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Old 07-27-2016, 01:48 AM   #1
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Thumbs up Any other Bayliner 38xx owners here?

Or 32xx owners? Or maybe 45xx/47xx pilothouse owners?

I recently bought a 1989 Bayliner 38xx "fast trawler"...I feel like I stumbled onto quite a gem of a trawler-style yacht. (I've been a fan of the Mainship 34's for quite a few years...but they were just not *quite* big enough.) The 38xx's have twin engines (175hp diesels made by Hino, a prior Toyota subsidiary), two staterooms, two heads, one shower/tub, full galley, forward and aft AC/heat, roomy aft cockpit with transom door, large flybridge with a lot of seating. I'm about 1.5 months into ownership of this boat, and I am really happy with it.



Cheers,
Dave
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Old 07-27-2016, 02:48 AM   #2
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Hi, Dave,

There are a few of the Bayliner 38xx models on TF, but your biggest source of info on those boats will be the Bayliner Owners Club (baylinerownersclub.org) .

That site is a great resource on all things Bayliner, and it is extremely active.

Peter
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Old 07-27-2016, 02:50 AM   #3
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There are several 4788/490 owners here.

Welcome aboard!!!
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Old 07-27-2016, 08:25 AM   #4
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Dave,

Congrats on your purchase. I have a 3288. As Peter said the BOC has a wealth of knowledge on info specific to both the Bayliner and Hino brand. This site is great for info on non brand specific boat issues. This site is also a great source of info on the cruising lifestyle as a high percentage of the members actually use their boats for coastal/near shore/ICW/inland river cruising.

John
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Old 07-27-2016, 03:21 PM   #5
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Yup, got it! I've gotten to know several of the folks on BOC already...great resource.

Doesn't hurt to make even more friends though.

Cheers,
Dave
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Old 07-27-2016, 03:25 PM   #6
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There are several 4788/490 owners here.

Welcome aboard!!!
Thanks...I haven't been on one of the pilothouse models yet, but I have a feeling I'd love the layout. Who knows, a 45xx pilothouse might be my next boat, although I'm pretty sure I'll get quite a few enjoyable years out of this 38xx first.

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Dave
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Old 08-04-2016, 09:28 AM   #7
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Dave: Thanks for posting about this new-to-you Bayliner. It's a handsome sedan and seems to have been sensibly equipped. The Hinos (apparently common in that vintage of 38xx) are a bit of a question mark to me. I have zero experience with the brand, and don't think I've ever known anyone who does. OTOH, I've heard nothing critical about them. The fact that they are uncommon along my stretch of waterfront suggests that parts may be scarce. I'll be asking around.

Over the past couple of years I've petted a number of "trawler-style" yachts. Nothing that is priced where I feel comfortable has lined up with my needs, and vice-versa. My surveyor has been gently nudging me to take a look at diesel sedan cruisers, and I'm beginning to do so. Your experience is encouraging, and Kevin Sanders who often posts on this Forum is a persuasive advocate for the Bayliner marque. I look forward to learning more, and hope you'll continue to share as you accumulate time with yours.

If you wander on down Jacksonville way this winter, let me hear from you.
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Old 08-04-2016, 10:29 AM   #8
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Hey...Jacksonville, NC or Jacksonville, FL?

I was initially a little skeptical of the Hino engines (Hino is or was a Toyota subsidiary...they still make diesel trucks). The folks on BaylinerOwnersClub.org know these boats and their Hino diesels REALLY well. Hino parts won't be stocked locally, but they are certainly available, so I don't think there's any big worries there (although you'll certainly find local mechanics that will tell you it's a crisis situation and you have to let them repower your boat for $50K ...whatever). The Hino EH-700's have sleeved cylinders and are rebuildable in-place. The manicoolers (manifold heat-exchangers) are expensive (about $5K each), but (as I understand it) do a little extra maintenance and they'll last without failing. The risers will eventually fail (they always do on all boats at some point), so just plan for a $3K expenditure to replace them every 5-7 years or so if you're in salt water, or buy the stainless ones that'll last even longer.

I looked at four of these 38xx's before buying this one...in the three I sea-trialed, the Hino EH-700 engines all ran great. On the first one I sea-trialed, there was a failed exhaust riser that was leaking water on the starboard engine, oil leaking from both oil filter assemblies on both engines, and coolant leaking from a hose on the port engine (it had been seriously neglected for 5+ years). The engines started right up with only a few spins in 20-degree weather, and on sea-trial the yacht ran up to 18 knots in rough water and heavy winds even with oil, coolant, and water spurting from both engines (the boat had nothing on it to weigh it down, and had just had the bottom and props cleaned), and they never even thought about overheating. Folks claim the Hino's are pretty bulletproof engines, and my experiences so far are that it's a true statement.

