Type III Head System - no Y-valve

[davegreene99]

Can anyone give me the USCG regulation or EPA regulation which allows Bayliner (Brunswick) to have either a key switch for a macerator which dumps overboard or 2 manual switches which do the same?

 

[ksanders]

Dave

On many Bayliner cruisers (I've had five of them) the waste system does not use a y valve.

A y valve will be used to choose between the deck pump out or the macerator. Another old use of a y valve is to choose between a direct toilet overboard discharge and having the toilet discharge into a holding tank.

On the Bayliners the toilet discharges directly into the holding tank.

There are two outlet fittings on the holding tank. One goes to a macerator which from the factory utilizes two momentary toggle switches to activate, eliminating inadvertent operation.

The other holding tank outlet goes to the deck pump out.

This design eliminates the y valve and is 100% legal. It is certified by the manufacturer as meeting USCG requirements and is placarded as such.

 

[davegreene99]

Kevin:
Thanks.

I also found the citation in a USCG/USPS Vessel Safety Examiner's manual p. 26 which states:
No Discharge Areas: Vessels shall not discharge ...... must be adequately secured while the vessel is in a no-discharge area to prevent any overboard discharge of treated un untreated sewage, such as:
1. Closing the seacock and padlocking...
2. Locking the door to the head...
3. A combination of switches that have to pressed simultaneously or
4. Switches that can only be turned on after inserting a key

Most Bayliners come with #3 or #4.

 

[Edelweiss]

Can anyone give me the USCG regulation or EPA regulation which allows Bayliner (Brunswick) to have either a key switch for a macerator which dumps overboard or 2 manual switches which do the same?

Has to meet CFR 33; part 159, see below. If it is approved system there will be a USCG approval tag on the unit. I have a Microphor type 2 and I had to add a small holding tank to contain the affluent when I'm in a no dump zone, like when I go threw the locks into Lake Washington from Puget Sound. The overboard pump is controlled by a locking on / off switch at the helm, no Y valve.

From USCG webpage:
There are three different types of MSDs that can be certified by the U.S. Coast Guard to meet the requirements in 33 CFR Part 159, each having its own design, certification, and discharge criteria. For more information see 33 CFR 159.53.

Type I is a flow through discharge device that produces effluent having a fecal coliform bacteria count not greater than 1,000 per 100 milliliters and no visible floating solids. This type of device is typically a physical/chemical based system that relies on maceration and chlorination. Type I MSDs are issued a Certificate of Approval.

Type II is a flow through discharge device that produces effluent having a fecal coliform bacteria count not greater than 200 per 100 milliliters and suspended solids not greater than 150 milligrams per liter. This type of device is typically a biological or aerobic digestion based system.

Type III is a device that prevents the overboard discharge of treated or untreated sewage or any waste derived from sewage. This type of device is typically a holding tank and may include other types of technology including incineration, recirculation, and composting.

 

[psneeld]

Kevin:
Thanks.

I also found the citation in a USCG/USPS Vessel Safety Examiner's manual p. 26 which states:
No Discharge Areas: Vessels shall not discharge ...... must be adequately secured while the vessel is in a no-discharge area to prevent any overboard discharge of treated un untreated sewage, such as:
1. Closing the seacock and padlocking...
2. Locking the door to the head...
3. A combination of switches that have to pressed simultaneously or
4. Switches that can only be turned on after inserting a key

Most Bayliners come with #3 or #4.

Seems to be the prevalent way of thinking...although a tie wrap or equivalent meets #1 on the list...except for certain locals that have extraordinary regs...like I hear in places in the Great Lakes...

Of course all it takes is one cranky LEO with a grudge to make it an issue as it's not what is strictly in the CFRs from what is being spread around...(haven't followed up on current CFRs or changes snce last year).

 

[rwidman]

Can anyone give me the USCG regulation or EPA regulation which allows Bayliner (Brunswick) to have either a key switch for a macerator which dumps overboard or 2 manual switches which do the same?

