuno technical support directly and spoke with them about what I had heard. I appreciated the technician honesty that their have been some issues with the newest systems (some owner operator learning and some software) but Furuno has been sending out software updates and continue to work any new reports. I have to admit I was impressed with the level of service over the phone, their willingness to do what ever it takes to fix the issue and felt a little better about these latest concerns.

I still visited West Marine to take a second look at Simrad and was impressed how easy their displays were to navigate. After talking with a few long time ocean voyaging boat owners about my dilemma, I decided to stay with Furuno at least for now. Once the boat arrives I plan to speak with Furuno again and see what if any special type of reassurance I can obtain then make the final decision but in the long run I think I have to stay with their proven long term reputation.

Always something to worry about when building or owning a boat

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Old 05-30-2016, 04:20 PM   #477
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I will be watching your electronics choices carefully as we are about 8 or so months behind you!
I have heard nothing but praise for Garmin from those I know who have a hand in the business and I've played with Simrad equipment but I too have Furuno high on the list. No more Raymarine for us, too many failures on our last boat.
It is one of the things we will be researching during the fall boat show season...
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Old 05-30-2016, 05:16 PM   #478
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OSR Photo

Given we don't have a boat to enjoy this holiday weekend I decided to look at the photo's Scott provided last week when he visited the yard and found this one of the OSR under construction. A few items we appreciate with a forward island berth are the upper built-in shelf's on both sides. While some may not give a second thought about a second level of shelving I can tell you it cost me $1K to have similar shelving added to one of our N40's late in the build process and shipped loose. We agreed we needed these so Mary had a place to put her morning coffee while sitting in bed and watching the morning news on TV. OK, I was also there and found the shelving very accommodating.

As with most forward island berth there is plenty of storage under the bed (4 large draws) and the mattress lifts up to gain access to the bow thruster unit. The boat also has small storage (port and starboard) along side the bed (cool). The hanging locker space is a little small on this boat but since we are not living aboard we should be fine.

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Old 05-30-2016, 05:33 PM   #479
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I think you gave Furuno the right test. You have comfort from using them in the past, but would they acknowledge issues. Once they did that to me it was sort of decision made, no reason to change as I believe they'll support me.
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Old 05-30-2016, 07:10 PM   #480
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I used Furuno and did a self install. Initially I ordered Simrad at a discount online marine electronic supplier, but before filling the order and charging me they phoned and asked if I REALLY wanted Simrad. I asked why. They said at that time they were getting a large number of faulty product returns. So I opted to go with Furuno as there was a bunch of it on board already. This was a bit over 3 years ago, and Simrad's QC may well I have improved. But get return rates for all potential electronics purchases if you can.

My Furuno self install was reasonably easy although the second AP control on the flybridge was faulty and had to be returned and replaced, which was done without drama. It took me a long time to realize it was faulty - it would run in demo mode fine, but that was all it would do. I thought I must be doing something wrong, so went over the install multiple times. I advised it was DoA and got a replacement quickly.

I am disappointed with the MFD 12 which runs Navnet 3D. It also had a hard drive fault that would not allow it to accept new charts. But as it was pre-loaded with the charts I was using that issue took time to become apparent. But it was fixed under warranty. The MFD 12 is on the FB, and not used a great deal. I really like using Nobletec Trident running on a PC and using a 24" monitor in the pilothouse. Maxsea and Nobletec are 50% owned by Furuno and integration is very good with Furuno branded product.

TZ Touch is far better than the old Navnet 3D. I think Furuno will get any issues in the latest models sorted. They do have excellent support and parts availability even for very old systems. I would likely choose Furuno again As good as Garmin is, their proprietary charts are a PITA.

I suspect that most of the major manufacturers put out good systems, but how well they work for you could well depend on installation. Even Raymarine might be fine if installed by a pro and done properly at the outset.
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