Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 05-20-2019, 03:41 PM   #1
Member
 
City: madisonville la
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Princess M
Vessel Model: 2006 Mainship 34
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 16
Toilet smell

Purchased a MS 34 T two years ago. The toilet had a smell when flushed.
The smell got better briefly when I back flushed the raw water intake with a hose. When smell returned I changed the raw water intake hose. This stopped the smell for about 6 mo. but has now returned. Since purchase I have been in fresh water if that makes a difference. I assume the smell is coming from the walls of the raw water hose. Is there a hose with a special lining to prevent a smelly substance from attaching to the hose walls etc. Help!
__________________
Advertisement

keith c is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2019, 04:02 PM   #2
Guru
 
dhays's Avatar
 
City: Gig Harbor
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Kinship
Vessel Model: North Pacific 43
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 7,984
Keith, do you notice any difference in the smell between the first flush when you go to the boat vs after a couple of flushes when the boat is being used?
__________________

__________________
Regards,

Dave
SPOT page
dhays is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2019, 04:08 PM   #3
Guru
 
Comodave's Avatar
 
City: Au Gres, MI
Country: US
Vessel Name: Never Say Never
Vessel Model: President 41 DC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,567
If it smells bad by the head after the first flush and then gets better it is from the stagnant water sitting in the water intake hose from the seacock to the head. The real fix is to go to a freash water flush head. The micro organisms die while sitting in the intake hose due to lack of oxygen then they decay ans start to smell. If the smell is coming out of the holding tank vent then the cause is usually lack of oxygen in the holding tank. Remove any filter in the vent hose and try to get more air into the tank and the smell will go away when it has enough oxygen.
Comodave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2019, 04:31 PM   #4
TF Site Team
 
Bacchus's Avatar
 
City: Seneca Lake NY
Country: US
Vessel Name: Bacchus
Vessel Model: MS 34 HT Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 2,724
MS 34Ts are notoriously bad for smelly holding tanks due to poor ventilation.
I just did a head rebuild w a impeller / seal kit. Took the whole unit home to flush it well. I was amazed at how much "stuff" came out of the inlet hose and the bowl rim and we are also in fresh water.
I used to get a smell at the head after flush but believe it was at least partially from the holding tank as we could hear s gurgling after flushing and assume the poor vent allowed some tank pressure to push vapors back to the head.
I switched to NoFlex and added a tank bubbler and it made a huge improvement. During layup I figured out how to run a larger / straighter vent from bow to holding tank. Anxious to see if that helps even more.
__________________
Don
2008 MS 34 HT Trawler
"Bacchus"
Bacchus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2019, 04:47 PM   #5
Guru
 
HeadMistress's Avatar


 
City: AR
Country: USA
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,707
Your description of the problem sounds like the problem is originating in the toilet intake line. This should eliminate odor from it: Remove the intake line from the thru-hull (close the seacock first!) and stick it into a bucket of water to which you've added a quart of distilled white vinegar. Flush the entire bucketful through the toilet.

If that doesn't do the trick and especially if you see black flecks in the flush water coming out the rim of the bowl, there has to be some dead and decaying animal or vegetable sea life trapped in the hose or possibly in the channel in the rim of the bowl. Best solution for that will be a new intake hose. A plain ol' Shields or Trident flex PVC (the least expensive sanitation hose) will be fine for this--and btw, the size needed is 3/4". If you continue to see black flecks in the bowl after replacing the hose, the culprit is in the channel in the rim of the bowl...it needs to be flushed out with water under pressure (garden hose nozzle is enough). Unless you want water all over the head, 'twould be a good idea to remove the bowl and put it on the dock to do this. You'll need to replace the bowl seal--which you can get from the toilet mfr--if you don't want it to leak when you put it back.


--Peggie
__________________
2019 Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since '87.
Author "The NEW Get Rid of Boat Odors"
HeadMistress is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2019, 05:23 PM   #6
Member
 
City: madisonville la
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Princess M
Vessel Model: 2006 Mainship 34
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 16
Sorry about toilet spelling. The smell does get a little better after several flushes. I am going with Peggy's idea. Much less work than a hose change which was a temp fix. Also I can remove the tank filter to try that. Thanks for all the suggestions!!
keith c is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2019, 08:29 AM   #7
Guru
 
HeadMistress's Avatar


 
City: AR
Country: USA
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,707
Bacchus, it's usually a simple matter to modify the tank venting to allow more air exchange. Shortening/straightening the vent line, replacing the vent thru-hull with an open bulkhead thru hull, even "upgrading" the vent from the standard 5/8" to 1" or even 1.5" has become a fairly easy job on most tanks thanks to a little gadget called the Uniseal UNISEAL. Every boat is different, even different model years of the same boat, so I won't post "boilerplate" instructions, but I'll be glad to help you or anyone else figure out how best to do it on YOUR boat if you want me to.


