Opinions on this Marine Trader 34

[alormaria]

The boat seems in nice shape for what it is. Like most "Jersey Girl"s she seems a little sloppy but a good time.



The bottom looks good except the one spot and that is easily fixed. The decks are already fixed. I like teak decks but I'm in the minority here. The windows look surprisingly good. Window panes are easily and cheaply replaced.



The motor and trans don't have to be rebuilt. Ford Lehmans run forever and their transmissions are simple. Parts are available for everything and if it's frozen don't buy it. You'll find out on the sea trial.



The whole boat is simple. I don't understand the stripper pole but I'd need to see the flybridge in person to make any decision. After having been out in 7 footers I'd have appreciated something to hold on to. MTs of this size don't have a lot of interior hand holds.



The biggest expense would be renting a dumpster to get rid of all the junk inside. Sand the interior down and give it a coat of satin varnish. Power buff the topsides and she'll look like a starlet.



You can spend an extra 20 or 30 thousand for a newer and cleaner boat but most of the same problems will be there. You'll just be 20 to 30 thousand poorer.



Girls like this need to be seen in person. Their personality does not come through in pictures.

 

[Xsbank]

Teak decks? Forgetaboutit.

Unloved? Very much an understatement.

 

[Sunset]

Now Al has my head spinning! lol

 

[psneeld]

Often the pictures don't show the real work needed.... so it could be either way....

More work than most would want to do...or less....

Often the mess gives you the best clue, but as always....there could be a good deal after a thorough trash haul and cleaning is performed.

This pic makes me really wonder...

 

[SeaMoose]

As one who has restored a 76...

There are only two kinds of these boats. Ones that have rotted decks, rotted houses, and rotted cabin tops, often with leaking tanks... and those that have all of that fixed, and are grossly overpriced. I have $65K in mine and countless hours of my labor. It's worth maybe $25K.


At RT noted the support post. Here's what it will take to fix the rot in the roof:

http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s32/recoring-cabin-roof-seeking-advice-35362.html

What I find most telling is the lack of deck photos. Rotted deck coring is all but guaranteed on a 77. A few pictures of what it probably looks like are here:

http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s3/show-us-your-rot-porn-40078.html

From the brokers description they tore off the teak but did not replace the core. This will result in considerable flex that will result in the lower part of the house rotting, as the flex creates cracks in the skin.

The other illness these boats suffer is a leaking aft coupling as a result of poor shaft alignment or just wear. Fixable but you need a pro, and the fix will set you back $2K, if it needs a shaft log, $3K. If you put the boat in the water and water wells up from beneath the engine, that's what's wrong. The keel is hollow - filled with gravel - so when the aft coupling leaks the keel fills with water, and when it hits the false bottom it has nowhere else to go. Driving around with a keel full of water costs you about a knot.

All that being said, there are many things to like about these boats:

If you can work under cover - in a building is best - just about everything is fixable, and doesn't require extreme skills or tools just money and time. How many years do you want to spend working on it .vs. using it?

They have a fantastic layout for a 34' boat

Walk around decks are great to have, especially when docking.

The Lehman is practically bulletproof if you don't over heat it.

The boat rides well in choppy seas, as it's heavy.

Fuel usage is amazing.

The hull on these is about an inch thick solid glass below the waterline, and 1/2 thick above. The house and decks are sh*t but the hull is extremely tough.

There are a huge number of these, so it's easy to find knowledgeable owners who can help.

If you pull the trigger I have pictures of every nook and cranny opened up for repair, as I've had mine 20 years. And I'm STILL working on it...

 

[alormaria]

I've had mine for 25 years and I'm still working on her too.



Everyone who has a boat works on them. Even the ones who just write checks.



There are a million things that have gone wrong and million more waiting to go wrong.


While we are here talking something is breaking on my boat.



It's the same with any boat.


Buy the ticket take the ride.

 

[alormaria]

I just saw an advertisement for a 34' trawler that's a year older.



It's only $84K.


It looks nice.


But does it look $64K nicer?


You would have to go and see.

 

[SeaMoose]

I've had mine for 25 years and I'm still working on her too.

Everyone who has a boat works on them. Even the ones who just write checks.

There are a million things that have gone wrong and million more waiting to go wrong.

While we are here talking something is breaking on my boat.

It's the same with any boat.


Buy the ticket take the ride.

