Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 09-12-2019, 11:52 AM   #1
Veteran Member
 
City: Corpus Christi
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Sunrise
Vessel Model: Gemini 105mc
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 45
Send a message via Skype™ to The Brockerts
Getting ready to survey a 1990 Californian MY w/425hp

Getting ready to survey a 1990 Californian MY w/425hp and is there any weak points that I should know about and check out? This boat has spent it's life on fresh water and I'll be moving it to the gulf coast of Texas and will be running it in the GICW area for the next few years.

The Brockerts
__________________
Advertisement

The Brockerts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2019, 12:57 PM   #2
Guru
 
Comodave's Avatar
 
City: Au Gres, MI
Country: US
Vessel Name: Never Say Never
Vessel Model: President 41 DC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 5,477
While I donít have any specific knowledge on that particular boat, I just wanted to say that I hope it goes well. When you close on it we will need photos of course. Good luck.
__________________

__________________
Boat Nut:
If you are one there is no explanation necessary.
If you arenít one, there is no explanation possible.
Comodave is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2019, 01:56 PM   #3
Guru
 
City: Carefree, Arizona
Country: usa
Vessel Name: sunchaser V
Vessel Model: DeFever 48
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 8,020
Guessing it has 425 HP Cat 3208s, things that need checking will require a well rounded Cat mechanic. Hopefully the vessel is propped correctly.

Up to date service records would be a plus. In advance, go through the boat diesel.com archives for background on the 30 year old engines. Absent recent servicing (more tha oil and filters) I'd guess you'll be spending $5-7K per engine to get them current.
sunchaser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2019, 02:39 PM   #4
Veteran Member
 
City: Corpus Christi
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Sunrise
Vessel Model: Gemini 105mc
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 45
Send a message via Skype™ to The Brockerts
Yes correct Cat 3208's, should have mentioned that. Some maintenance records for the last couple of years but nothing back farther than that. The engines have 1600 hours on them and I can't find evidence of the 1000 hours Cat recommended maintenance being done. Great tip on diesel . com archive,

The Brockerts
The Brockerts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2019, 02:48 PM   #5
Guru
 
rgano's Avatar
 
City: Southport, Florida
Country: USA
Vessel Name: FROLIC
Vessel Model: Mainship 30 Pilot II since 2015. GB-42 1986-2015. Former Unlimited Tonnage Master
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 753
Send a message via Skype™ to rgano
Are you up on the few things to ensure are correct for the shit to SW like engine and running gear anodes?
__________________
Rich Gano
FROLIC (2005 MainShip 30 Pilot II)
Panama City area
rgano is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2019, 03:36 PM   #6
Member
 
City: Savannah
Country: United States
Join Date: Dec 2018
Posts: 7
I have a 91' Californian MY (3 stateroom). 425 Cats with similar hours. Can't enough good things about the 3208 Cats. 3rd time for me. Keep your zincs up to date and oil changed on a regular basis.
wrm95 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2019, 03:44 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
Oldersalt's Avatar
 
City: San francisco
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Pacific Star
Vessel Model: 1990 Grand Banks 32 #834
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 156
I recently bought a 30-year old boat with very incomplete maintenance records. I bought a replacement kit comprised of all the hoses for that engine, then paid the mechanic to do a standard annual service plus replacement of all hoses (kept the old ones for emergency spares). He also spotted a couple of potential problems, like improper alternator mounting, and fixed those too. Cheap insurance, I figure....
But remember these famous words..."Everything on your boat is broken. You just don't know it yet."
Good luck and enjoy the new boat!
Oldersalt
Oldersalt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2019, 05:24 PM   #8
Veteran Member
 
City: Corpus Christi
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Sunrise
Vessel Model: Gemini 105mc
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 45
Send a message via Skype™ to The Brockerts
wrm95,
Thanks for the positive comments. I've read a lot of negative things about the 3208 425hp as have issues with heat and the like. All saying the 3208 375hp were a much better engine. I feel that this boat being on freshwater all it's life, being used about 5-6 months each year on lake Texoma(Dallas Texas area) should have been an easy on some things. There is virtually no rust anywhere.
I plan on doing a service before putting it in salt water, zinc's, new paint, flush all fluids, changes hoses, start a good maintenance program, before heading out with it.