--Peggie
__________________
2019 Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since '87.
Author "The NEW Get Rid of Boat Odors"
HeadMistress is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2019, 08:44 AM   #8
Senior Member
 
City: Great Lakes
Country: USA
Vessel Model: OA 440
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 380
If you remove the toilet, you might flip it over and immerse the rim in a vat of white vinegar for a day or two before flushing with rim with fresh water.
Rufus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2019, 08:45 AM   #9
TF Site Team
 
Bacchus's Avatar
 
City: Seneca Lake NY
Country: US
Vessel Name: Bacchus
Vessel Model: MS 34 HT Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 2,724
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeadMistress View Post
Bacchus, it's usually a simple matter to modify the tank venting to allow more air exchange. Shortening/straightening the vent line, replacing the vent thru-hull with an open bulkhead thru hull, even "upgrading" the vent from the standard 5/8" to 1" or even 1.5" has become a fairly easy job on most tanks thanks to a little gadget called the Uniseal UNISEAL. Every boat is different, even different model years of the same boat, so I won't post "boilerplate" instructions, but I'll be glad to help you or anyone else figure out how best to do it on YOUR boat if you want me to.


--Peggie
I did those on a previous boat but Mainship did a very poor job of routing & connecting vents. I have an access plate in the area of fuel fill and FW, fuel & holding tank vents. Only problem is all hose clamps were installed prior to assembling hull to deck and clamps are now "backwards" and screws hidden/unaccessible.
I finally abandoned the holding rank vent and left it in place. Then ran a new, larger hose to a straight thru hull vent placed near the bow so the run is pretty straight to the tank.
__________________
Don
2008 MS 34 HT Trawler
"Bacchus"
Bacchus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2019, 10:22 AM   #10
Veteran Member
 
Pcpete's Avatar
 
City: Mukilteo, WA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Glauben
Vessel Model: 1988 3818 Bayliner
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 51
I installed masterflush fresh water toilets and eliminated the Y valve. Then I repurposed the direct overboard hose to an additional vent for the holding tank. With no quantitative evidence, it seems that everything is working better. No stink at the toilet, pumping out seems faster.
Thanks Peggy!
Pcpete is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2019, 10:59 AM   #11
Guru
 
Heron's Avatar
 
City: Cypress Landing Marina (NC)
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Heron (2)
Vessel Model: '88 Cape Dory 28 Flybridge #115
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,296
Quote:
Originally Posted by Comodave View Post
If it smells bad by the head after the first flush and then gets better it is from the stagnant water sitting in the water intake hose from the seacock to the head. .
I had this problem (Brackish water here). A couple of 1" Bromine tablets in the strainer from a Pool/Spa store (or Amazon) completely cured the problem..
__________________
Steve
Heron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2019, 08:37 AM   #12
Guru
 
wkearney99's Avatar
 
City: Bethesda, MD
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Solstice
Vessel Model: Grand Banks 47 Eastbay FB
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 851
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heron View Post
I had this problem (Brackish water here). A couple of 1" Bromine tablets in the strainer from a Pool/Spa store (or Amazon) completely cured the problem..
Bear in mind you want to limit any exposure of plastics to that stuff. It'll weaken most plastics if they're not designed to be exposed to bromine. This I know from taking ownership of a hot tub that the previous owner misused bromine in it. More is not better.

This holds true for all kinds of cleaners and such when it comes to the fiberglass, plastics and vinyls found in boats. What "works" today turns out to be a nightmare down the road when it causes the materials to fail because of leaching out the things that made the materials work. Always check that any products you use are actually safe for the materials.
__________________
-- Bill Kearney
2005 Eastbay 47 FB - Solstice
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2019, 09:01 AM   #13
TF Site Team
 
