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-   -   Frustration with Brokers (http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s3/frustration-brokers-44884.html)

Seevee 06-02-2019 12:25 PM

Frustration with Brokers
 
Seems like brokers are not getting any better. Yes, there are good ones out there, but they are clearly in the minority.


I've been shopping a bit for another boat. (just sold my Sundancer). I've made several inquiries and not ONE broker has bothered to contact me. NONE. They dont even return phone calls.



Also, most of the ads are grossly incomplete and often with several mistakes.... like indicatating that the boat is a single and a twin in the same ad, or gas and diesel.... Go figure.


As for listing with a broker, same issues. I've had luck with a few over the years, but selling my Sundancer was nothing but frustrating dealing with brokers and very unreasonable terms. So, I just sold it myself, and it sold quick.



Even some of the quality names in brokerages are a pita to deal with. Had one that had a boat that I was very interested in and the guy just would not follow up.



Oh well..... back to dealing with owners, just works better.

Imp 06-02-2019 12:57 PM

Totally understand--going through the same frustrating process. There's another thread here, "Totally dissed by broker," that primarily deals with the difficulties women have encountered trying to buy via brokers. However, there are some broker recommendations there you might find helpful.

Sidclark 06-02-2019 01:12 PM

I'm a broker myself and believe me I go through some of the same frustrations as you do with selling brokers. There are still some of us that answer or return every call, but others that just don't. I have to ask myself how do they sell boats without being responsive to potential clients?? I don't have hours, you call me at 8pm and I'm answering the phone. I just picked up a client who has made an offer with me, but the interesting thing is, the first words out of his mouth when I picked up the phone were, "I can't believe you answered the phone." In a business where communication is key, it's hard to fathom such a lack of it. Having said all that, if you're having issues buying or selling a boat, shoot me a PM and let me see if I can lend a hand. Or, if you just have questions in general about how the buying or selling process should take place, fire away.

Cheers, Sid

ktdtx 06-02-2019 01:23 PM

One of the downsides of a "full employment" economy. Difficult to find good people to work.

Imp 06-02-2019 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ktdtx (Post 770842)
One of the downsides of a "full employment" economy. Difficult to find good people to work.

Nah, it's been going on for decades. Luckily, I had a great broker in Newport Beach CA when I bought & sold there in the 70's & 80's, but spent some time post-retirement writing magazine articles, some on boating, while preparing to go cruising & waiting for my late skipper's retirement clock to run out (luckily we'd planned on following our dream, so he got 20 good years post-retirement). While researching articles interviewed & interfaced with various members of the boating/cruising community, including brokers, & was endlessly amazed by the abundance of ignorance exhibited, not only about boats in general, but sales techniques & practices. Not solely to pick on yacht brokers, I've discovered the same lack of relevant knowledge about money displayed by bankers, & about property displayed by Realtors--& in some important instances, about medicine by physicians. Caveat: always do your own research.

Seevee 06-02-2019 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Imp (Post 770845)
Nah, it's been going on for decades. Luckily, I had a great broker in Newport Beach CA when I bought & sold there in the 70's & 80's, but spent some time post-retirement writing magazine articles, some on boating, while preparing to go cruising & waiting for my late skipper's retirement clock to run out (luckily we'd planned on following our dream, so he got 20 good years post-retirement). While researching articles interviewed & interfaced with various members of the boating/cruising community, including brokers, & was endlessly amazed by the abundance of ignorance exhibited, not only about boats in general, but sales techniques & practices. Not solely to pick on yacht brokers, I've discovered the same lack of relevant knowledge about money displayed by bankers, & about property displayed by Realtors--& in some important instances, about medicine by physicians. Caveat: always do your own research.


Imp,


So true... seems like there's a lot of folks that get into the sales and brokering spots because they perceive it to be an easy way to make a lot of money and don't have to work much. And one can do that, once they have a lot of experience and are extremely organized, but they still have to communicate and give good information which rarely happens. A lot of folks work sales and brokering jobs part time, because they have no investment or overhead to cover every month. A lot of sales people have no offices and just operate out of their car, or affiliate with a marina or other business with not much more than a desk.


Brokerages in the real estate business, used car business, airplane business and RV business are very similar. The big expenses are on the seller.



So, a lot of folks don't take it seriously and think because they've had a boat ride, they're a qualified broker. Just talked to a guy like that..... he finally admitted that he was a used RV salesman and has been in the boat business for 4 months. Do you really want that guy selling your $500K trawler?


Then they have these extremely one sided contracts that they expect you to sign. And then they want to control everything.


Don't think so.


===


The ones I've been happy with have given me everything I've asked for....and if I wasn't satisfied, could bail anytime. And we both did well. But there just aren't a lot of them out there.

Imp 06-02-2019 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seevee (Post 770882)
Imp,
Then they have these extremely one sided contracts that they expect you to sign. And then they want to control everything.

FYI you do not have to sign any pre-printed contract as-is; you are free to add or delete any clause. Just be certain to initial each change. I once saved 2k at Duke Medical with this added clause, "Lab tests not to exceed $200 without prior approval of patient." (I had obtained that estimate of the cost of the recommended tests.) The lab did unauthorized tests once they had my blood. The Billing Dept. billed accordingly. I won, no court necessary because I had a copy of what I had signed, though I did have to spend a lot of time on the phone. A similar phrase on the entrance papers at hospital ER years later saved me another grand+. Note that there are basically no consumer protections in the medical field, so it is especially important to guard your wallet in those environs. When selling or buying a boat, even with a broker, do not fear to read the fine print & safeguard your bank account accordingly--it can mean $aving big bucks. ¡Abre los ojos!

RT Firefly 06-02-2019 06:35 PM

Greetings,
THIS should be required memorization for anyone in sales!


https://www.amazon.com/How-Sell-Anyt.../dp/0743273966

Seevee 06-05-2019 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Imp (Post 770896)
FYI you do not have to sign any pre-printed contract as-is; you are free to add or delete any clause. Just be certain to initial each change. I once saved 2k at Duke Medical with this added clause, "Lab tests not to exceed $200 without prior approval of patient." (I had obtained that estimate of the cost of the recommended tests.) The lab did unauthorized tests once they had my blood. The Billing Dept. billed accordingly. I won, no court necessary because I had a copy of what I had signed, though I did have to spend a lot of time on the phone. A similar phrase on the entrance papers at hospital ER years later saved me another grand+. Note that there are basically no consumer protections in the medical field, so it is especially important to guard your wallet in those environs. When selling or buying a boat, even with a broker, do not fear to read the fine print & safeguard your bank account accordingly--it can mean $aving big bucks. ¡Abre los ojos!


Yes, I do this all the time. I'll modify their form and sometimes I'll mention it and sometimes I won't. I feel the onus is on them to read the form they sign..... I do. Occasionally I'll tell the vendor about my changes if it will have issues that might affect me. Sometimes they accept them and sometimes they wont. And sometimes I'll do business and sometimes I wont.



I wasn't happy with POPs contract and their inflexibility to deal with changes so I just didn't do business. Plus they are not boat experts. Seems like they call other's listings and try to make a deal and their into RVs. I prefer to have an experience boat dealer, not an RV salesman.



I've changed contracts many times... banks, insurance companies, vendors, brokers, etc....and it usually works ok. However, one needs to read the fine print. And sometimes, I'll eliminate that fine print and make a really simple contract.


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