I also have not seen any problems on any of these boats with the hulls...they are as solid as the engines. The one problem that I have seen is the flybridge deck getting soft spots from water ingress, and the radar arch getting some core rot. Both those are fixable, especially if caught and handled early. (The neglected one I mentioned above had a flybridge that I would have fallen through if I had jumped on it!) This isn't anything isolated to these boats however...plenty of 80-ish trawlers have soft spots that have to be repaired or radar arches that have to be fixed or replaced.

Several of my dock neighbors have gotten a tour...the response has been the same...."That's a lot of room for a 38 foot boat". Bayliner did a fabulous job with the interior layout, as they are known to do on larger boats.

The 32XX's were pretty popular too and a lot of room for the size (2 staterooms also, but both smaller)...they are a much lower price generally (from what I saw, they average around $20-25K vs. $40-45K), but most of them have gasoline engines instead of diesels...however, I did spot a few diesels out there. I think the 38xx's were the "sweet spot" though...big enough to be really roomy and comfortable, but still small enough to be manageable and affordable to buy and maintain.

Cheers!
Dave
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Old 08-04-2016, 10:57 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by Blissboat View Post
Dave: Thanks for posting about this new-to-you Bayliner. It's a handsome sedan and seems to have been sensibly equipped. The Hinos (apparently common in that vintage of 38xx) are a bit of a question mark to me. I have zero experience with the brand, and don't think I've ever known anyone who does. OTOH, I've heard nothing critical about them. The fact that they are uncommon along my stretch of waterfront suggests that parts may be scarce. I'll be asking around.

Over the past couple of years I've petted a number of "trawler-style" yachts. Nothing that is priced where I feel comfortable has lined up with my needs, and vice-versa. My surveyor has been gently nudging me to take a look at diesel sedan cruisers, and I'm beginning to do so. Your experience is encouraging, and Kevin Sanders who often posts on this Forum is a persuasive advocate for the Bayliner marque. I look forward to learning more, and hope you'll continue to share as you accumulate time with yours.

If you wander on down Jacksonville way this winter, let me hear from you.
Hinos are a solid engine, and part availability is decent. In addition, there is a gent named Earl Summerville that makes a yearly trip around the country repairing Hinos. He is a factory trained Hino tech, and his website is www.baylinerguru.com .
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Old 08-04-2016, 11:10 AM   #10
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Good info, Dave - thanks. I'm in Jacksonville Beach, Florida, by the way. Guess I ought to update my TF profile.

So were the Hinos in the three boats you sea-trialed all naturals (as opposed to turbos)? Yours, at 175 hp, are apparently naturals. To me that's way more than adequate for cruising at trawler speeds, while still offering a nice turn of speed in reserve if it looks smart to sprint ahead of some weather, for example.

Your point taken about parts. A prudent mariner maintains an inventory of essential spares, and there's always FedEx.

It's hard to tell from the photo of your boat, or from brokerage photos on line - do those wet exhausts discharge on the sides of the stern?
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Old 08-04-2016, 11:27 AM   #11
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Yup...I think big displacement, slow-turning, naturally-aspirated diesels are the way to go, at least for these boats. You can run at trawling speed all day long without any worries about building up soot in a turbo, and then you can scurry home a little quicker if needed. If you need/want to run faster than 15 knots or so, it's the wrong boat for that purpose. The later models did have 210hp turbocharged versions of the same engine (1990+), and you'll see a few that were repowered with 210hp Cummins B-series diesels (I don't think any 38xx came stock with those engines, but I could be wrong). The later 45xx's and 47xx's often had Cummins diesels stock.

Yup, the wet exhausts expel to each side of the stern (generator expels just inside of the port main engine exhaust). Mine hasn't had a valve adjustment in 20 years (to my understanding...gonna engage Earl mentioned above to do that, plus some other maintenance), and there's still no soot on the stern. The engines are pretty loud if you open the door on the engine room (in the cockpit...clackin' away like any good diesel would)...but the engine room is pretty well-insulated and underway all you hear is the low rumble...it'll actually put you to sleep.

