FRP Water Tank Access on Californian 42LRC
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Restitution
Senior Member
Nice! Good for you Rob. Just in time for summer.
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Pics? More details please!
Capt Rob
Member
Ok, let's try this again, spent an hour typing all the gruesome details last week tried to attach photos and it all disappeared[emoji23]. I will try again.
Ok, from the beginning. I bought this boat with a quarter tank of water a couple of years ago. Ran great on the sea trial. My thought was that the seller wanted the boat to run great which it did. Only problem was it seemed the bilge pump would run when I filled the water tank, I never could find any thing leaking so I figured that when the tank was filled the bow would go down from the weight of the water and the small amount of leakage from the prop shafts over a period of time was being pumped out as the forward bilge pump was at a low point.
As time went on the bilge was always wet, checked exhaust tubing for leaks, checked everything I could think of. Always had plenty of house water.
Finally figured it was a small leak, so if we ran out we will just fire up the water maker!
Couple weeks ago I had the brilliant idea I would disinfect the fresh water system so that was what I did, followed all the instructions and we had the freshest water ever. Rinsed it out a couple times, opened a beer and proceeded to fill the tank. By now it has been a long day and I'm getting ready to relax. At this point I went out to take out the trash.
I happened to look down at the bilge pump discharge and saw a solid stream of water. Of course the tank had decided to let go[emoji24]
TO BE CONTINUED....
Ok, from the beginning. I bought this boat with a quarter tank of water a couple of years ago. Ran great on the sea trial. My thought was that the seller wanted the boat to run great which it did. Only problem was it seemed the bilge pump would run when I filled the water tank, I never could find any thing leaking so I figured that when the tank was filled the bow would go down from the weight of the water and the small amount of leakage from the prop shafts over a period of time was being pumped out as the forward bilge pump was at a low point.
As time went on the bilge was always wet, checked exhaust tubing for leaks, checked everything I could think of. Always had plenty of house water.
Finally figured it was a small leak, so if we ran out we will just fire up the water maker!
Couple weeks ago I had the brilliant idea I would disinfect the fresh water system so that was what I did, followed all the instructions and we had the freshest water ever. Rinsed it out a couple times, opened a beer and proceeded to fill the tank. By now it has been a long day and I'm getting ready to relax. At this point I went out to take out the trash.
I happened to look down at the bilge pump discharge and saw a solid stream of water. Of course the tank had decided to let go[emoji24]
TO BE CONTINUED....
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Capt Rob
Member
continued:
Now, thinking back on the symptoms, constant water in the bilge, no water overflow from the vent line when the tank is full, leads me to think that the tank always was leaking, just a small amount but it was increasing.
Anyway after a long sleepless night
I unholstered the SAZWALL and started cutting.
I just can't stand when something is not working as it should!
Cut a small hole in the top of tank (see photo), found split in bottom side edge, proceeded to cut out another hole in top to check out crack, and than had to cut out the baffle to see the extent of the crack. No fun in small crawl space cutting fiberglass but it had to be done.
Now that we had determined the extent of the failure we tried to determine cause of failure. The only thing we can think is that the tank corners were not reinforced enough for some unknown reason and not enough support across the bottom leading to flex and oil canning and over a long period led to fatigue.
Darrell (Dr Fiberglass) was really impressed with the engineering, accessibility, fit and finish of the parts of the Californian that were below decks and more than likely never to be seen.
Kudos to Marshall and the guys in Tustin! Circa 1988.
I had thought about using a custom bladder to fit in original tank bottom, but due to cost and the probability of the tank bottom breaking totally with the weight of the bladder decided against that scenario.
Part 3...
TO BE CONTINUED...
Now, thinking back on the symptoms, constant water in the bilge, no water overflow from the vent line when the tank is full, leads me to think that the tank always was leaking, just a small amount but it was increasing.
Anyway after a long sleepless night
I unholstered the SAZWALL and started cutting. I just can't stand when something is not working as it should!
Cut a small hole in the top of tank (see photo), found split in bottom side edge, proceeded to cut out another hole in top to check out crack, and than had to cut out the baffle to see the extent of the crack. No fun in small crawl space cutting fiberglass but it had to be done.
Now that we had determined the extent of the failure we tried to determine cause of failure. The only thing we can think is that the tank corners were not reinforced enough for some unknown reason and not enough support across the bottom leading to flex and oil canning and over a long period led to fatigue.
Darrell (Dr Fiberglass) was really impressed with the engineering, accessibility, fit and finish of the parts of the Californian that were below decks and more than likely never to be seen.
Kudos to Marshall and the guys in Tustin! Circa 1988.