Bacchus's Avatar
 
City: Seneca Lake NY
Country: US
Vessel Name: Bacchus
Vessel Model: MS 34 HT Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 2,724
Plastic Hot tub jets very sensitive th Ph... I swear they make them intentionally that way to be a replacement item as other plastic parts in the jets are OK. One piece fails... toss & replace
__________________
Don
2008 MS 34 HT Trawler
"Bacchus"
Bacchus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2019, 09:34 AM   #14
Guru
 
wkearney99's Avatar
 
City: Bethesda, MD
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Solstice
Vessel Model: Grand Banks 47 Eastbay FB
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 851
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bacchus View Post
Plastic Hot tub jets very sensitive th Ph... I swear they make them intentionally that way to be a replacement item as other plastic parts in the jets are OK. One piece fails... toss & replace
While planned obsolescence is always a factor, truth be told it's difficult to make plastic pieces cost-effectively that'll withstand constant immersion in treated hot water. Sure, for lab and factory setups there's options but those are seriously expensive; more than the market will bear for residential hot tub installs.
__________________
-- Bill Kearney
2005 Eastbay 47 FB - Solstice
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2019, 09:34 AM   #15
Guru
 
Woodland Hills's Avatar
 
City: Jacksonville
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Alzero
Vessel Model: Hatteras 63' CPMY
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 752
I thought it was chlorine bleach that was bad for plastic and bromine that was benign.....?
Woodland Hills is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2019, 01:39 PM   #16
Guru
 
HeadMistress's Avatar


 
City: AR
Country: USA
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,707
CLORINE is destructive to rubber as well as plastics...and bleach (sodium hypochlorite) isn't the only type of chlorine...halogen is one, bromine is type of halogen. Hypochlorous acid is yet another type of chlorine. An occasional dose of any of 'em not left in the system very long is one thing, but a "steady diet" of any of 'em is not only destructive to plastics, but highly destructive to rubber. So I'd remove the bromine tabs from your intake strainer and use a bucket of water to which a quart of distilled white vinegar has been added to clean out your intake hose and bowl channel as needed. Or upgrade your toilet to one designed to use pressurized fresh water. Both Raritan and Jabsco offer "conversion" kits that replace everything south of the bowl.



--Peggie
__________________
2019 Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since '87.
Author "The NEW Get Rid of Boat Odors"
HeadMistress is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2019, 07:00 PM   #17
Member
 
Marangal's Avatar
 
City: Sydney
Country: Australia
Vessel Name: Murungal
Vessel Model: Albin 36 Aft Cabin
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 16
Lots of comments on venting the waste holding tank. Very important to install a vent to both port and starboard side. This allows cross ventilation and maintains good levels of oxygen in the tank.

Regards
Marangal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2019, 07:45 PM   #18
Guru
 
dhays's Avatar
 
City: Gig Harbor
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Kinship
Vessel Model: North Pacific 43
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 7,984
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marangal View Post
Lots of comments on venting the waste holding tank. Very important to install a vent to both port and starboard side. This allows cross ventilation and maintains good levels of oxygen in the tank.

Unfortunately, most of us are stuck with what the builder did to begin with. Mine has one vent line that is too small, too long, and had a cowled fitting on the hull. Very common. I have changed the hull fitting to just a simple open mushroom but of course it would be idea to increase the size of the vent line as well as add another one on the opposite side of the boat. However, it would be a pretty challenging task on my boat.

It was frankly much easier (and likely cheaper) for me to add a bubbler to the holding tank for an O2 source.
__________________
Regards,

Dave
SPOT page
dhays is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2019, 08:03 PM   #19
Guru
 
syjos's Avatar
 
City: Gig Harbor
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Sandpiper
Vessel Model: Bluewater 40 Pilothouse Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 621
As Peggy said, with an Uniseal, two larger diameter vent line can be added to almost any holding tank made of plastic or metal. Ports can be bonded to fiberglass. I prefer spin welding fittings to poly tanks but that is dependent on router access to the tank.

Uniseals are very reliable for a long time.
syjos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2019, 08:07 PM   #20
Guru
 
Comodave's Avatar
 
City: Au Gres, MI
Country: US
Vessel Name: Never Say Never
Vessel Model: President 41 DC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,567
Quote:
Originally Posted by dhays View Post
Unfortunately, most of us are stuck with what the builder did to begin with. Mine has one vent line that is too small, too long, and had a cowled fitting on the hull. Very common. I have changed the hull fitting to just a simple open mushroom but of course it would be idea to increase the size of the vent line as well as add another one on the opposite side of the boat. However, it would be a pretty challenging task on my boat.

It was frankly much easier (and likely cheaper) for me to add a bubbler to the holding tank for an O2 source.
A bubbler will do the job extremely well. Have done it on a previous boat with great success.
__________________

Comodave is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:28 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012