The transmission tags are long gone from mine, but I suspect the stock transmissions that were 2.04 ratio have been replaced with the 2.53 ratio transmissions...mine is slower than it should be at various rpm's (although bottom and prop cleaning, and load are also factors...the engines spin up just fine, so I'm pretty sure it's not the engines...mine moves just like one I sea-trialed that had 2.53 ratio transmissions...I knew this when I bought mine though). I'm not too worried about that though....I may look at repitching the props a bit (stock is 20x21 pitch, and I should be able to go up to 20x23 pitch with the lower engine-to-prop gear ratio), but in the meantime the engines aren't running very hard/seeing much load. The engines may be bulletproof, but they are also 27 years old...I'd prefer to run them gently, at least until I've gotten to know everything on the boat really well.

I've only had this boat for a little over a month, but have taken it around 300 miles so far, and spent almost half of July on it...so far, I'm lovin' it. Every boat is a compromise of some sort...this one is the right set of compromises for me.

Cheers,
Dave
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Old 08-13-2016, 01:16 PM   #12
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My surveyor has been gently nudging me to take a look at diesel sedan cruisers, and I'm beginning to do so.
Since I have started looking into diesel motor yachts direction, I am interested to hear the reasoning your surveyor uses while doing the nudging.
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Old 08-14-2016, 11:29 PM   #13
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Since I have started looking into diesel motor yachts direction, I am interested to hear the reasoning your surveyor uses while doing the nudging.
Here’s the context: I’ve looked at a lot of “trawler” style yachts that fit my criteria, e.g., fiberglass, forty feet in length more or less; single diesel (for several good reasons); split stateroom arrangement (to accommodate two couples at times); draft NTE five feet (ideally less); ready egress from the lower helm to the side deck (for ease of singlehanded or shorthanded docking / locking); salty enough to transit a lake or sound on a lively day, and some other lesser specifications. Everything on offer at prices I feel comfortable paying is a compromise among these standards, and is also to one degree or another a project with unknowable contingencies.

For example, a handsome and well-built trawler yacht of mid-1970s vintage with a reliable single diesel looks good in most respects except the original steel fuel tanks have been painted, with the paint peeling away along the bottom inch or so, and visible external rust is gazing out from behind the paint flakes. In another example, a similar 1970s-vintage trawler-style boat, whose builder name rhymes with “lamb shanks,” has had its original teak decks removed and the under-laying deck covered with fiberglass. The fuel and water deck fills stand proud by a toe-jamming 3/8 inch, and a visible seam appears to be ever-so-slightly open around the entire deckhouse.

I want to do coastal overnights, week or two cruises to somewhere and back here to Jacksonville, extended weekends up and down the Atlantic and Gulf ICWs, and eventually do the Loop. Most times I’ll be in protected or near-coastal waters, but sometimes I’ll be nearly touching bottom in some remote cove, or getting beaten up crossing Albemarle Sound, or Lake Erie.

My surveyor points out that if I can get past the less-than-salty looks of diesel motor cruisers, and can accept the twin engines that are conventional among that class, then my universe of prospective boats is greatly increased, and I’m more likely to find something in good condition and reasonably priced, that can be run efficiently at trawler speeds and otherwise do what I want to do. Besides (as has been said approximately 100,000 times on this Forum), with twins an engine failure just means inconvenience, rather than stranding or a tow.

Ergo, my willingness to look at the Bayliner 38xx and its kind.

Last weekend I spent an hour aboard such a Bayliner, a late-1980s 3877 with twin Hino naturals. There is a lot to like about that boat: deep cockpit, nicely proportioned Down East profile, big foredeck, two comfortable staterooms and two heads, comfortable salon and galley, shallow draft, and reliable systems. There are show-stoppers however, at least for me: precariously narrow side decks with no direct egress to said decks from the lower helm, and not a lot to hold onto out on that expansive foredeck while wrangling the anchor in a pitching sea. Added to that a tight engine compartment affording limited access to both sides of both main engines (and very narrow access to the front ends of said engines). I know – if you don’t like hot, cramped engine compartments, what are you doing aboard a boat anyway? Still, there are limits and boundaries.