Thanks I should have said "After 20 years I'm still doing STRUCTURAL repair" which is not at all normal, having owned 4 boats in the plus 30' range over the years.

 

[poczatek]

I have the same boat, except mine in a 1974, yet most everything is the same. Mine may have been in a little worse condition, but similar when I bought it last year. I had to replace most of the teak wood in the super structure; i.e. from the hell up. decks, wall, windows, etc. I have some paint blistering on the upper to deal with also; electric panel near the helm also needs total update or replacement. the lehman diesel is a great engine and from what I understand will go 10k hours and beyond if maintained properly. I also need to replace the propeller shaft support in the rear cabin, i.e. under the floor near the steps. Check that to see if it is securely mounted or missing. I paid less than you are looking at, but I would say I've spend at least several hundred hours just replacing the decks, walls and other teak wood. I replaced with 3/4" Marine plywood rather than teak. I'm not sure if that was a good or bad choice, but I'm happy with it. No doubt, $10-20K to update so far and about 3/4 done. A lot more work than I expected, but is usually what happens on old boats. The engine is probably worth most of the value of the boat so a survey or a good exam by an experience diesel mech. should be considered. also, my boat has a hydraulic steering update; so you want to be sure what you have is in good condition. I filled the bilge with water to looks for leaks in the shafts also, turned out good thankfully. I could go on and on, but if you have any particular questions, I'll try to give you my opinion as I have dug into almost every aspect of the boat and learned a lot. I'm determined to finish, but if I were to do it again, I would look for a full fiberglass hull and upper. "look for evidence of water leaking and if it has leaked, most likely your looking at replacing a lot of wood." Jump on the decks, tap on the walls, especially around, mostly under the windows. if you hear that soft thump sound, or movement, well, you probably know. Replacement is on the horizon. Anyway, the Marine trader 34 is a good cruiser, live aboard, as far as I'm concerned. You can see my boat on my page here. That is what it looked like when I bought it. Oh, my outside teak was varnished or finished with some sort of finish which I've had to sand off and redo with teak oil. another couple of weeks to do that. FUN. Gota Love it.

 

[Sunset]

You can see my boat on my page here. That is what it looked like when I bought it.

No link, can you repost it?

So, considering Mr. Firefly's points, we were cruising the local marinas today looking to see if we could find that Mainship. No luck, but we stumbled across this sweet thing that seems to offer everything I want and need, including a thruster, windlass, and best of all, a custom double bed in the aft cabin:
https://kingstonyachtsales.com/boat_listing.php?id=989

And it sits in the water less than 45 miles from me. Now to figure out how to cobble together the do-re-mi! I think it might be good enough to have addressed most of the issues raised here, to the extent that costly fixes will mostly be of the optional type. Maybe. It certainly looks well cared for and fully operational dockside. End of season, maybe I can knock the price down by $5K.

Does this make more sense?

 

[boatpoker]

No link, can you repost it?

So, considering Mr. Firefly's points, we were cruising the local marinas today looking to see if we could find that Mainship. No luck, but we stumbled across this sweet thing that seems to offer everything I want and need, including a thruster, windlass, and best of all, a custom double bed in the aft cabin:
https://kingstonyachtsales.com/boat_listing.php?id=989

And it sits in the water less than 45 miles from me. Now to figure out how to cobble together the do-re-mi! I think it might be good enough to have addressed most of the issues raised here, to the extent that costly fixes will mostly be of the optional type. Maybe. It certainly looks well cared for and fully operational dockside. End of season, maybe I can knock the price down by $5K.

Does this make more sense?

If you decide to go ahead with this do yourself a favour and don't hire a surveyor from the Kingston area. Suggest you try John Bond AMS from Coburg, one over the very best around.

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. S. Well, if you have the money burning a hole in your pocket that vessel makes infinitely more sense and she does show well. As mentioned, get a good survey and MOST IMPORTANTLY!!!!!!! Do NOT get emotionally involved!!! Now is the time to be pragmatic and rational. Crunch your numbers and be realistic.


Cost of boat+cost of insurance+winterization and storage+10% to 20% (at least) contingency fund+++...= Can you comfortably afford this boat?

 

[alormaria]

She has her mascara and rouge on alright and her stocking seams are straight. She might even be worth double her sister ship. Only you can decide.



I do like what they did with the aft cabin (ahem) double bunk. I was thinking along those lines myself. The original design looks great in pictures but comes up short in reality.