I had thought about using a custom bladder to fit in original tank bottom, but due to cost and the probability of the tank bottom breaking totally with the weight of the bladder decided against that scenario.
Part 3...
TO BE CONTINUED...
Comodave
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I will be interested in how you fix this in the end. Good luck.
Capt Rob
Member
Ok, repair, test, shakedown cruise results.
Darrell, (Dr fiberglass) master of FRP and friend, came to the boat and surveyed the damage, and said "no problem, just cut some more out of the top of the tank so I can reach the whole length of the crack, and I need the baffle out also.
Back I crawled in the hole with my trusty sawzall and with my newly discovered protective Tyvek suit, proceeded to cut the top open.
We then dried the inside of the tank, prepped and placed 3 layers of 17 oz. glass Matt and resin. Let harden and fill tank with colored water and check for leaks before fitting the baffle and top parts in place and glassing everything back in place.
After about a week we filled the tank to the top and headed out to sea.
The wind had been blowing, the seas were pretty chopped up (for San Diego), so we got a pretty good test and still no leak.
Once again, these boats are really well made, (I have owned a Viking so I have a boat to compare to), and the tank appears to be well made, so I can't really figure for certain why it originally broke, but if I have any more problems I will let you all know.
Time to go fishing! Mahalo, Rob
Darrell, (Dr fiberglass) master of FRP and friend, came to the boat and surveyed the damage, and said "no problem, just cut some more out of the top of the tank so I can reach the whole length of the crack, and I need the baffle out also.
Back I crawled in the hole with my trusty sawzall and with my newly discovered protective Tyvek suit, proceeded to cut the top open.
We then dried the inside of the tank, prepped and placed 3 layers of 17 oz. glass Matt and resin. Let harden and fill tank with colored water and check for leaks before fitting the baffle and top parts in place and glassing everything back in place.
After about a week we filled the tank to the top and headed out to sea.
The wind had been blowing, the seas were pretty chopped up (for San Diego), so we got a pretty good test and still no leak.
Once again, these boats are really well made, (I have owned a Viking so I have a boat to compare to), and the tank appears to be well made, so I can't really figure for certain why it originally broke, but if I have any more problems I will let you all know.
Time to go fishing! Mahalo, Rob
Comodave
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That is what I would have done. Fiberglass work is pretty easy although messy. If I am not sure how much glass to put in, I just put more in than I think is reasonable. Haven't had any let go yet. My fiberglass guy says I use too much glass, but it is cheap and I don't want to have to go back and redo it. Glas it worked out so well for you.
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Edelweiss
Guru
Still haven't solved my fresh water loss. Strangest thing, used the boat over a weekend, water tank was full on Friday and still over half full, about 80 gal. on Sunday. Came back two weekends later, water tank is empty? Leaking tank or hoses would drain into the bilge, the bilge is empty and pumps haven't run. Fresh water pump and water heater are turned off and no sign of water anywhere. Sink valves weren't left open, so one would think there would be no siphon?
Where the *#%@*+* is the water going.
My neighbors are notorious pranksters
:lol:
But to drain the tank completely, they would need access to the service panel or engine room. Way too much effort for them and besides no beer missing from the fridge.
Where the *#%@*+* is the water going.
My neighbors are notorious pranksters
:lol: But to drain the tank completely, they would need access to the service panel or engine room. Way too much effort for them and besides no beer missing from the fridge.
Capn Craig
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Larry,
Did you leave the water pressure pump turned on? might turn it off next time?
Could it be a leak in a waterline in some obscure place that doesn't drain to the bilge? Your talking about quite a bit of water, I can't believe it could evaporate that quick.
Craig
Did you leave the water pressure pump turned on? might turn it off next time?
Could it be a leak in a waterline in some obscure place that doesn't drain to the bilge? Your talking about quite a bit of water, I can't believe it could evaporate that quick.
Craig
Capn Craig
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Larry, My bad, upon rereading I realized you said the fresh water pump was off.
Edelweiss
Guru
Nope, Pump is turned off and I release the line pressure at the galley sink and then close the valve. Only thing I can think of is some siphon effect into a sink or the overboard tank vent.
Nice 34' sedan with a blue hull and white decks in Cape Sante Marina over the weekend. Looked like fresh paint, Beautiful. Window trim was all white, couldn't tell from a distance if it was painted wood or factory white trim. Maybe it's a later model?
Nice 34' sedan with a blue hull and white decks in Cape Sante Marina over the weekend. Looked like fresh paint, Beautiful. Window trim was all white, couldn't tell from a distance if it was painted wood or factory white trim. Maybe it's a later model?
