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-   -   Users' Opinions On Various Makes of Engines Needed (http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s6/users-opinions-various-makes-engines-needed-35591.html)

sunchaser 11-15-2017 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tiltrider1 (Post 609864)
The true measurement of an engines life is neither miles nor hours but fuel consumed.

Not in the real recreational marine world. As oft mentioned in this thread (thanks Eric), adherence to proper maintenance trumps all and puzzles most. Throw in wrong prop and running at 80% + load and problems arise in short order.

caltexflanc 11-15-2017 12:01 PM

Quote:

But I have yet to see a boat w a total fuel burned gauge.
Floscans can track that and the gauges for some modern engines can as well. Then of course there's the good old log book.

boathealer 11-15-2017 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baker (Post 609982)
But you have to give them credit for sticking to it and continuing to revise their designs.

Likely just a business decision - probably tens of millions in tooling that was worth fixing up.....;);)

Baker 11-15-2017 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sunchaser (Post 609985)
Not in the real recreational marine world. As oft mentioned in this thread (thanks Eric), adherence to proper maintenance trumps all and puzzles most. Throw in wrong prop and running at 80% + load and problems arise in short order.

80% load....in theory. In actuality, it might be 100% load or even worse!!!

Xsbank 11-15-2017 12:32 PM

Wow, 5 pages. Do you think the OP can make a decision with all this? The engine is just one consideration, pick a boat you like, get it surveyed and live happily ever after.

AusCan 11-15-2017 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benthic2 (Post 609859)
Does anyone think it makes a difference when an engine was made in an engines production run ? What I mean is if "Engine X" was produced for 20 years...does it get refined over time so that one produced in year 20 is much better than one produced in year 1 because the manufacturer addressed the known failures that developed ?

The issues usually get refined as time goes on, but there are exceptions. It is not always a constant improvement.

The Caterpillar 3516's originally were built with wet exhaust manifolds. The wet manifolds were failing after about 5 - 10,000 hours so Caterpillar changed to a dry manifold. The first dry manifolds were a disaster, failing within the first 1000 hours. Eventually these problems were addressed but it took several more years.

BandB 11-15-2017 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baker (Post 609982)
Yes. The Cat 3196 would be a good example. It is a great engine on land. But it had some pretty big issues with the aftercoolers in the marine versions. Class action lawsuits, the whole bit. I think they had 8 iterations of the aftercooler over the span of about 6 years. I honestly do not know if they ever figured it out. At 660hp, not a trawler engine but I was looking at boats with them.

My Cummins also have different iterations. That is why when you buy parts, the first thing they ask for is serial numbers and/or CPL. If they don't ask that question, I would not buy parts from them. The 6B series of engines were not always as highly regarded as they are today. It took Cummins awhile to get it figured out. But you have to give them credit for sticking to it and continuing to revise their designs.

Very good examples. Odd how CAT is the favorite of so many owners and captains, but they've had issues like that a couple of times on new engines. Now, I don't know if they've had more than others or their's just more widely known, largely due to them addressing the issues.

Most new engines today are very mature even with the requirements for new anti-pollution levels. Not many "new" engines, perhaps because the companies have been so involved meeting standards, so I've heard of very few problems. Common rail and turbochargers are now just common, every day characteristics. Now the exceptions have been VW and Mercedes with their recalls and Cummins 6.7 liter in Dodge Rams with water pump bearings that can overheat and lead to fire.

Jbear 11-15-2017 03:04 PM

Well, thanks for the question! Ford Lehman's are the best. Duh.... [emoji23]

Nomad Willy 11-15-2017 03:57 PM

Jbear,

Perkins is better than FL and I replaced my Perkins cause it was old and had a flame thrower type starting heater. Perkins was OK though.

BruceK 11-15-2017 05:33 PM

It`s quite likely some owners keep their old boats because they like their FLs and know they won`t get them or an equivalent(with some exceptions) on newer boats.

Nomad Willy 11-15-2017 05:49 PM

Bruce indeed,
But the cost of replacement is great.
If I had one in a boat and it ran fine, didn’t overheat or smoke too much I’d keep it. No doubt. And if I was looking at old boats editing out the FL’s would severly limit my choices.
I even had one once marinized by Sabre

Jbear 11-15-2017 08:02 PM

My reply was kinda a joke. Most folks are going to like the brand of motors they have or have used...

BandB 11-15-2017 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jbear (Post 610074)
My reply was kinda a joke. Most folks are going to like the brand of motors they have or have used...

And one of the reasons is that most are good. Just like most boats are. There are not many bad boat builders and not many bad engine builders.

BruceK 11-15-2017 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jbear (Post 610074)
My reply was kinda a joke. Most folks are going to like the brand of motors they have or have used...

I know, and of course I have "owner bias". But they and Perkins NAs are great old simple robust engines,long lived, parts available,well suited to displacement speed trawlers, anyone can work on them. Old fashioned, sure, but plenty of positives. Give me 2 identical older boats, one with FLs, one with Volvo 165s, I`ll take the FL version every time.

BandB 11-15-2017 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BruceK (Post 610078)
I know, and of course I have "owner bias". But they and Perkins NAs are great old simple robust engines,long lived, parts available,well suited to displacement speed trawlers, anyone can work on them. Old fashioned, sure, but plenty of positives. Give me 2 identical older boats, one with FLs, one with Volvo 165s, I`ll take the FL version every time.

I'd take the one that had been maintained best and surveyed best.

BruceK 11-15-2017 08:18 PM

In my proposition, they are "2 identical older boats", save for brand of engine. That includes engine condition/maintenance.It`s theoretical, intentionally so. Come on, deal with it. Do you prefer the Volvos?

ghost 11-15-2017 08:34 PM

Engine reliability cant be measured by brand name, hours or even oil change history. Opinions are fun, and so is this thread, but that's as far as it goes.

ghost 11-15-2017 08:36 PM

Except for Volvos. I hate Volvos, because they cost me a lot of money. Those damn dirty Volvos.

BandB 11-15-2017 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BruceK (Post 610081)
In my proposition, they are "2 identical older boats", save for brand of engine. That includes engine condition/maintenance.It`s theoretical, intentionally so. Come on, deal with it. Do you prefer the Volvos?

No....you find two absolutely identical and then your choice is fine. Just I can't imagine two so identical. Where I am, I wouldn't prefer the Volvo's. Now, if I was in certain parts of Europe, I might.

tiltrider1 11-15-2017 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sunchaser (Post 609985)
Not in the real recreational marine world. As oft mentioned in this thread (thanks Eric), adherence to proper maintenance trumps all and puzzles most. Throw in wrong prop and running at 80% + load and problems arise in short order.

You can tell all this the from an hour meter?


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