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. a. Well, the first thing I noticed about that custom aft berth was you're going to really bonk your head in the middle of the night until you get used to sleeping under the overhang...Just sayin'

 

[SeaMoose]

That boat has clearly had most, if not all of the original plywood in the house replaced which is what you want. Love the cushion in the engine room...

 

[BruceK]

..first thing I noticed about that custom aft berth was you're going to really bonk your head in the middle of the night until you get used to sleeping under the overhang..'

We`ve a similar overhang, a memory develops in 1 or 2 hits.
It looks a very well kept and updated boat, has it been kept under cover? Windows still in varnish after 40 years! Sometimes it`s better to pay more initially, for something really good which someone else put heart soul and wallet into. But how good remains the big question, even guided by surveys.Is it a masterful detail job,or a well kept boat? I suspect the latter.
With boats you know need work, the work usually costs way more than you budget for.

 

[SoWhat]

Clearly a project boat. I am a full year into my 1985 project boat. Estimate another year to completion. And I am retired. The lehman looks original. Mine were also original. ie nothing was ever replaced. I am slowly rebuilding the fuel system, getting rid of corroded and pinched copper lines, all new heat exchangers and coolers, adding dual racors to each fuel tank, rebuilding exhaust system, new elbow's, new waterlift mufflers, new hose, rebuilding the raw water system, new pumps, new filters, new hose, etc etc etc.

The most time consuming part was the hours days weeks of sanding. Burned out 2 DOA sanders and 2 dremels so far. Getting rid of the anti fouling paint and putting on a barrier coat was good for several months. Know a lot more about fiberglass than I ever wanted to know. I haven't started on the brightwork yet. Or the interior. or the topsides. or the electronics. Haven't started on all the broken tabbing on the transverse stringers I discovered while cleaning the bilges for the first time since 1985.

I enjoy most of it. I like the boat and I'm looking forward to many long journeys. I paid next to nothing for it so I'm way ahead of the cost curve. Way behind on the time curve. My life may depend upon the integrity of the boat so it's not a pink lipstick job.

The MT does appear to have nice bones, but when your'e done it is still a 75. Not sure I'd offer much more than 5K for it. And I'd get someone out to check for core rot. Thats a deal breaker.

 

[sunchaser]

A question not asked but obvious, do you want to cruise or perform endless project boat work? Not everybody likes to cruise. Some much prefer rebuilding a boat.

Also do you have a heated indoor shed for the colder months?

 

[Sunset]

These last two posts are obviously commenting on the messy MT in my original post. They reinforce my decision, based on the comments in this thread, to move on to a more finished project. I do not know if I can remove the emotional side of the equation, as urged by The Firefly, but I will make the effort by taking a cold-eyed approach to finances and survey. I am moving closer to the modern era from my current vessel (j/k), and I do have some experience in upgrading a free-love era diesel project. Upgraded or replaced: electrical throughout, solar, battery bank, refer, davits, windlass, hull polish, summer dockage and winter storage, yada yada. Learned to love the thick 70s fibreglass from that era.

Trying to get the damn broker to get back to me so I can take a good look at the MT34 we discovered on the weekend.

One question: does everybody stand the entire time while at the saloon helm? I would tend to use that position in stormy and steamy weather. But there doesn't ever seem to be a helm seat there.

Second question: just how cool is that Marine Trader badge on the bridge facing?

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. S. That's the stuff, cool and collected. A good survey should provide a proper reality check, either positive or negative.

Regarding the lower helm. I can't stand for any length of time so piloting from the lower station would be painful for me. The good thing is there is a locker just aft of the wheel and a I'm sure a simple elegant seating solution can be affixed to that locker which will provide a comfortable perch.



In the immortal words of Jasper Friendly Bear..."Stay calm, Be brave, Wait for the signs".

 

[Sunset]

Andrea and I are going to see it with the broker on Sunday. Broker seems personable - as I guess you would have to be - so we'll see if he's an "honest broker.". I suggested that I would like the owner to be along since he (Broker) probably didn't actually know shite about the particular boat - he didn't take offence, but claimed he had spent 7 months on the same model in the Caribbean and knew more than I might think about this type of vessel. So that's good. He says that the side decks have been redone and they are good, but there he perceived a soft spot indicating some delamination on the flybridge. His POV: live with it, just get on with the cruise! Depending on what the surveyor thinks about the extent of it I will probably adopt a similar approach. Generally speaking.