Last edited:
- Joined
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Larry, I have given this considerable thought and tend to lean toward the prankster explanation. But since you assure us that this is neither practical nor likely, I have but one other possibility as a cause.
Your boat is haunted.
Your boat is haunted.
Edelweiss
Guru
Maybe the spirit of the previous owner? Oh wait. . . . . I am the first owner[emoji15]
Well, then the ghost of my ex wife then and she hated the boat, that works![emoji317]
grahamdouglass
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I have two fresh water tanks on my 1981 Marine Trader. A primary one in the lazarette that receives the water (37"x22"x40"), then drains into the main water tank under the queen bed.
2 years ago the tank in the lazarette had a crack which I fixed with epoxy. It is leaking again and you can hear it buckle and warp when it fills with water. The guy at Industrial Plastics, they deal in fibreglass and epoxy, says that fibreglass tanks age and fail. If you patch leaks it will only crack somewhere else. I'm looking at re&re with a polyethylene tank. Nasty job considering the tight quarters.
2 years ago the tank in the lazarette had a crack which I fixed with epoxy. It is leaking again and you can hear it buckle and warp when it fills with water. The guy at Industrial Plastics, they deal in fibreglass and epoxy, says that fibreglass tanks age and fail. If you patch leaks it will only crack somewhere else. I'm looking at re&re with a polyethylene tank. Nasty job considering the tight quarters.
mattprovence
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Found my fresh water leak
I have a 42’ Californian trawler and have had a fresh water tank leak for about a year. I have searched for the leak countless hours with no luck until I forked out $50.00 on a 30 foot long borescope. I was able to fish it under the tank and sure enough I found the leak. Then the problem was figuring out where the leak was in reference to the tank. I found on my second try (hole!) first try was in the lazarette. From that hole I found the leak was about 24 inches into the bedroom. I cut the floor open. Then I cut another hole in the tank and found the leak. Then with more access to the tank I discovered what caused the leak. Somewhere along the boats long life somebody drilled a through hole and failed to retrieve the trash and somehow it made it way under the tank. Then with the pressure of the water caused a hole. I am thinking it was from the boat builder because there is no place for the big 1 1/2” round hole saw fiberglass piece to work it’s way under there. So I had to cut another hole in the bottom of the tank to get the fiberglass piece out of there. I am going to patch it all up this week. I will be installing two 8” round inspection hatches. That way future problems will be easier to deal with. Then the bottom hole will be patched with west system epoxy and fiberglass.
I have a 42’ Californian trawler and have had a fresh water tank leak for about a year. I have searched for the leak countless hours with no luck until I forked out $50.00 on a 30 foot long borescope. I was able to fish it under the tank and sure enough I found the leak. Then the problem was figuring out where the leak was in reference to the tank. I found on my second try (hole!) first try was in the lazarette. From that hole I found the leak was about 24 inches into the bedroom. I cut the floor open. Then I cut another hole in the tank and found the leak. Then with more access to the tank I discovered what caused the leak. Somewhere along the boats long life somebody drilled a through hole and failed to retrieve the trash and somehow it made it way under the tank. Then with the pressure of the water caused a hole. I am thinking it was from the boat builder because there is no place for the big 1 1/2” round hole saw fiberglass piece to work it’s way under there. So I had to cut another hole in the bottom of the tank to get the fiberglass piece out of there. I am going to patch it all up this week. I will be installing two 8” round inspection hatches. That way future problems will be easier to deal with. Then the bottom hole will be patched with west system epoxy and fiberglass.
Attachments
TG
Senior Member
Nice work Mattprovence. I have a slow leak as well and have tried with little success to scope underneath to find the leak. I did notice some debris under the tank. Maybe I'll take another look.
I wonder if the builder used the scrap through hole to help position the tank while they glassed it to the stringers?
I wonder if the builder used the scrap through hole to help position the tank while they glassed it to the stringers?
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Great find and fix, Matt! What a job!!
Portage_Bay
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Great job! I've got a similar leak in an '83 LRC 42'. When you were working in the tank did you notice if the tanks have baffles? I may want to be lazy, cut a hole, insert a bladder and be done.
mattprovence
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Hey portage_bay. There are baffles in the water tank. I would say they are about every 2 feet. I don’t know how you would get a bladder in that tank. It is so long and with such little access along with the 6-8 baffles. In my pictures above it shows the baffles in pic 2&3.
Portage_Bay
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Thanks Matt. The leaker I'm facing is in fwd tank that runs under the battery bank and gen set. If I'm lucky and it is accessible from the areas not covered by batts and gen it will be simpler than otherwise. In either case it goes on the back burner for now. The boat is new to me and I'm working through the survey list for insurance so I can get out and enjoy the rest of the season.