A boat should be 1) safe, 2) reliable, 3) efficient, and 4) good looking, in that order of importance. Primarily because of those disturbingly narrow side decks, the Bayliner checked all the boxes except the most important one, so, with a ruefully admiring look back, my hunt continues.
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Old 08-15-2016, 08:32 AM   #14
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"A boat should be 1) safe, 2) reliable, 3) efficient, and 4) good looking, in that order of importance. Primarily because of those disturbingly narrow side decks, the Bayliner checked all the boxes except the most important one, so, with a ruefully admiring look back, my hunt continues"

I am curious to hear which boat make(s) and model(s) remain on your list as your search continues.....
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Old 08-15-2016, 08:40 AM   #15
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Blissboat my wife and I are going through similar problems looking for our next boat. We both want a lower helm with side door. A cockpit would be ideal but could do without. Single or twin engines doesn't matter other than better access with the single. One other thing my wife wants is 2 heads. Not many boats around that fit our criteria. But we'll be in Florida for 5 or 6 weeks soon and will be seriously searching.
We plan to do up to a month or so aboard with local couple day cruises so want something large enough to be comfortable with occasional guests. 40' give or take couple feet is our sweet spot. We did look at a Bayliner 38xx but felt the salon area was too tight. Also the side decks were too tight. So the search continues.
Good luck in your search.
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Old 08-15-2016, 07:06 PM   #16
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My surveyor points out that if I can get past the less-than-salty looks of diesel motor cruisers, and can accept the twin engines that are conventional among that class, then my universe of prospective boats is greatly increased, and I’m more likely to find something in good condition and reasonably priced, that can be run efficiently at trawler speeds and otherwise do what I want to do. Besides (as has been said approximately 100,000 times on this Forum), with twins an engine failure just means inconvenience, rather than stranding or a tow.
Blissboat,

Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I have similar specifications in mind as you do for a future boat and came to a conclusion that a recent motor yacht may be more practical for my purposes than a "lamb shanks" trawler at similar price.

Some things that I have doubts about are: 1) unprotected propellers; 2) rudder miniature replicas designed for high speed must be ineffective at displacement speeds (making back to a slip with one engine will heavily rely on a thruster); 3) an autopilot will probably be ineffective with the small rudders at low speeds too; 4) high freeboard amidship should make it very difficult to dock the boat without assistance.

On the other hand, a typical motor yacht aft cabin is very good for liveability, and I plan to live aboard full time. I don't want to sleep with my head next to an anchor roller, which is what you usually have to do in a typical traditional trawler of that size, although some of them come with aft cabins.
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Old 09-19-2016, 11:31 PM   #17
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...We did look at a Bayliner 38xx but felt the salon area was too tight. Also the side decks were too tight. So the search continues.
Ya know, just tossing out a thought, but you might want to take a look at a Bayliner 4588 (the pilothouse model)...the styling is a little less "Down East", but the salon is huge, the galley is up, you don't need side-decks as much because there are pilothouse doors on both sides to get to the bow, and you've also got a set of steps up to the flybridge (don't have to climb the ladder in the cockpit), plus 2.5 staterooms, 2 heads, 2 showers. It's pretty darned nice boat (although the price will more than a 38xx of course). The newer Bayliner 3988 is somewhere between those two models, and the even newer 3788 is equipped quite well (these are planing boats though, not really trawlers)...the interior layouts on both of those are really live-able. (Those last two have the Cummins 6BTA diesels stock instead of Hino's, if I'm not mistaken. It's easier to find Cummins mechanics vs Hino mechanics...the only drawback I can see is that the Cummins don't have sleeved cylinders and can't be rebuilt in-place, where the Hino's are sleeved and can be rebuilt in-place.)

Whatever you get, get what fits how you will use it. Best of luck!

Dave

HTH,
Dave
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Old 10-24-2016, 12:44 PM   #18
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I have a 1989 3888 here in the L.A. Area, Alamitos Bay. Twin Hino NA 175hp diesels. It's not the biggest, baddest boat at the dock but it's comfortable, reliable and efficient. I'd put it in the coastal cruiser category and that's what we do with her. At 5-6 kts we get almost 2nmpg with both screws turning. The boat will easily cruise on one engine at that same speed for increased efficiency. The AP will steer the boat no problem during one engine cruising. Top speed with full FB enclosure and a 400lb dink carried by a Seawise davit on the swim step yields 16-17 kts. Inside, the boat is very comfortable. Upgrades like an apartment size refer, diesel heat,corian counter top in the galley and electric flush heads have made a huge difference in the liveability.
Regarding the comments about safety of exterior travel along the gunnels, although not the widest of areas there are plenty of hand rails for safe passage unless in a rough ocean during which time why would one need to get to the bow? An alternative approach to the anchor is through the forward hatch which can be had by standing on the forward berth bed.
It's always a trade off in design, wider gunnels means less interior space. At this point I'll take the interior space.
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Old 10-24-2016, 04:05 PM   #19
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