Hafta sell my Albin though.

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. S. "Hafta sell my Albin though." $$-?

 

[Sunset]

Thinking around $18k Cdn (with a 25% discount to 'Murricans cause I'm nice). I don't know how I could post my just-completed feature sheet which is in wordpad. If anyone cares, I could send it along to them (plural )
Or I could cut/paste it here as text I guess.

 

[boatpoker]

I've lost track ..... is it a Mainship 34 or an MT 34 you are going to look at ?
If you send me a PM with an email address and the year/model you are interested in, I'll send you a pdf of the soldboats.com data

 

[Sunset]

What the heck:

1976 Albin 25 DeLuxe "Manatee"

Basics

LOA 25 ft
Width 8.5 ft
Engine VP MD17C 36 hp diesel, 75 l tank
Performance cruise 6 kts @ .75 gph, max 10 kts @ ?

Exterior features

260W solar panel on cabin rooftop, w/MPPT Controller at helm

Lewmar windlass w/ 15ft chain, 150 ft 3-strand rode, Rocna-type 22 lb anchor on bow roller, spare anchor: 22 lb Lewmar Claw, w/10 ft chain. 100 ft 3 strand rode

Stanchions/life lines removed but available for re-attachment
Bracket on pushpit for dinghy motor, Weaver Davits on swim platform, swim ladder
Full new canvas 2016
LED anchor light

Mechanical

Intake water strainer, Primary (Racor) and Secondary fuel filters, new fuel and water hoses, new thermostat, impeller 2017, fuel tank flushed 2017, new fuel pump 2016

Electrical/ Electronic

2017: entire electrical system replaced, including GC batteries, solar, all new DC wiring throughout, all LED lighting, AC/DC Fridge/Freezer on slider, ProMarine Charger, 15A shore cords
Standard Horizon Radio/DSC, Humminbird Depth Finder, 12V plug at helm, at fridge and at galley

Other

Cookmate alcohol cooktop, Magma BBQ w/rail attachment
Spare bronze prop

 

[RT Firefly]

Thanks.

 

[kkristmann]

I purchased a 1986 Heritage East last year and have been working on it since. We looked for a year and drove all over the east coast looking. If you get the boat at the right price and are willing to do some of the work yourself it can work out. Get a survey and make sure the Hull and engine are in good shape. Keep in mind this is a hard boat to sell so I doubt offers are flowing in. It costing more to keep it than it is possibly worth. Offer under half of asking it is a project boat.

 

[rgano]

Glad to see you have discarded the wreck you first mentioned. Happening looks like a well cared for vessel. Walk her main deck a few times, and if no soft spots, I'd say it was worth a survey/offer.

 

[Sunset]

Dockside scuttlebutt says these owners moved from owning a series of well-cared-for sailboats to this trawler about 5 years ago when the wife was having difficulties with the topside duties on a sailboat. Seems they both were constantly scraping, sanding, varnishing, and generally occupying themselves with meticulous maintenance of the trawler. Of course, up close the gelcoat and fibreglass decking shows signs of age, but the improvements they have made are welcome.

The surveyor quotes $800 to come and do the job, based on the boat being on the hard, and not including engine evaluation, which he suggests should be done by a local contractor. Timing is wagging the dog here, being at season end. The boat will no doubt be pulled out to the yard in due course within weeks, and October 31 is the surveyor.s cutoff date (he wants to prep for his January Andes hike). And I don't have all the required my funds lined up yet. Not without stretching "untouchable" resources based on "expectancies" (like the sale referred to above).

All this to ask the question: would it be offside to request permission to schedule a survey before making an offer (with agreement to share the survey with the Owner)?The survey report will include a valuation, after all. From my POV it makes sense to move forward more confidently with an appraised valuation in hand.

 

[BruceK]

All this to ask the question: would it be offside to request permission to schedule a survey before making an offer (with agreement to share the survey with the Owner)?The survey report will include a valuation, after all. From my POV it makes sense to move forward more confidently with an appraised valuation in hand.

Of course you can ask. At worst they say no.But unless you have the funds available, what`s the point? Especially if you need/want to sell before buying.
As to sharing the survey with the seller,you don`t know if that is in your interests until you read it but by then you already shared it. Plus you lose control of it once someone else has it.