The Brockerts
The Brockerts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2019, 05:35 PM   #9
Guru
 
City: Carefree, Arizona
Country: usa
Vessel Name: sunchaser V
Vessel Model: DeFever 48
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 8,020
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Brockerts View Post
wrm95,
Thanks for the positive comments. I've read a lot of negative things about the 3208 425hp as have issues with heat and the like. All saying the 3208 375hp were a much better engine. I feel that this boat being on freshwater all it's life, being used about 5-6 months each year on lake Texoma(Dallas Texas area) should have been an easy on some things. There is virtually no rust anywhere.
I plan on doing a service before putting it in salt water, zinc's, new paint, flush all fluids, changes hoses, start a good maintenance program, before heading out with it.

The Brockerts
You may want to get after coolers cleaned out and have a really good look inside turbos. Head gaskets can be troublesome as the 3208s age, quite common to replace once into the age of your potential purchase.

I've always liked the Californians in the size you are getting. Lots of room to work around engines and other mechanicals. Is it a pre Carver model?
sunchaser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2019, 07:26 PM   #10
Guru
 
tiltrider1's Avatar
 
City: Seattle
Country: USA
Vessel Name: AZZURRA
Vessel Model: Ocean Alexander 54
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,478
425 hp. Was just too much for the Cat 3208. If the PO liked to run at WOT then you have concerns. If the PO ran the boat at 1800 rpms making a mere 125 hp per engine, there are no concerns. If you don’t know how the PO used the engines then start with an oil analyst.
tiltrider1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2019, 08:24 PM   #11
Veteran Member
 
City: Corpus Christi
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Sunrise
Vessel Model: Gemini 105mc
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 45
Send a message via Skype™ to The Brockerts
Yes, that was a pre carver made Sept 1990. The PO tells me he generally ran around 1800 rpm out to the islands in the lake, about a mile out, dropped anchor in 10 feet of water, cranked up the $12,000 stereo system and went went swimming with all his friends.

The Brockert
The Brockerts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2019, 09:03 PM   #12
Guru
 
Comodave's Avatar
 
City: Au Gres, MI
Country: US
Vessel Name: Never Say Never
Vessel Model: President 41 DC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 5,477
With the boat being on the lake, I would suspect that it has not been run hard for very long. More likely the PO is being truthful with minimal running.
__________________
Boat Nut:
If you are one there is no explanation necessary.
If you arenít one, there is no explanation possible.
Comodave is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-13-2019, 04:06 PM   #13
Veteran Member
 
Tellico Bob's Avatar
 
City: Tellico Marina, Maryville, TN
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Twilight Time
Vessel Model: 1986 48' Californian MY
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 97
Interesting. I have a 1986 48ft MY and I believe 1986 was the last year Marshall owned the company. Everything after that was built by Carver I believe. 375HP 3208 were very popular. Mine was over propped and I had to take 2" out of the pitch. I have cruised over a 1000 miles since 2014 and have had no problems at all. Did discover that the dip sticks were marked wrong and was using a quart of oil per engine every 8 hours. Since I made the corrections I have cruised 400 miles without adding any oil. LOL
Tellico Bob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-13-2019, 06:14 PM   #14
Veteran Member
 
City: Corpus Christi
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Sunrise
Vessel Model: Gemini 105mc
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 45
Send a message via Skype™ to The Brockerts
I believe it's a pre Carver. Built Sept 1990 there are no Carver markings on the boat. On other 1990's I've surveyed they had a Carver logo and a Californian logo mounted on the side. Maybe this Sept boat the Carver logo was removed? I'm not sure, I'm just calling it a Californian based on no Carver markings like other ones. The only Carver markings are the new captain chairs this Owner installed in the last 2 years. He calls it a Californian. Some day, someone will publish all the HID's and who and where there were made? Maybe this list is already out there?

The Brockerts
The Brockerts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-13-2019, 06:17 PM   #15
Veteran Member
 
City: Corpus Christi
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Sunrise
Vessel Model: Gemini 105mc
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 45
Send a message via Skype™ to The Brockerts
How would I know if it's over propped? Being a sailor "props" were never my thing. I'll pay attention to the dip sticks too now.