What does this have to do with Bayliners?

My boat has a key switch for the macerator. It's not a Bayliner.

 

[Billylll]

My boat (not a Bayliner) will also have a key switch. Even so it will never discharge anything but treated waste. All untreated waste can only be removed by a pump out. The key activates the H-NT system which controls the Type 1 PuraSan.
Bill

 

[HeadMistress]

Edelweiss cited the wrong part of 33 CFR 159 (159.7 "requirements for vessel operators," is actually the correct citation that describes the accepted methods of "securing" the system), but that's ok. Even though keyed macerator switches are not mentioned in the CFR because they didn't exist when it was written in 1978-79, they're now accepted by the USCG and other law enforcement agencies, provided the key is either kept by the captain of the vessel or locked up in a location to which only the captain has access.

Billy, you might want to explain what the "H-NT" system is...IMO it's the best thing that ever happened to a holding tank on a boat in most coastal waters.
Raritan holdntreat.pdf

Just can't resist jumping in every now and then

 

[ksanders]

The Raritan Hold N Treat system is a controller linking a holding tank, a macerator pump, and a type 1 treatment system.

Heres how it works...



When in automatic mode and, when the holding tank reaches a certain level the hold N treat activates the macerator pump, moving raw sewage into the treatment system and moving treated sewage overboard. Every few minutes the process continues untill the holding tank is empty.

The end result is that no untreated waste is ever discharged. Never, ever.

When in no discharge mode the hold n treat is effectivly off, and no waste is discharged.

The hold n treat can work with any holding tank, and any treatment system.

It can be purchased as part of a kit, including a 15 gallon holding tank, and the treatment system of your choice as well.

We have this setup coupled to a Raritan Purasan treatment system and love it. We put it in automatic mode and forget it. When we pull into a NDZ like a harbor a simple key switch is all it takes to comply with NDZ requirements.

 

[Billylll]

Kevin and Peggy thanks for explaining the H-N-T. I have used one for 6 years along with my existing 36 gallon holding tank. The treatment system I prefer is the PuraSan it draws less current than the LectraSan and many other models. I did one modification that was to get rid of the standard macerater pump and replace it with a SeaLand transfer pump. The SeaLand pump is more reliable and my head already macerates the waste when it enters my holding tank. I keep the key separated and out of the head compartment when in a NDZ. Then the unit acts like a typical holding tank.
I will be installing the same system in my Gulfstar.
Bill

 

[ksanders]

Kevin and Peggy thanks for explaining the H-N-T. I have used one for 6 years along with my existing 36 gallon holding tank. The treatment system I prefer is the PuraSan it draws less current than the LectraSan and many other models. I did one modification that was to get rid of the standard macerater pump and replace it with a SeaLand transfer pump. The SeaLand pump is more reliable and my head already macerates the waste when it enters my holding tank. I keep the key separated and out of the head compartment when in a NDZ. Then the unit acts like a typical holding tank.
I will be installing the same system in my Gulfstar.
Bill

On other boats we have had both the old fashioned lectrasan and the newer electrasan. I like the newer unit better of the two as it has a better diagnostic display.

On our current boat we have the Purasan and love it. We went with the Purasan because we have fresh water Vaccuflush heads.

One thing people do not realized is the hold n treat maximizes the efficiency of the treatment system in that it moves the proper amount of waste through it, minimizing treatment cycles. It also solves the two head issue that all flow through treatment systems face.

I went with Raritans packaged system because the goal was to remove my holding tank. The OEM tank was outboard of the starboard engine effectively blocking access to it. I removed the old tank and installed the hold n treat system in a place that allows full engine access. I may someday want a larger holding tank as our cruising expands but I'll cross that bridge at the time. With the Vaccuflush heads, and two people on board, the 15 gallon tank lasts a couple of days so we're ok in our current cruising grounds which only is a NDZ in the actual harbor.