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Old 04-30-2013, 07:50 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Marin View Post
Obviously I think the raised pilothouse design is the best recreational-style boat design around. Whether it's a 1940s salmon troller or a brand new Fleming 55, to me the raised pilothouse boats epitomize what I think a boat of this type should look like. The all-on-one-level boats like the deFever 48, all the Grand Banks, etc. just don't do it for me aesthetically.
Raised pilothouse or not, 360-degree visibility from the helmsman's position is needed.

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Old 04-30-2013, 08:12 PM   #22
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We have 360 visibility and like it but what does all this talk of OAs, DeFevers, Coots and Willards have to do w boats similar to the GB 36????
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Old 04-30-2013, 08:16 PM   #23
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So what. One's got to keep watch for passing Sea Rays and their kind.

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Old 04-30-2013, 08:32 PM   #24
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We have 360 visibility and like it but what does all this talk of OAs, DeFevers, Coots and Willards have to do w boats similar to the GB 36????
Marin should be able to answer that.
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Old 04-30-2013, 09:34 PM   #25
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We have 360 visibility and like it but what does all this talk of OAs, DeFevers, Coots and Willards have to do w boats similar to the GB 36????


Nothing really, other than perhaps the GB-type design is perhaps not the best design to be shopping for.

GBs have good visibility to the front and sides, not so much to the rear, particularly if one keeps stuff on top of the aft cabin. The rowing/sailing dinghy that came with our boat lives there and we really like having it even though it pretty much totals good visibility to the rear from inside the cabin. However the helmsperson can lean out the main cabin door and look back so rearward visibility is still pretty good.

Our boat was built with the small rear window in the main cabin to port of the companionway down to the aft cabin in addition to the large opening window to starboard. There is nothing aft of the small window so it's a clear shot to the rear. A number of GB36s were built without this window--- Lord only knows why; it's useful and not having it doesn't offer any advantage that we can see.

Obviously if one likes to drive from the flying bridge then visibility is not an issue but we never drive from up there. But we have never found the less-than-ideal rear visibility to pose any sort of problem so to us it's a non-issue.



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Old 04-30-2013, 09:38 PM   #26
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When Eric mentioned the Europa without the style boards, I got to wondering what one would look like with just standard post-type supports.
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Old 04-30-2013, 10:04 PM   #27
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Another amazing example of Photoshop dexterity. Do you do this for a living? If you don't, you should.

I don't like the look of the "modified" Europa at all. The lack of the wider and "streamlined" side deck supports make the boat look homemade, and by an amateur at that. It's not hideous, it just looks cheap.
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Old 04-30-2013, 10:10 PM   #28
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Strange how subjective aesthetics are. I found the modified look much more pleasing to my eye. I tend to agree with Eric's opinion as they always looked like an afterthought to me.
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Old 04-30-2013, 10:16 PM   #29
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I think they are referred to as fashion plates. Very traditional. I like them. Rather shippy I think.

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Old 04-30-2013, 10:21 PM   #30
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tend to agree with Eric's opinion as they always looked like an afterthought to me.
They can, I'll agree with that. It depends on the overall boat design. On the boat in the photos I think it is not the best treatment of the streamlined side supports on the planet. They do have a bit of an afterthought look to them.

As opposed to a Fleming where the side supports really complement the whole look of the boat in my opinion.
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Old 04-30-2013, 10:52 PM   #31
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A few years ago I posted how I changed my style boards.
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Old 04-30-2013, 10:55 PM   #32
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As opposed to a Fleming where the side supports really complement the whole look of the boat in my opinion.
I agree on the Fleming. Scale is everything. The forward support blends nicely into the Portuguese bridge.

The supports on the original boat above where trying too hard to make the boat look shippy IMO. I liked the altered look of it as it allowed you to see the cabin hiding behind it.
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Old 04-30-2013, 10:59 PM   #33
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A few years ago I posted how I changed my style boards.
I remember. It was a big improvement. Great job.