The Brockerts
The Brockerts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-14-2019, 10:30 AM   #16
TF Site Team
 
FlyWright's Avatar
 
City: California Delta and SF Bay
Country: Sacramento, CA, USA (boat in Vallejo)
Vessel Name: FlyWright
Vessel Model: Marshall Californian 34 LRC
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,300
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Brockerts View Post
I believe it's a pre Carver. Built Sept 1990 there are no Carver markings on the boat. On other 1990's I've surveyed they had a Carver logo and a Californian logo mounted on the side. Maybe this Sept boat the Carver logo was removed? I'm not sure, I'm just calling it a Californian based on no Carver markings like other ones. The only Carver markings are the new captain chairs this Owner installed in the last 2 years. He calls it a Californian. Some day, someone will publish all the HID's and who and where there were made? Maybe this list is already out there?

The Brockerts
About 8-10 years ago I had a phone conversation with Gil Marshall while his Dad, Jule, was listening in on the speakerphone. Gil was a 15 yr old bilge rat in his Dad's Marshall Boat Co back in 1977 when mine was built. He told me that all the paper records for the HINs were shipped to Carver and Wellcraft through the various company sales and never made it back to the Marshalls when they bought the Californian name back in later years. He said they were all lost in the process.

One point he made clearly was that all HINs starting in 'JCM' mean the boat was built by Jule Marshall in California. The numbering sequence after that was changed through the years with letters in the middle of the sequence sometimes being used to denote the year of construction.
__________________
My boat is my ark. It's my mobile treehouse and my floating fishing cabin. It's my retreat and my respite. Everyday I thank God I have a boat! -Al

@DeltaBridges - 25 Delta Bridges in 25 Days
FlyWright is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-14-2019, 12:37 PM   #17
Guru
 
Comodave's Avatar
 
City: Au Gres, MI
Country: US
Vessel Name: Never Say Never
Vessel Model: President 41 DC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 5,477
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Brockerts View Post
How would I know if it's over propped? Being a sailor "props" were never my thing. I'll pay attention to the dip sticks too now.

The Brockerts
Will it make the rated RPM at full throttle with your normal load aboard the boat? If not it may be overpropped. It also could be a dirty bottom or running gear. Also it could be the tach not really accurate.
__________________
Boat Nut:
If you are one there is no explanation necessary.
If you arenít one, there is no explanation possible.
Comodave is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2019, 08:44 AM   #18
Veteran Member
 
City: Corpus Christi
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Sunrise
Vessel Model: Gemini 105mc
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 45
Send a message via Skype™ to The Brockerts
A complete bust, didn't even finish the survey. I just walked on this survey 1/3 of the way through.
Broker rate boat "stone cold 10"

In someways I feel like a fool !

In my pre-visit survey I need to stop being such a nice guy with the owners and brokers. I need to open every hatch, door, test A/C's, test appliances etc. before I schedule a survey.

Am I wrong to do this ?



Why I walked,



- 3 New A/C's installed, installation records....but only one worked !

- Mid-aft fuel tank not used, Ok I'll check it out.....only to find it was under water. Yes underwater. Mid bilge filled with water to within inches of the floor.
- FYI, this fuel tank is under the 3rd bunk and floor, starts at the end of the master bed and runs toward the front of the boat. It's under the closet where the washer and dryers seems to be installed on these boats.
- Could not locate the 2 of the 3 bathroom sump pumps...given the water in the bilges it probably just drained there.

- water system had so many leaks we could not keep the water pressure pump on

- 3 new bilge pumps, installation records provided....none worked



I could go on for hours...
Oh yea...the FBI will be looking at us as we keep sending $12,000-15,000 to broker all over the country, and then getting it wired back.....LOL



On to the next one, flying in for a pre-survery on Tuesday morning, I'll let you know how it goes




The Brockerts
The Brockerts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2019, 08:56 AM   #19
Guru
 
Comodave's Avatar
 
City: Au Gres, MI
Country: US
Vessel Name: Never Say Never
Vessel Model: President 41 DC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 5,477
Sorry it went badly. When I buy a boat, I spend at least a day on it by myself, poking around and looking at everything. I make a list of questions and questionable things and have it ready for the surveyor. You may not catch everything but you will catch a lot and know if you should proceed to a survey. Good luck next time.
__________________
Boat Nut:
If you are one there is no explanation necessary.
If you arenít one, there is no explanation possible.
Comodave is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2019, 09:01 AM   #20
Guru
 
tiltrider1's Avatar
 
City: Seattle
Country: USA
Vessel Name: AZZURRA
Vessel Model: Ocean Alexander 54
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,478
Sounds like you are making good decisions.
__________________

tiltrider1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:19 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012
×