Gyro Gale Stabilized KK Manatee

[healhustler]

Since we all know only Manatee owners are reading this, it’s probably safe to share that the bottom shape, shallow draft and initial stability of the Krogen Manatee have made the boat a difficult candidate for installation of fin type stabilizers. There have only been two applications that I know of, one conventional (hydraulically-actuated) set on the recently sold hull #99, and one (pneumatically-actuated) set on hull #71, “Mango Mama”. Both applications were reputed to be successful and reliable, but when I got aboard Mango Mama a couple of years ago, I was particularly impressed with the quickness of the Gyro Gale pneumatic fins. Since then, Gyro Gale has been tuning the system to maximize performance and I think they may have it down pretty good. His system cost was a lot, lot cheaper than the hydraulic units I priced at the time.

Here is the link to the video on YouTube:

https://youtu.be/-lqpxWk_N4w

 

[HiDHo]

I like the hydro-foils better Larry.

 

[sunchaser]

I recently looked at a boat that had a gyro gale setup. A 5 HP electric motor and air cooled compressor were required to provide motive power which in turn required genset operation. After looking at this install, I much prefer a PTO hydraulic stabilizer setup.

 

[timb]

Since we all know only Manatee owners are reading this, i

https://youtu.be/-lqpxWk_N4w

i'm reading it the Manatee next to me is for sale.

 

[healhustler]

I recently looked at a boat that had a gyro gale setup. A 5 HP electric motor and air cooled compressor were required to provide motive power which in turn required genset operation. After looking at this install, I much prefer a PTO hydraulic stabilizer setup.

Yes, I saw that setup as well, but Mango Mama has a belt driven compressor off the main, originally on the standard equipped Volvo 100, but now refitted with a Yanmar 140. I’ll try to get a photo of the unit this afternoon.

 

[Pack Mule]

Larry, not that it matters but can the hyd fins be driven off of the generator? I know some drive their hyd windlass off generator.

 

[sunchaser]

Yes, I saw that setup as well, but Mango Mama has a belt driven compressor off the main, originally on the standard equipped Volvo 100, but now refitted with a Yanmar 140. I’ll try to get a photo of the unit this afternoon.

Larry
As, best I understand the physical size of a larger system's compressor and heat exchanger overwhelm ER space at the head of an engine. The unit I saw was quite large, well designed but it would only fit in the voluminous ER I examined and required a much larger cooling fan setup.

Which is one of reasons that hydraulic drive units via a small PTO are all so common - space. Hydraulic drive PTOs have been around for a very long time in non marine industries and the move to powering stabilizers was and is straightforward. For many, a PTO on a genset is used for "0" speed stabilizer applications.

I've not done the math for power needs of a compressor powered stabilizer setup vs hydraulic. I would guess it would favor hydraulics about 1/2 - 2/3 the energy needed vs air based upon non marine application conversions I've been involved with.

Lastly, keeping the hydraulic oil cool neatly lends itself to the already onboard RW flow for wet exhaust setups.

 

[Fletcher500]

Do you have a link to the product?

I don’t anything about this, so if it is working for people, great.

There is a reason why industry use fluids (non compressible) to move and actuate larger loads, as opposed to pneumatics.

 

[sunchaser]

fletcher
Better to google gyro gale stabilizers and up will come all sorts of interesting stuff, or so I found a few months ago. GG's website itself is the normal self promo. The first air actuated stabilizer I saw was on a mid 70s DeFever. A fascinating setup with the unit itself housed in a water tight small compartment.

 

[stubones99]

A few nice things about pneumatic systems are that you can combine sources (compressor mounted on Engine + compressor mounted on genset) all could charge a tank to be used by the stabilizers. Second is the fact that air is compressible. They act like springs under shock loads compared to the rigidity of hydraulic fins. According to their guy at the boat shows, you can mount several sets on larger boats and even stabilize some of the pitching forces too.
And, when you blow an air-line, you don't have a massive cleanup problem, compared with a hydraulic line spewing oil everywhere in a fine mist.

 

[sunchaser]

I'll keep an eye out for this newly described issue, shock loading of fins. And likewise watch out for the blown hydraulic lines. All is good after 15 years of 100% trouble free service for the Wesmars on our vessel.

What kind of thrusters do you have Stubones99?

 

[stubones99]

I'll keep an eye out for this newly described issue, shock loading of fins. And likewise watch out for the blown hydraulic lines. All is good after 15 years of 100% trouble free service for the Wesmars on our vessel.

What kind of thrusters do you have Stubones99?

Last boat had twins and didn't need thrusters.

 

[sunchaser]

Last boat had twins and didn't need thrusters.

Thanks. The reason I asked was the shock loading on thrusters has at times been an issue dependent upon the quality of the install. Never heard of shock loading on standard design hydraulic thrusters causing issues. Mine move imperceptibly, maybe 1 to 1 1/2 inches

 

[stubones99]

The point I was trying to make was that since hydraulic oil is not compressible, any torque put on the fins has to go to the hull mountings, or the water flows from the high-pressure side around to the low-pressure side of the fin.
With air, it would push back but would give somewhat like a pneumatic spring. It would allow roll in extreme conditions but stress the hull mountings less.

If they require that much air (something I've not studied) where does it bleed off without making a significant racket? I've used pneumatics and hydraulics in other jobs and know both technologies. Air is always less precise, compared to hydraulics.

 

[healhustler]

Here’s a shot taken above the main engine on Mango Mama. Compressor (circled in red) is belt driven off the crank pulley, and mounted to a heavy plate across the stringers. Engine is really smooth, no noticeable vibration from compressor. I didn’t notice any noise from air cylinder actuation, but I also didn’t stand over the machinery space.