To be fair, it is really a difficult job to get everything right proportionally on a 36' cruising boat. Because head room and accommodations have to be in line height wise as say a 42' boat, the 36 will usually look a little more ungainly. On the whole I think the 36 Europa models by GB and other builders looked quite nice for their size. It's a lot easier to get good flowing lines like a Fleming with more length to work with. Some of my favorite designs are Feadships, but they have plenty of length to get the design right.
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Old 04-30-2013, 11:03 PM   #34
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A few years ago I posted how I changed my style boards.
Huge improvement in the visual and far better scale. Hard to believe a NA designed that 3 board arrangement. I still think the boat would have had more visual appeal with slender stainless steel supports, but still was vastly improved with your modification Daddyo.
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Old 04-30-2013, 11:05 PM   #35
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I too like the DF46 Marin, haha, but visibility aft from the helm is zero with the addition of the flybridge. Problem solved with a glance aft from either pilothouse door.
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Old 04-30-2013, 11:11 PM   #36
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OK guys they look great a lot of the time on larger boats like the one pictured and a little smaller than that.

They just look clumsy if they are (relative to the rest of the boat) large and visually dominating.

The things that visually need to dominate are sheer lines, fwd cabin shapes, fwd windows, major railings, transom shapes and window shapes.

The Sea Ray that Mark posted is an example of good design and I say that even though I dislike the type. Notice how all the shapes and lines seem to belong to the same boat. Visually a well integrated and balanced design. Large "in your face" "can't miss it" pieces (slabs) of white plastic that aren't related to the rest of the boat are absent.

But most trawlers are probably designed by men more closely related to engineers and mechanical draftsmen that know little about art and even industrial design.

One of my VERY favorite boats is the Nordic Tug and taken as a whole is a very pleasing design but has two visual features I dislike immensely. The fwd cabin just ahead of the wheelhouse windows is a very ugly shape having no grace or class. Fortunately nothing about it draws attention to the eye and it's ugliness is rarely noticed. It's not so much a negative but an opportunity for grace and beauty missed. The other thing I have an issue w is the imitation "smoke stack". I just despise them. Tacked on imitation things are sooo tacky and lacking class I would immediately remove the thing if I was lucky enough to ever get a NT. I really love them ... the boat.
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Old 04-30-2013, 11:26 PM   #37
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To be fair, it is really a difficult job to get everything right proportionally on a 36' cruising boat. Because head room and accommodations have to be in line height wise as say a 42' boat, the 36 will usually look a little more ungainly.
Great point Don and something I learned firsthand this weekend. I looked at a couple of GB36's and even had one under contract at one point several months ago even though the boat felt really "busy" to me.

I had the opportunity to go aboard Ray's GB42 Saturday evening and found the solution to the 36's busy interior. 6 more feet of space relaxed the entire feel of what I felt was a busy interior on the 36. The extra beam helped too.
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Old 04-30-2013, 11:29 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by healhustler View Post
When Eric mentioned the Europa without the style boards, I got to wondering what one would look like with just standard post-type supports.
Wouldn't it look like the IG 32 Europa?
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Old 04-30-2013, 11:40 PM   #39
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I had the opportunity to go aboard Ray's GB42 Saturday evening and found the solution to the 36's busy interior. 6 more feet of space relaxed the entire feel of what I felt was a busy interior on the 36. The extra beam helped too.
I agree with that completely, and it's probably why (IIRC) the GB42 is the most numerous of the different GB sizes sold over the years.

However, in our various exercises over the years of drawing up pro-and-con lists and price comparisons of moving to a larger boat, we concluded that since we have a 36, moving to a 42 would make little sense. We would gain something but not enough to warrant the cost and hassle of the change in boats.

So.... if we were to change to a larger GB, which is a possibility perhaps, it would be to the 46. We've been on several with an eye to buy and they make a 42 seem small and cramped despite the addition of "just" 4 feet. The two-forward-stateroom-with-down-galley-and-aft-cabin "Classic" version of the 46 is fantastic in terms of usable space. The original version, that is, with the step down cockpit. The later version with the one-level main deck is not worth bothering with in our opinions.

It has always surprised us how much the addition of just a few feet can make to the usability of a boat.
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Old 04-30-2013, 11:49 PM   #40
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Thanks for those kind remarks, Marin. Meanwhile, I had to stop looking at the two examples for a while and then come back on line to actually get an objective view of the boat with and without the style boards. True, they do look a bit bunched up when used on a 36, but it can get much worse than that. A year or so ago, another guy with a Manatee was kicking around the idea of extending his hardtop over the boat deck, and asked me to Photoshop some Europa style boards as supports. After he saw the outcome, he abandoned the idea.
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